Let's see those dwarf Alberta spruce jams

[herzausstahl]

I think our winters here are just as cold. But I believe what gets them is wind. People put them out in the open where they aren't protected from it. They arent like the spruces that grow around here naturally.
Another tree that is supposed to be cold hardy is ginko. But plant one here and it slowly gets smaller every year.

Ive got 3 planted next to my patio about 3 1/2-4' tall. I agree with the wind. A super cold windy winter here & they grown up usually windward side. But usually green back up at least & I'm at least one zone warmer than you are.

 

[0soyoung]

Fiddled with a couple just for the sake of fiddling.

First, weed style.

Second, 'naturalistic'?

I'm in the weeds

 

[sorce]

Fiddled with a couple just for the sake of fiddling.

First, weed style. View attachment 170323

Second, 'naturalistic'? View attachment 170324

I'm in the weeds

These are friggin excellent for styling practice!
More wire!

Sorce

 

[TommyHallahan]

So I posted these for yous on another thread before I discovered this one, sorce has seen them but for those who haven't

 

[TommyHallahan]

So forgive me if this is a stupid question, but are Alberta spruce considered to be "good" bonsai material? I thought the one I posted (above) came pretty good, being the first go at wiring/styling...
Are they "good" Bonsai material in the traditional sense, or are they a commonly used tree to make bonsai?
And are they popular?

 

[James W.]

So forgive me if this is a stupid question, but are Alberta spruce considered to be "good" bonsai material? I thought the one I posted (above) came pretty good, being the first go at wiring/styling...
Are they "good" Bonsai material in the traditional sense, or are they a commonly used tree to make bonsai?
And are they popular?

DAS are generally held in very low regard by the general bonsai community. Considered by many to be entirely unsuitable for bonsai. They are at the very least thoroughly misunderstood.

 

[sorce]

good" Bonsai material

Soon as we figure em out!

I think it's simpler than we think.

Everyone who talks bad about them, talks about how they don't respond well to bonsai techniques....

They are Dwarfs....

So using bonsai techniques on them is unnecessary.

But....I've got them to hold position after wire is removed, they respond well to pruning, and @Giga potted one straight away this spring, and last I checked....it was still ok!

Are there other bonsai techniques?

I am finding the biggest problem to be with following the recommended regular spruce approach with them.

Too much pruning of dwarf growth, besides unnecessary.....
Really takes a toll on them.

I pruned mine too late this spring (later than generally recommended) and the new growth was so insignificant, I could see how repeatedly doing this could kill it.

I am going to begin pruning them, as soon as they show life, or before even, but I won't wait 2 weeks or so as recommended for regular Spruce.

Cut first to proper nexts (forks), before growth, and allow that first spring flush to be what it wholly uses....full size Dwarf shoots.

That's what they need to remain healthy.

Couple few weeks after that growth hardens off and is allowed to rebuild energy....
Spruce don't do anything but store energy and grow roots....

So summer repot all day!

Rain and Wane!

Sorce

 

[miker]

Just bought this one for $3.75 including tax. Not much there, but I will let it grow for a few years and see where it goes.

 

[Rose Mary]

Dwarf Alberta Spruce
I have 6 that I have had a dozen years or so. Nice fat trunks all of them. I have learned a lot from them, they are pretty much just neglected now. Just some pics as they are now. Got bored with them. for sale cheap. lol

 

[sorce]

a rant from elsewhere.....



I am not against Dwarf Alberta (assumption)....
Love em.

But...

I got "suckered" into buying a nice base the other day...
But I ASSumed the bush would have something to cut back to on the inside. It didn't. And I bought mine before they went on sale. Argh.

So now, I will never again stray away from having the whole tree laid out before I buy it.

Gotta identify every branch (more, more branches) that I will use, find every transition, and most importantly, identify anything that will need a lot of growing out..
Small low branches, poorly proportioned transitions, trunks, reverse taper....

Throw it all into the old Bonsai Calculator and if the result is more than 5-7 years out....
Skip it..

Important note...This quick 5-7 year timetable limit is only for Dwarf Alberta.

Since we are still in this stage of finding a way to keep them sustainable as bonsai...I want to get to an image worth sustaining fast.

Don't want to grow one out for 20 years just to find out a finished image is truly unsustainable.

For the record....each year brings me closer to finding the sustainable system to grow these with.

I can see the reasons for the negative connotations about Alberta, but my trees have already proved there is a way around them.

I dont know where this "dwarf" came from. If they are ALL from one mutation, one set of genes...
But I doubt it.

Even if they are all from one mutation, they are not all exactly the same on the inside, and I swear there are at least two different needles (besides the revert back to normal needles), I dont know if this is age or a different mutation, but either way different is going to act different, health different.

If it is age....the younger ones have thicker needles, with early pruned second flush shoots that have even thicker(yet shorter) needles.

Thats three different solar panels to somehow miraculously know the energy capacity of.

No no....it wont be a miracle, the facts only need to be taken into account before we dismiss a tree as no good for bonsai.

Different on the inside?

In hedgerows, every year, the same tree throws shoots of reverted to regular Alberta. And the others do not.
I understand the others may at some point, or may have, but for x years, it remains the same.

Are the reverters stronger? Weaker?
reverting remains an unread sign.

I'm not one to go looking for specific answers to these scientific mutation questions....
But I WILL use the lack of information to know my Dwarf Alberta IS Not your Dwarf Alberta.
And even if it is....it may like my yard better!

Copy and paste to the jammer thread!

Sorce

 

[sorce]

View attachment 172302 View attachment 172302 View attachment 172302 View attachment 172304 Dwarf Alberta Spruce
I have 6 that I have had a dozen years or so. Nice fat trunks all of them. I have learned a lot from them, they are pretty much just neglected now. Just some pics as they are now. Got bored with them. for sale cheap. lol

Best benches ever!

Twelve years eh? Ha! Nice!

And neglected for a few even? Nicer!

Thanks for sharing these!

What's your secret?

Sorce

 

[LanceMac10]

Rip it to shreds today!!!! @Soldano666

 

[Soldano666]

View attachment 172584

Rip it to shreds today!!!! @Soldano666

Thanks buddy I've been quite sauced up since Xmas, can't stop yet... 2 more days of this shit and then i gotta dry out

 

[Wilson]

Happy birthday @Soldano666 ! My daughter is 10 today! You get the holiday bender birthday, good times!

 

[sorce]

Maybe Ill stop by a few depots and find a Berta to slay.

You know...

In celebration.

Sorce

 

[Soldano666]

Maybe Ill stop by a few depots and find a Berta to slay.

You know...

In celebration.

Sorce

Tis the season

 

[Rose Mary]

Best benches ever!

Twelve years eh? Ha! Nice!

And neglected for a few even? Nicer!

Thanks for sharing these!

What's your secret?

Sorce

My success? lol. No secrets. Chopped hard and they just keep going. They do want to do the Alberta triangle at the end of branches and tops. I just keep cutting them back. The last couple years havent done much and you can see the triangle ends. They do great in colander and pond baskets and dont seem to care one way or the other when they are worked on or repotted. Had several in short bonsai pots but put them back in colanders. Easier to keep watered. I have too many trees. I use bark nuggets, oil dry, red pumice and some ocean forest potting soil and use it for everything. Drains great and promotes fine roots. I slightly adjust size of pumice and bark nuggets (sift) for smaller trees but am getting away from the mame and small shohin. Just too much work to keep up in the hot dry times. These albertas are like sumo. squat and fat. Will see if I can find pics when they were being cared for better.

Benches, lol yep these were domino pizza dough trays. I put them there (albertas) to get photos of them together. Not very good at capturing on camera. In the summer I use them all over as drip and humidity trays, it really helps with watering. I also use a kids blue pool up on a table and lots of dish pans, short dish pans etc. Most of my trees are in colanders or pond baskets. Some of my larger doug fir and hemlock are in drawers while dwarfing and developing roots.
I have some I collected that are just too heavy, what was I thinking?! Have a half dozen big fir that I need to rehome. They are healthy, growing and need styled. Anyone in the pacific northwest looking for some yamadori?
Usually stuff gets set into beds in their colanders or baskets for the winter altho with the size I have now most would be fine to remain on their benches except in an unusually cold freezing spell. Havent tucked anything in yet this year. 58 degrees today and hardly any freezing nites so far.
Happy New Year!
Rose
SW Oregon

 

[sorce]

My success

that was way more info than expected!

Excellent!

Thank you Kindly.

Sorce

 

[Tidal Bonsai]

Another victim!

 

[Tidal Bonsai]

All done! It was supposed to be taller with more foliage up top. I didn't notice a giant clump of branches all coming from one area before I bought it, so I had to Jin the top. Not bad for $5, let's see if it makes it?!?!