Looking to buy yamadori

[rockm]

Translated as "taken from the mountain", Yamadori are naturally stunted trees that grew up in places where life is hard, and the tree reflects this. They need not come from a mountain, and not all trees taken from a mountain are yamadori. This word really is meant to refer to trees that reflect the transition of time and hardship.

Gawd not this again. Look, yeah, yamadori LITERALLY means "taken from the mountain" or whatever. Doesn't mean it doesn't apply to other collected trees. Saying that the only way it can be interpreted in western bonsai is restricted to collected trees with "real" character is simply silly, bordering on idiotic. Define "reflects the transition of time and hardship." You can't. It's subjective and relative.

Yamadori is short hand slang for collected trees. Demanding such a narrow definition and qualification is not only snobbish and high handed, it flies in the face of tradition. I

 

[BobbyLane]

Gawd not this again. Look, yeah, yamadori LITERALLY means "taken from the mountain" or whatever. Doesn't mean it doesn't apply to other collected trees. Saying that the only way it can be interpreted in western bonsai is restricted to collected trees with "real" character is simply silly, bordering on idiotic. Define "reflects the transition of time and hardship." You can't. It's subjective and relative.

Yamadori is short hand slang for collected trees. Demanding such a narrow definition and qualification is not only snobbish and high handed, it flies in the face of tradition. I

I get what you mean, its doesnt have to be so strict, there are many trees in forests or even farm land that suffer great hardship, being grazed on by wild animals such as deer and such, I feel these types of trees can definitely be labelled as yamadori, especially when their story or hardships are very evident. The trouble is I think, the term is used too loosely. So I can see why some folk may want to narrow it down a bit, its currently overwatered for lack of better word.

 

[leatherback]

Gawd not this again. Look, yeah, yamadori LITERALLY means "taken from the mountain" or whatever. Doesn't mean it doesn't apply to other collected trees. Saying that the only way it can be interpreted in western bonsai is restricted to collected trees with "real" character is simply silly, bordering on idiotic. Define "reflects the transition of time and hardship." You can't. It's subjective and relative.

Yamadori is short hand slang for collected trees. Demanding such a narrow definition and qualification is not only snobbish and high handed, it flies in the face of tradition. I

I disagree.
THe wish to recreate your own definitions whenever you do not like the meaning of a word is not only childish, it borders on snobbish, and breaks away from bonsai tradition

 

[rockm]

I get what you mean, its doesnt have to be so strict, there are many trees in forests or even farm land that suffer great hardship, being grazed on by wild animals such as deer and such, I feel these types of trees can definitely be labelled as yamadori, especially when their story or hardships are very evident. The trouble is I think, the term is used too loosely. So I can see why some folk may want to narrow it down a bit, its currently overwatered for lack of better word.

Or just accept that yamadori has become slang for collected trees

 

[leatherback]

Or just accept that yamadori has become slang for collected trees

Maybe in your part of the world.
Just accept that not the whole world follows suit whenever concepts are complex.

 

[BobbyLane]

Or just accept that yamadori has become slang for collected trees

Not for me
If youre marketing something as yamadori when its clearly not. Youre only trying to decieve people. The term is used far too loosely and sort of lost its meaning.

 

[FreshAirSunshine]

In the interest of respecting the OPs wish for this thread to die (which I’m guilty of ignoring as well) maybe we can strike up the old debate on one of the other threads for it. I think there was a big one a couple weeks back.

 

[rockm]

I disagree.
THe wish to recreate your own definitions whenever you do not like the meaning of a word is not only childish, it borders on snobbish, and breaks away from bonsai tradition

Kind of what you want to do by deciding that only trees with "character" are eligible for your definition. The yamadori horse left the barn a very long time ago. It did so, despite the impulse to make the word and idea more complex than it needs to be. This argument was a topic two and a half decades ago online. Yamadori, just like bonsai, come in many forms. Want to think of another word for bonsai that don't conform to your ideas?

 

[leatherback]

Bonsai



Koi


Hotdog

And other things where of course you can decide it just includes everything and we do not care about the details to be able to express exactly when we mean when we use the words. Words have meanings, and in some culture, reflect specific sentiments. Refusal to take these into account, waters down the value of words.

Insane that this even is an argument especially from people that should know better.

 

[BobbyLane]

In the interest of respecting the OPs wish for this thread to die (which I’m guilty of ignoring as well) maybe we can strike up the old debate on one of the other threads for it. I think there was a big one a couple weeks back.

If anything we've done the OP a favour. He's looking for yamadori, but not everything being labelled as yamadori, is actually it. Buyer beware

 

[rockm]

View attachment 493493
Bonsai


View attachment 493494
Koi

View attachment 493499
Hotdog

And other things where of course you can decide it just includes everything and we do not care about the details to be able to express exactly when we mean when we use the words. Words have meanings, and in some culture, reflect specific sentiments. Refusal to take these into account, waters down the value of words.

Insane that this even is an argument especially from people that should know better.

Huh? enjoy your yamadori ramen.

 

[Cajunrider]

Or just accept that yamadori has become slang for collected trees

Maybe in your part of the world.
Just accept that not the whole world follows suit whenever concepts are complex.

This reminds me of my argument with my children.
Me: "Irregardless isn't a word."
Children: "But Dad, it's now in Merriam-Webster's dictionary"
Me: *sigh* "I put all you kids through graduate schools and this is what I get?"
Children: "Dad! Your money is gone irregardless!" *laughing*

 

[Dav4]

Well, if nothing else, this thread proves that climate change is the real deal... this sort of "shit storm" thread used to only occur during the winter... .

 

[Cajunrider]

Well, if nothing else, this thread proves that climate change is the real deal... this sort of "shit storm" thread used to only occur during the winter... .

We just got through with all the repotting and now are twiddling our thumbs waiting for the trees to grow. What do you expect?

 

[Dav4]

We just got through with all the repotting and now are twiddling our thumbs waiting for the trees to grow. What do you expect?

If I lived in your climate, I would have already wired and cut back my developing baldies and tridents at least twice by now! Now... get to work!

 

[August]

It's always interesting to see what people are willing to get sour about here. Imagine if people in clubs and at events behaved like this. There would be no community left. So... why here?

Frankly it  is an ego / flex response to respond aggressively to a post that you disagree with. Don't pretend like it isn't. Practice taking a deep breath when you encounter content online that you don't agree with. It doesn't do anyone any favors, to "retort".

 

[FreshAirSunshine]

It's always interesting to see what people are willing to get sour about here. Imagine if people in clubs and at events behaved like this. There would be no community left. So... why here?

Frankly it  is an ego / flex response to respond aggressively to a post that you disagree with. Don't pretend like it isn't. Practice taking a deep breath when you encounter content online that you don't agree with. It doesn't do anyone any favors, to "retort".

Says You!

 

[Srt8madness]

I disagree.
THe wish to recreate your own definitions whenever you do not like the meaning of a word is not only childish, it borders on snobbish, and breaks away from bonsai tradition

This seems to be what you're doing though, if the translation is "taken from the mountain", then anything not from a mountain wouldn't fall within the definition, stunted naturally or not. Adding that it needs to have some requisite level of character or age, is recreating a definition...

 

[rockm]

It's always interesting to see what people are willing to get sour about here. Imagine if people in clubs and at events behaved like this. There would be no community left. So... why here?

Frankly it  is an ego / flex response to respond aggressively to a post that you disagree with. Don't pretend like it isn't. Practice taking a deep breath when you encounter content online that you don't agree with. It doesn't do anyone any favors, to "retort".

"Frankly it  is an ego / flex response to respond aggressively to a post that you disagree with"

Well, it's also kinda fun... and as for the "you'd never talk to the people in your club like that," thing. You're right, even if they really deserve to be talked to that way and their trees really, REALLY blow. Face it there is a bit of honesty in obnoxious responses on the internet that isn't present in person. Granted internet BS goes only so far and is irritating and infuriating, but still....

 

[Cajunrider]

If I lived in your climate, I would have already wired and cut back my developing baldies and tridents at least twice by now! Now... get to work!

Aye aye!

This seems to be what you're doing though, if the translation is "taken from the mountain", then anything not from a mountain wouldn't fall within the definition, stunted naturally or not. Adding that it needs to have some requisite level of character or age, is recreating a definition...

Judging from land elevation, practically nothing from Louisiana can be yamadori. Good thing I never have claimed anything I collect as yamadori.