"Don't let me go to the nursery on my lunch hour" my burning bush

[Andrew Robson]

In bonsai, a trunk is everything. In my opinion, and in many others, it should be the first thing we consider when purchasing a tree.

If this were my material, I probably wouldn't put it in the ground...and I go out of my way not to make mediocre bonsai. This tree doesn't need ground growing. The main structure is there...time for building the fine structure...in a pot.

Sure, you could develop fine branching and ramification in a pot, you could work on the nebari in the right sized pot, you could plant it in a nice pot and have a nice overall aesthetic, but in the end of the day you're lacking the trunk that is keeping this good tree from being a great tree.

 

[Dav4]

Thought about it most of the day (was a slow day at work lol)

Andrew, I appreciate the advice, and if I was younger (49 next month) and had some bonsai under my belt I would possibly follow it.

I think I will be methodical and seek advice. Probably will become an inside joke "Oh great....Metal needs permission to fart again".

So if I cut back, should I leave the roots be? OR Should I work roots and repot into a bonsai pot first? I'm not sure if burning bushes are a "one insult at a time" plant. I do know I will wait until the early spring before tackling either one.

I haven't even mentioned the azalea I am gonna "Geanangel" heheheh

Why am I posting like Sorce?

Must be a smallie angler thing.

If you haven't already done so, clear away the soil around the trunk base to expose the upper roots. Assuming you've got a descent base, I'd plan to cut back the main branches hard while reducing the root-ball by 50% next spring, then planting it in a pond basket or colander. The following spring, you can start really working the roots and getting it into better soil.

 

[Dav4]

In bonsai, a trunk is everything. In my opinion, and in many others, it should be the first thing we consider when purchasing a tree.


Sure, you could develop fine branching and ramification in a pot, you could work on the nebari in the right sized pot, you could plant it in a nice pot and have a nice overall aesthetic, but in the end of the day you're lacking the trunk that is keeping this good tree from being a great tree.

I have a feeling you and I aren't seeing the same thing in this material.

 

[Andrew Robson]

Andrew, I appreciate the advice, and if I was younger (49 next month) and had some bonsai under my belt I would possibly follow it.

So if I cut back, should I leave the roots be? OR Should I work roots and repot into a bonsai pot first? I'm not sure if burning bushes are a "one insult at a time" plant. I do know I will wait until the early spring before tackling either one.

Fair enough. Even though there is nothing special about the trunk, you can still develop good roots and branching over the next several years. In the spring when it starts to push, I would put it in a grow box in good soil to get the roots moving in the right direction. Similar to this one, but perhaps a little deeper. I would also cut it back to a basic structure. Then I would feed it heavily and let it grow without any cutting all growing season. In the fall, access the tree and perhaps wire and cut back some of the long growth.

Here's a tip from Hagedorn: when you're trying to get better nebari, fertilize close to the trunk

Goodluck!

 

[Andrew Robson]

I have a feeling you and I aren't seeing the same thing in this material.

In a quick search, this Japanese Beech is along the lines of what I was thinking for this tree. Notice the nice sized trunk and great nebari! Photo credit: Jonas Dupuich Source: http://bonsaitonight.com/2015/02/03/more-highlights-from-bibs-16th-annual-exhibit/

 

[Dav4]

In a quick search, this Japanese Beech is along the lines of what I was thinking for this tree. Notice the nice sized trunk and great nebari! Photo credit: Jonas Dupuich Source: http://bonsaitonight.com/2015/02/03/more-highlights-from-bibs-16th-annual-exhibit/

Ok, you and I are definitely not seeing the same thing in this material. I was thinking more along the lines of this shohin zelkova...It's Adair's and it's about 8 " tall.

 

[coh]

For $12.5o I'd go back and get another one to plant in the ground. Use this one to learn some bonsai techniques...repotting, pruning, etc.

 

[Metalgrootvader]

Dav4, that is what I see when I look at my new tree!

coh: last one they had! they have some bigger ones and I may go back on payday..or when the girlfriend isn't looking.....

 

[Dav4]

Fwiw, I've got over 50 trees planted out in my yard. My opinion is that if you're going to spend the better part of a decade developing stock in the ground, you should work with material that has a proven record of responding to particular techniques that direct it's growth toward something special. For me, that means growing tridents, palmatums, JRP, JBP and Chinese quince. While I think burning bush can make great subjects, and I've actually seen an outstanding shohin specimen at NEBG a decade ago that this one instantly reminded me of, I'm not sure I'd spend the time to grow it out. Perhaps as an experiment, but I've only got limited time and space, so it's unlikely it would make the cut. Besides, I still feel the trunk is already as developed as you need it to be...my 0.02. Either way, it's good stock and you should have fun with it.

 

[Andrew Robson]

Fwiw, I've got over 50 trees planted out in my yard. My opinion is that if you're going to spend the better part of a decade developing stock in the ground, you should work with material that has a proven record of responding to particular techniques that direct it's growth toward something special. For me, that means growing tridents, palmatums, JRP, JBP and Chinese quince. While I think burning bush can make great subjects, and I've actually seen an outstanding shohin specimen at NEBG a decade ago that this one instantly reminded me of, I'm not sure I'd spend the time to grow it out. Perhaps as an experiment, but I've only got limited time and space, so it's unlikely it would make the cut. Besides, I still feel the trunk is already as developed as you need it to be...my 0.02. Either way, it's good stock and you should have fun with it.

I agree, will be a fun project! Keep us updated on the progress!

 

[Andrew Legg]

Andrew, that Japanese Beech is hardly what I'd call a trunk to aspire to. About it's only redeeming feature is its roots. I agree more with Dav4 in n this one, it could make a lovely delicate broom, and for that one does not need a hulk of a trunk. The real question here is what do the roots look like? That we have not seen, and that's the question we should be asking the OP to show us.

 

[sorce]

Ok, you and I are definitely not seeing the same thing in this material. I was thinking more along the lines of this shohin zelkova...It's Adair's and it's about 8 " tall.View attachment 85894

Oh Adair.!
+5 points for the train set.
-12 points for the vinyl ficus!

I see an image more like a WP maple.

And cutting half the roots off........scares the hell out of me.!

Sorce

 

[Metalgrootvader]

Roots? Look at my profile pic! I'm BALD! oh...not those roots.

Heading to work but will try to reveal them this weekend. Best way to accomplish that without doing any harm this late in the season? Surface roots near the truck or all? I will have to bend a fork.

 

[sorce]

Roots? Look at my profile pic! I'm BALD! oh...not those roots.

Heading to work but will try to reveal them this weekend. Best way to accomplish that without doing any harm this late in the season? Surface roots near the truck or all? I will have to bend a fork.

It's arguable that more than one hook on a root hook destroys roots.

I use a bent bbq skewer. Chopstick good too. Or a bobber with a point top!

I think you could scrape away some surface roots to find the flare now.
It doesn't hurt to refresh the soil surface every fall anyway!

Just be sure to cover It back up afterwards!

Sorce

 

[Dav4]

Cut the rim of the nursery can down to the level of the soil. Then, use your hands or a chop stick, even a hose, to remove the soil from around the trunk to expose the superficial rootage. You're really not doing anything to damage the roots so your tree will be fine.

 

[M. Frary]

Pop it in a colander next spring after rootwork. Little compromise.
Just one colander though.

 

[Metalgrootvader]

Pop it in a colander next spring after rootwork. Little compromise.
Just one colander though.

and then bury the colander....right?

 

[M. Frary]

and then bury the colander....right?

No,no,no,no,no.!
Don't be getting me going on foolishness.

 

[GGB]

After seeing Walter Pall's (maple?) tree thicken so drastically in a bonsai pot I wouldn't be worried about ground growing. The bark will mature while the branches are ramified

 

[Andrew Robson]

It's arguable that more than one hook on a root hook destroys roots.

Who is arguing this? I've used and seen these used on several extremely healthy and expensive trees, and their roots are just fine.