Imperial Bonsai Fan or not?

[Potawatomi13]

I'm curious to see how many fans there are on here of Imperial sized Bonsai. I'll try to post a couple of pics for example.(wow, I actually did it) These are 2 Ponderosas collected by Randy Knight in about 2007 with Randy. They have not had any training at all.

 

[fredman]

Man oh Man oh Man...this is eye watering stuff.....

 

[leatherback]

Love them. Cannot afford them & my wife would kill me. As would my back

 

[thumblessprimate1]

I want to know how he got them home from the collection site, all the details.

I like bonsai like that but when that big I'd rather make niwaki. Look great as bonsai if I had a castle though.

 

[sorce]

Every thread could use music.

Sorce

 

[M. Frary]

I want to know how he got them home from the collection site, all the details.

Hard work. At least that

Every thread could use music.

Sorce

Too bad rap isn't music.

 

[JudyB]

They are magnificent for certain. I think that in certain settings these trees are needed to command attention as in a palace courtyard or entryway. I draw the line with my own trees with what I can manage, and personally like the intimacy of the larger shohin and the chuchin sizes. These are amazing, but I am drawn towards the smaller trees more. These are almost to landscape size, so the bonsai "feel" is just not there for me.

 

[M. Frary]

I got a couple large pines I'm looking to collect. Jack and scots. To get them out I will use a tree spade. I'll basket and burlap them right there. 4 guys or a loader to put them on a trailer then in a tub they go for at least 2 years.
The way I'll be doing it cuts out the whole glory of I dug it out myself but insures I get the most roots at time of collection. A 36 inch spade gets about 300 lbs of dirt and roots when all burlapped and wet. Heavy even for me. Too heavy to move far. The tubs will be on carts so I can move them around.

 

[Djtommy]

That ponderosa looks very cool, i Would love to have it in my garden (which i dont have) as for bonsai (in a pot), i like big ones but the limit would be where im not able to carry it by myself.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I think they are amazing looking, but the care requirements make them out of my reach. The pots costs $100's of dollars, and just to move the tree requires a team of assistants. I can't imagine the work necessary just to repot one... and the bags of pumice required. Too big of a job for me...

 

[crust]

I got a couple large pines I'm looking to collect. Jack and scots. To get them out I will use a tree spade. I'll basket and burlap them right there. 4 guys or a loader to put them on a trailer then in a tub they go for at least 2 years.
The way I'll be doing it cuts out the whole glory of I dug it out myself but insures I get the most roots at time of collection. A 36 inch spade gets about 300 lbs of dirt and roots when all burlapped and wet. Heavy even for me. Too heavy to move far. The tubs will be on carts so I can move them around.

Based on my experience and monitoring others who have done mega collecting like this(giant rootball/tree spade etc.) I have come to believe it does not work very good with conifers (except yews) with diffuse root systems--compact root systems are different. The scenario ends up being they kind of survive but then just have to be assaulted again and again to reduce the root ball and end up croaking after a lot of expended energy on the part of the plant and owner. I have come to believe the key is to not collect the diffuse root system. Either you use technique to get a compact RS started in the field --then get it into hyper coarse substrate and nurture it like a cutting--or you collect it with trace compact roots and treat it like a cutting right away. The level of effort is huge--the plant must be spectacular to justify this. I also think there is something to be said about not allowing it to freeze the first year or two---this is a big limiter for me--some Europeans have used heat cables to good success to avoid freezing. Western collectors have really figured a lot of this out. Clearly hyper coarse volcanic substrate, mild climate with no early freezing have been key for them. Intense misting systems and green housing have historically worked too but come with a whole litany of issues ( like weaning off mist, disease issues etc.) one must really get the field soil (FS) off if your gong to do this.
I know its been said before but finding trees that are good enough to warrant this level of effort are rare and the very best trees usually have a contained RS anyway. My overall collecting success has risen and become more exciting as I have shifting away from trying to collect giant RS to collecting the smallest RS with the smallest amount of FS and then nurturing it accordingly. To me, a tree spade is only good for quickly getting something out of a yard or open field and back to your home---the giant RS packed in FS has to be dealt with.

 

[crust]

Collectors like RN are making a lot of $ and building up a God-like rep ripping off trees and can justify nabbing these multi-man monsters. They are mind-bendingly cool and I would love to live in the PNW were one can enjoy them and just set them on the ground come winter--but instead I suffer in the land of misery and mediocrity wallowing in a mundane diminishing existence surrounded by dull prairies covered in broken scrub and pervaded by agonizing frozen winds.

 

[BrianBay9]

--but instead I suffer in the land of misery and mediocrity wallowing in a mundane diminishing existence surrounded by dull prairies covered in broken scrub and pervaded by agonizing frozen winds.

Sounds like winter's been here too long already.....

 

[JudyB]

but instead I suffer in the land of misery and mediocrity wallowing in a mundane diminishing existence surrounded by dull prairies covered in broken scrub and pervaded by agonizing frozen winds.

but when I read this, it gives me nothing but a content feeling, couldn't begin to say why...

 

[M. Frary]

Based on my experience and monitoring others who have done mega collecting like this(giant rootball/tree spade etc.) I have come to believe it does not work very good with conifers (except yews) with diffuse root systems--compact root systems are different. The scenario ends up being they kind of survive but then just have to be assaulted again and again to reduce the root ball and end up croaking after a lot of expended energy on the part of the plant and owner. I have come to believe the key is to not collect the diffuse root system. Either you use technique to get a compact RS started in the field --then get it into hyper coarse substrate and nurture it like a cutting--or you collect it with trace compact roots and treat it like a cutting right away. The level of effort is huge--the plant must be spectacular to justify this. I also think there is something to be said about not allowing it to freeze the first year or two---this is a big limiter for me--some Europeans have used heat cables to good success to avoid freezing. Western collectors have really figured a lot of this out. Clearly hyper coarse volcanic substrate, mild climate with no early freezing have been key for them. Intense misting systems and green housing have historically worked too but come with a whole litany of issues ( like weaning off mist, disease issues etc.) one must really get the field soil (FS) off if your gong to do this.
I know its been said before but finding trees that are good enough to warrant this level of effort are rare and the very best trees usually have a contained RS anyway. My overall collecting success has risen and become more exciting as I have shifting away from trying to collect giant RS to collecting the smallest RS with the smallest amount of FS and then nurturing it accordingly. To me, a tree spade is only good for quickly getting something out of a yard or open field and back to your home---the giant RS packed in FS has to be dealt with.

I have to try. I worked at a nursery digging bunches of conifers every year with the spade. I have an idea of what it is going to take.
Plus these will be coming out of sand too. Even less roots.
I have time.

 

[Cypress187]

I saw a website selling garden bonsai for 17k euro, how much would this bring up and how fast?

 

[GroveKeeper]

My red maple probably qualifies. After collecting that monster, I don't see myself working on more that one or two more trees of such size. I can carry a 70 pound tree now but I'm only going to get older. And when the tree is 6 feet tall and has a massive root ball attached to it...

 

[CWTurner]

I got a couple large pines I'm looking to collect

Mike, make sure we get lots of pics on that collection. Sounds cool!
CW

 

[Bunjeh]

I love them, but I always wonder "what is the cut off between Bonsai and Landscaping?" I think I saw someone post once that if it takes more than one person to carry, it's not bonsai. Regardless,..great trees!

 

[leatherback]

I think I saw someone post once that if it takes more than one person to carry, it's not bonsai.

That to me would not be a good cutoff. There are many amazing bonsai that are too heavy to lift by one person. For this one, we needed 3 persons to get it off stage after bonsai europa:

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