Napa Oil Dry part no. 8822

[Joe Dupre']

Extreme fines could be the fault of shipping and handling. The bottom row of bags under the weight of two pallets on top bumping up and down for 2000 miles could alter the finished product.

I sift mine and get maybe 15% small stuff with little dust. It doesn't seem to break down into sludge (3 years in use so far). I only wish it would be brown or dark gray.

 

[TN_Jim]

I would bet there is a natural way to stain an ancient diatom

 

[Joe Dupre']

I would love to find a way to do that.

 

[Rose Mary]

I would bet there is a natural way to stain an ancient diatom

LMAO!! I think I know where you were here.hahah

 

[Adamantium]

I would bet there is a natural way to stain an ancient diatom

Oh, how I wish there was. It doesn’t seem anyone knows how, at this point, though.

 

[milehigh_7]

Okay folks, just got off the phone with the peeps at EP. NAPA 8822 is a "non-calcined" (not fired) product. That makes it a different beast than Optisorb, Axis or many of the others. Now we can argue about what those differences are! You are welcome!

 

[Adamantium]

Huh....

So, what does that mean for use as bonsai soil?

I did notice I can break wet Optisorb between my fingers, with some pressure. Can you not do that to NAPA 8822?

 

[milehigh_7]

Huh....

So, what does that mean for use as bonsai soil?

Well, one thing for sure is that it breaks down sooner and is not as hard. What I am not sure of without doing more research is what if any the calcining process changes with regard to properties such as CEC, water holding, insect and fungus prevention etc... That's why I said now we can argue about these factors.

 

[Adamantium]

You probably missed my edit. I can actually crush this Optisorb between my fingers when it’s wet. That doesn’t seem like it bodes well.

 

[milehigh_7]

Well, it's full of water! LOL! Stuff's like a sponge it holds it's weight in water. I love Optisorb but it's just not quite big enough.

 

[moke]

I would bet there is a natural way to stain an ancient diatom

I would imagine it could be stained with sumi ink? I have not tried it, but I know it works with sphagnum moss.

 

[milehigh_7]

I would imagine it could be stained with sumi ink? I have not tried it, but I know it works with sphagnum moss.

Does get a bit darker after applying humic acid a few times...

 

[Gary McCarthy]

Okay folks, just got off the phone with the peeps at EP. NAPA 8822 is a "non-calcined" (not fired) product. That makes it a different beast than Optisorb, Axis or many of the others. Now we can argue about what those differences are! You are welcome!

I know one of the characteristics of Akadama that Ryan likes is that it is NOT a fired product. Unfortunately I can't remember now why. I'll have to go back on his stream on soils that he did a few weeks ago. I thinks that's where he mentions it.

Having said that, there are a number of people here that use the NAPA 8822 product. I don't recall any of them mentioning a problem with it breaking down. Maybe the fact that it is not a fired product really doesn't matter.

 

[Wilson]

@Gary McCarthy I also remember Ryan mentioning he prefers the unfired akadama, over the super hard fired akadama.

 

[milehigh_7]

@Gary McCarthy I also remember Ryan mentioning he prefers the unfired akadama, over the super hard fired akadama.

I heard that on that vid as well but the DE that he has been testing (AXIS) is the fired kind...

 

[TN_Jim]

Okay folks, just got off the phone with the peeps at EP. NAPA 8822 is a "non-calcined" (not fired) product. That makes it a different beast than Optisorb, Axis or many of the others. Now we can argue about what those differences are! You are welcome!

To calcinate DE you fire it. This takes the fossilized mostly silicate diatom, and gives the silica a more crystalline structure. It may be harder, but it may be more brittle as well.
I wasn’t aware that natural DE has trace amounts of aluminum too, which may lower pH to some degree over time.
Evidently, fired DE is way more dangerous to creatures. Breathing/consuming powdered glass.. non-calcinated, not so detrimental perhaps.
This may be why @sorce had a worm kicking in a tree with, if I remember right, was in 100% napa DE

just curious thoughts, not damn geochemist

 

[milehigh_7]

To calcinate DE you fire it. T

I kinda already said that...

 

[TN_Jim]

I kinda already said that...

No, Clyde.. you actually didn’t exactly. Still, your findings are appreciated

 

[leatherback]

No, Clyde.. you actually didn’t exactly.

erh...

NAPA 8822 is a "non-calcined" (not fired) product.

 

[Gary McCarthy]

I heard that on that vid as well but the DE that he has been testing (AXIS) is the fired kind...

I'd be curious in hearing from Ryan why he picked the AXIS product for the DE product he's testing. If I'm around for his next Q&A on Thursday I'll try and ask him.