Don Blackmond
Omono
Are you seeing this in a current photo of the back? I can't seem to find the photo.
For BVF and Rockm...a tree without potential?
- Thread starter Poink88
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Are you seeing this in a current photo of the back? I can't seem to find the photo.
Cadillactaste
Neagari Gal
I had seen one photo of the bolt removed on the back side...on Facebook awhile ago. As mentioned there have been more photos than I had attached shared on Facebook. (One without the bolt) Quite frankly I felt it healed just as nicely as the front when I seen it. But I've asked for a current photo of the back...you can see how well the front looked the back is the same...just minus the bolt.
What I like aside from the taper...was how this process took that side branch and relocated it to make what I picture as an apex. Looking rather natural in my minds eye. I'm curious if that was also his goal?
What I like aside from the taper...was how this process took that side branch and relocated it to make what I picture as an apex. Looking rather natural in my minds eye. I'm curious if that was also his goal?
Ross
Shohin
Cool technique, but it looks like this tree's apex is leaning dramatically forward in a weird way. I'm still not sure of tree's potential, but the technique seems solid.
coh
Imperial Masterpiece
Daygan is absolutely correct. I was going to post similar images but he beat me to it. In the image labeled "FRONT", you can see the residual mark where the bolt was located, just above and to the right of where the first branch on the left is located.
This was confirmed by Dario on facebook. Tree has been rotated about 180 deg between the two pictures.
Chris
What kind of bonsai the tree eventually becomes remains to be seen, but the above statement is completely false.
This was confirmed by Dario on facebook. Tree has been rotated about 180 deg between the two pictures.
Chris
What kind of bonsai the tree eventually becomes remains to be seen, but the above statement is completely false.
M. Frary
Bonsai Godzilla
What I get out of all this is that old Poinky can still create a ruckus.
Hats off to Dario!
Hats off to Dario!
Nybonsai12
Masterpiece
There is one pic on facebook from a year ago that looks like it healed some, or was possibly filled in with something, i'm not positive.
I don't know what the long term image for the tree is, but i actually think with the gap from where it didn't heal completely it could be carved in the middle and possibly give a spooky looking broom style tree. Like with just about all things bonsai, time will tell.
I don't know what the long term image for the tree is, but i actually think with the gap from where it didn't heal completely it could be carved in the middle and possibly give a spooky looking broom style tree. Like with just about all things bonsai, time will tell.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
My comment is not to anyone in specific .
But the success can not even be measured yet!
If anything you agreed CE heals fast and could heal well, I am a little surprised you don't see it working!
I do love Dario's wake, and do find it funny to watch people attempt to swim in it!
He is misunderstood.
That's all that matters first, If one does not understand him, the rest is senseless!
Sorce
I'm the same way so I gotta defend him that's all!
Don Blackmond
Omono
Uh, that's the whole point. All we are doing is assuming it worked or did not work until we see a picture. What is so difficult to understand about that? This is a discussion about nothing until then. I'm surprised you can't understand that.
Don Blackmond
Omono
Ok Sorce, you convinced. The process was smashingly successful. No pictures necessary. I going to follow Dario.
fraser67
Shohin
Here you go peeps.
Now I know why so many leave this site!!
I have to say...I'm disappointed. ..
Way to go Dario!
Don Blackmond
Omono
Finally, something to discuss.
I think it looks promising and will be interesting to see what happens with a couple years of good growth. Don't be disappointed fraser. Now, I'm following Dario out of here.
Eric Group
Masterpiece
I don't get it... Why do people leave this site? Because of differing opinions? If people come to post their pics/ opinions and expect everyone to agree with them and LEAVE/ QUIT if that doesn't happen, They are BABIES and life will steamroll them. A man stands his ground and proves people they are wrong or admits when he was wrong... He doesn't go running away to hide because others don't stroke his ego. I respectfully disagree with your assessment of the situation. Please don't leave because of it!
Oh, and JFTR, I still don't see an image that says "bonsai" to me when I look at this tree. It still just looks like a stump with some twigs growing out of it. Papain, perhaps ten+ years from now a believable taper can be achieved and some awful would healed more! but this will always have some big ugly scars I fear, and will probably never get the kind of believable, smooth transition from the old wood to the new leader that would make it look like a BONSAI instead of a stump with some little branches coming out.
As to whether the technique was a success? Well that is relative to the desired result... Was it a success in that the tree and both sections survived? SURE! It appears as though it was a success! Was it a success in terms of creating a nice Bonsai? Not yet IMO... But, again opinions will vary!
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Nybonsai12
Masterpiece
what was said that offended folks to the point they discussed leaving the forum? Or what was said that one can see why people leave? I'm thinking this is just a misinterpretation of words on a screen and I don't think anyone really meant to offend anyone else.
Eric Group
Masterpiece
Exactly
I think the same could be said of the posts Dario made while he was here that rubbed people the wrong way. He would post things that Basically just were intended to mean "I am trying to find a new way to do something", but the way he worded it, people took his comments to mean something more like "I am brand new at this and I already came up with a better way to do things than all you dummies who have been doing it for 20-30+ years... Because I am so smart I can thumb my nose at CENTURIES of Bonsai practice, remake the art form and do it better than everyone before me"... Or something along those lines, which I am sure we can all understand why that interpretation might run some folks the wrong way. I know he never SAID THOSE EXACT WORDS... Just as I do not feel anybody has truly said anything offensive about him here or anything that should have driven any poster away... But we all know perception is reality! The Internet does not allow for us to convey our messages completely- 90% of communication is non verbal. Voice tone/ inflection, facial expressions, hand/ body movements and positions are absent from written discussions and that leaves all comments open to interpretation without the info we normally use to determine someone's true intent... Maybe we should all step back and try to take things the most positive way possible instead of trying to find something offensive in all the posts we read.
fraser67
Shohin
In my 4 years on this site I've read as many threads involving bickering, insults, accusations and personal attacks as I I have about actual trees.I don't get it... Why do people leave this site? Because of differing opinions? If people come to post their pics/ opinions and expect everyone to agree with them and LEAVE/ QUIT if that doesn't happen, They are BABIES and life will steamroll them. A man stands his ground and proves people they are wrong or admits when he was wrong... He doesn't go running away to hide because others don't stroke his ego. I respectfully disagree with your assessment of the situation. Please don't leave because of it!
Oh, and JFTR, I still don't see an image that says "bonsai" to me when I look at this tree. It still just looks like a stump with some twigs growing out of it. Papain, perhaps ten+ years from now a believable taper can be achieved and some awful would healed more! but this will always have some big ugly scars I fear, and will probably never get the kind of believable, smooth transition from the old wood to the new leader that would make it look like a BONSAI instead of a stump with some little branches coming out.
I'm still here.
I felt a couple people here crossed the line without having all the information...(I'm referring to this thread). I'm not speaking to who ran or why...just saying I understand.
Lastly...I NEVER said it was a bonsai...I never even said that I liked it!
Ross
Shohin
Don don't go! There are too many beginners dominating the conversation here, and we could likely all benefit from your experience. Your trees are huge and awesome!
I agree that it looks like both halves are still alive, so it was a success in that regard. The two parts will never fuse together again, and I'd expect the wood to start to die back and rot pretty quickly as moisture gets trapped in there, slowly widening the "seam." I also wonder if the roots are all still alive underneath the carved section. Regardless of how this particular tree turns out, I do like the idea behind it, and can see it being applied in other, less dramatic ways as well. I seem to remember a guy in China from one of Lindsay Farr's videos using essentially this technique on pine trees to effect severe bends in old wood, using a clamp instead of a bolt. As far as Cedar elm go, the vast majority of them are like telephone poles, and it's nearly impossible to just find one growing with a nice natural taper. However, if Dario had passed on this stump and started with one that was just a little more tapered with a better potential apex, he could have pulled this off more convincingly. I am sure he was out collecting this year too, and I fully expect him to improve this technique on his next couple attempts.
Eric Group
Masterpiece
I never said you said it was Bonsai! LOL
Here we go misunderstanding each other again!
You did say "way to go Dario" though... Does that not imply you like it to some degree? Or were you saying "way to go Dario" as in "way to go... AWAY"??
Eric Group
Masterpiece
I do hope by "out of here", you simply mean out of this thread....?
fraser67
Shohin
Ah well semantics...you had quoted me...so silly me for making the assumption.I never said you said it was Bonsai! LOL
Here we go misunderstanding each other again!
You did say "way to go Dario" though... Does that not imply you like it to some degree? Or were you saying "way to go Dario" as in "way to go... AWAY"??
As for "way to go Dario"...I'm simply saying that. He tried something fairly drastic and aggressive and looks as though it might succeed...certainly to enough of a degree at this point to try again.
Perhaps way down the road, maybe standing at over four feet tall with lots of development, that trunk would actually work, and, I could like it.
As for Dario...I wish him well. I also know that he is, more than not, missed around here
Have a lovely evening!
J
Cadillactaste
Neagari Gal
Wow...Don, I hadn't expected my sharing an update for this thread to turn as it has...not sure if you've left like Dario...or just not coming back to this thread.
I was able to get updated photos of this tree...from different angles. But, at this point I think I'm done with sharing...Though I must say...rotating this tree has an even nicer trunk and I doubt anyone would peg it's beginnings from that first photo. It's actually quite shockingly impressive. Just...am disappointed at how my sharing a method blew up. (But also found ones seeing it was a possibility standing on what I too seen as a successful method. Because I'm seeing this method used more on other groups. So it's not only worked for Dario...but others as well...his just has a longer shelf life if you will...of when he started his.)
As for bonsai...I see many chopping a tree back hard and creating impressive material if one sets their minds to it and let's that tree whisper to them what it's to be. It may take a few years...but I find those progressive threads on such quite impressive. I think of Sam's amazing Bougainvillea stumps...and beg to differ one telling me his creations aren't bonsai. At least in my minds eye they are. They are amazing works of art what he brings forth.
My intention with this particular post is not to cause flares of strife...but...to say...I'm tossing in the towel on this one. I thought ones might gleam something from the updated pictures and maybe just maybe...give someone some creative options for another method to try. Maybe a newbie will come upon it yet and give it a go. If for only that reason...I'm glad I did attach the updated pictures at the beginning of my attempt to update a thread.
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