Marc Torppa / Marc Torpa / Mark Torppa / Mark Torpa @ the Growing Grounds - AVOID

Glad to hear...thanks for your report.

Perhaps Marc has improved his shipping procedures. Or perhaps, based on all the "hot air" slung by others, you just got lucky this time.

I don't really care too much what your tree looks like, but you lose credibility when you come on and belittle others (everyone who has had negative experiences with the Growing Grounds) and then don't show the evidence that supports your claim. Personally, I'd rather see the box and packaging that came with the tree but you probably don't have a photo of that.

Anyway, enjoy the tree...

Chris
 
Unlike most of the posts, I did not intend to belittle anyone. Again, the post was to let it be known that I enjoyed dealing with Marc. That is all. Notice I did not make comments such as "cash the check before it bounce". I also did not mention anyone but Marc. Yes, good quality costs money and time. I thought this board was for asking and receiving good information about Bonsai.
 
5th E...you really sound like a troll now.

FYI, you are not helping Marc any (if that is your intent) by what you are doing. ;)
 
5th element said:
This post was not about what my tree looked like..... it was to say that I had a great experience with Marc. If I post a picture that will just lead to you guys making remarks about it. I personally DONT CARE. I am pleased with the tree and I paid for the tree, therefore it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks. I just wanted others to know that I will continue to deal with Marc and was glad that I did not stray away from him because of others experiences.
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I was going to stay out of this one, but really? Your not going to show a picture of the tree. Even after folks have asked. Whoever said a picture of the tree would go a long ways was right. Who cares if it is not a perfectly manicured finished bonsai. If you say the tree is great, show it. Put the haters to rest. This stance of I'm pleased with the tree, and I dont care what you guys think so no picture doesnt make sense. If you truely dont care what others think, show the tree. Im guessing the tree was damaged or something else happened, but you really like Marc so you dont want to bring bad pub his way. Either way your stance brings further questions into whether or not growing grounds is worth the risk.
 
dkraft81 said:
I was going to stay out of this one, but really? Your not going to show a picture of the tree. Even after folks have asked. Whoever said a picture of the tree would go a long ways was right. Who cares if it is not a perfectly manicured finished bonsai. If you say the tree is great, show it. Put the haters to rest. This stance of I'm pleased with the tree, and I dont care what you guys think so no picture doesnt make sense. If you truely dont care what others think, show the tree. Im guessing the tree was damaged or something else happened, but you really like Marc so you dont want to bring bad pub his way. Either way your stance brings further questions into whether or not growing grounds is worth the risk.
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It is beginning to appear as though there is no tree, at least not one like the one mentioned early on in this thread.
 
Dan W. said:
Party at the Nut-house...lol

Anyway, has anyone posted trees they've bought from The Growing Grounds? (I didn't re-read this whole thread, but I skimmed it again and didn't see any pictures.) I keep hearing how amazing these trees are but I have not seen any... At least not that I remember.

I highly doubt that I'll buy any, simply due to the shear number of bad experiences I've heard. Experience, by the way, is not hot air. I'm glad that some of you have had good experiences, but that doesn't change the fact that there are a lot of bad experiences... .and it's not just small petty things either.

Thank you, to those who share their experience on this site... All of you.
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Dan W (and Dav4),

The Arakawa maples you purchased from me came from a tree that came from a tree that came from a tree that came from the Growing Grounds about 10 years ago.

Regards,
Martin
 
Lol! That's awesome. So I have cuttings, from a tree, grown from part of a tree, from The Growing Grounds.

Is your experience with The Growing Grounds good Martin? I have absolutely no experience there good or bad, and the prospect of great material intrigues me. I would just be very reluctant to order anything, with the negative experiences that have been had by others.
 
Dan W. said:
Lol! That's awesome. So I have cuttings, from a tree, grown from part of a tree, from The Growing Grounds.

Is your experience with The Growing Grounds good Martin? I have absolutely no experience there good or bad, and the prospect of great material intrigues me. I would just be very reluctant to order anything, with the negative experiences that have been had by others.
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Dan I would suggest to you (and anybody) that if you want to purchase something from him do so in person. I don't know how good his stuff is anymore. The site itself has not been updated in a long time. Go here to see one of the trees that came from GG:

http://bonsainut.com/forums/showthread.php?11825-First-arakawa-air-layer-removed


The tree was originally bought by Raydomz directly from Growing Grounds and subsequently I bought the tree from him.
 
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Dan W,

If I won the lottery, I would go to the Growing Grounds and buy lots of stuff. That said, I have not purchased anything else from Mark, except the one Arakawa Japanese Maple which eventually gave rise to the cuttings I recently sent to you.

I have never personally had an issue with Mark, he and I get along well enough, although we have not had any interaction in about 7 years. No particular reason, except he is not open except by appointment, I grow or collect my own deciduous trees due to budgetary restrictions and personal enjoyment of the development process, and the lack of Growing Grounds involvement in the local NC bonsai scene.

I knew Mark's Dad, Don, through bonsai, before I knew Mark. Probably before Mark was even interested in bonsai. Don was always kind and accommodating to me, even though I was a beginner and he was already a long time enthusiast. Perhaps my experience with Don made me more open to the uniqueness that is Mark, or maybe I am just easier to get along with than the majority of the bonsai world!

Regards,
Martin
 
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Martin Sweeney said:
Dan W,

If I won the lottery, I would go to the Growing Grounds and buy lots of stuff. That said, I have not purchased anything else from Mark, except the one Arakawa Japanese Maple which eventually gave rise to the cuttings I recently sent to you.

I have never personally had an issue with Mark, he and I get along well enough, although we have not had any interaction in about 7 years. No particular reason, except he is not open accept by appointment, I grow or collect my own deciduous trees due to budgetary restrictions and personal enjoyment of the development process, and the lack of Growing Grounds involvement in the local NC bonsai scene.

I knew Mark's Dad, Don, through bonsai, before I knew Mark. Probably before Mark was even interested in bonsai. Don was always kind and accommodating to me, even though I was a beginner and he was already a long time enthusiast. Perhaps my experience with Don made me more open to the uniqueness that is Mark, or maybe I am just easier to get along with than the majority of the bonsai world!

Regards,
Martin
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I appreciate the information. From what I am hearing from you and the experiences related by others on this forum I get the impression that Marc/Mark tends to be unique and eccentric; two elements that do not go well with a functioning business.
 
The issue isn't really how nice of a guy Marc is/isn't, or whether he has good stock (if current stock is similar to the older stuff on the internet, yes he does), or even whether his prices are reasonable (subject to individual interpretation). It's whether the reports of problems after mail order purchase, i.e. (1) inadequate packing with shipping damage and (2) poor response to said problems, are ongoing issues or have improved in recent years.
 
coh said:
The issue isn't really how nice of a guy Marc is/isn't, or whether he has good stock (if current stock is similar to the older stuff on the internet, yes he does), or even whether his prices are reasonable (subject to individual interpretation). It's whether the reports of problems after mail order purchase, i.e. (1) inadequate packing with shipping damage and (2) poor response to said problems, are ongoing issues or have improved in recent years.
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Which brings up the core argument one more time: Do you do business with someone with a performance record like this one?

Personally I have run into an incident similar to this in another field I am interested in. I used to make musical instruments, specifically Lutes. Lutes are like bonsai in that you cannot go to a local music store and buy one, you generally have to have one made usually by some sort of contracted relationship. There is one Luthier who lives in South America who makes some really fine instruments. However; he is a total flake. One person I know has been waiting for delivery of an instrument going on three years with no word from the builder.

The Growing Grounds reminds me very much of the South American Lute.
 
LMAO, once again another board where people have nothing better to do than argue and hate on others. Look I could care less if you believe me. I was only making a statement about a good experience I had with a vendor. I just thought it was funny that their was a thread saying to stay away from the guy and it turned out to be the best buying experience one could ask for.

Thanks again smoke for putting me in the right direction
 
Vance Wood said:
Which brings up the core argument one more time: Do you do business with someone with a performance record like this one?

Personally I have run into an incident similar to this in another field I am interested in. I used to make musical instruments, specifically Lutes. Lutes are like bonsai in that you cannot go to a local music store and buy one, you generally have to have one made usually by some sort of contracted relationship. There is one Luthier who lives in South America who makes some really fine instruments. However; he is a total flake. One person I know has been waiting for delivery of an instrument going on three years with no word from the builder.

The Growing Grounds reminds me very much of the South American Lute.
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Some of the lute issue may be cultural. In Latin America, they tend to think of time differently, in a way that's very frustrating to us here in the US. It's a much more laid back, "I'll get to it sometime," type of feeling.

The core question is interesting though as his stock looks pretty promising. Is it worth taking a risk? I think I would just call and ask him about it, not in a mean way, but just straightforward. "I'm really interested in your stock, but I've heard these stories. What have you done to change the problem?" Maybe he has learned and is better now.

Generally I believe that everyone deserves a second chance, but that becomes difficult when you're talking about large amounts of cash. :eek:
 
lackhand said:
Some of the lute issue may be cultural. In Latin America, they tend to think of time differently, in a way that's very frustrating to us here in the US. It's a much more laid back, "I'll get to it sometime," type of feeling.

The core question is interesting though as his stock looks pretty promising. Is it worth taking a risk? I think I would just call and ask him about it, not in a mean way, but just straightforward. "I'm really interested in your stock, but I've heard these stories. What have you done to change the problem?" Maybe he has learned and is better now.

Generally I believe that everyone deserves a second chance, but that becomes difficult when you're talking about large amounts of cash. :eek:
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From what I understand from those who have had problems with this guy, he cannot be reached by phone, he either has no phone or refuses to give out the number. I know fifth element is convinced that we are simply haters of this person without reason, and he is as wrong as he is sure we are; so what's the point of arguing with him? (or her)
 
Put it this way, after I decided on what tree I wanted it was only 5 days until the tree was at my front door. Only reason it took 5 days is because I had a hard time choosing from all the good trees he has to offer and I made my decision on a Thursday. He had to wait till the following Monday to ship.
 
So who wants to volunteer to be the next guinea pig and send a $1000 check to Growing Grounds for a tree? Maybe they've put their problems behind them, or maybe 5th got lucky this time.

5th, can you tell us how the tree was packaged? Is it a large tree or a small tree?

Chris
 
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coh said:
So how wants to volunteer to be the next guinea pig and send a $1000 check to Growing Grounds for a tree? Maybe they've put their problems behind them, or maybe 5th got lucky this time.

5th, can you tell us how the tree was packaged? Is it a large tree or a small tree?

Chris
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Not meaning to be overly critical but 5th seems to be reluctant to furnish any information other than how good it is, was, or should have been.
 
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