Thoughts on Peter Chan? (Herons Bonsai)

[erich_raudebaugh]

My first book was Bonsai Masterclass.He is a Bonsai Master.
I guess it is up to one another to make their own decisions,I think his Bonsai masterpieces ,dedication and long spanned career should,in my opinion ,speak for itself.
Gotta’ love him

Mine too, it was the only decent book I could find in local bookstores. That was when I started in 1990. He clearly knows what he is doing, but not every tree that he works on in his videos is supposed to be a prize winning world class bonsai. His hedge-pruning method that he never labels as such is close to Walter Pall's, and it obviously works for him.
My quibble with his videos, which I do enjoy, is there's not much review of design principals or wiring, he just hacks away. If you've ever helped at a large bonsai nursery, though, that's what you need to do to get through thousands of plants.

 

[Arlithrien]

I got into bonsai because of Peter Chan. Someone mentioned his channel in another website and it sent me down the rabbit hole. He is by far my favorite bonsai YouTube channel.

His videos are short and informative, geared towards a casual audience. He also gives off a certain air of wisdom. He fits the look and demeanor of a bonsai master. He regularly refers to trees that he has worked on for 40-50 years and I really admire that. I don't really care about styling an endgame nebari as much as growing an ordinary tree over a lifetime to create something extraordinary. I also like his self-taught approach.

One last thing I really like about Peter is that he has a personal YouTube account where he answers YouTube comments in just about every video. He is all around a very wholesome old man.

Nigel is a nice guy as well. I watch his videos. But they can be slow paced. I like that he has a tree of just about every species you can imagine, but I have a hard time watching videos that aren't relevant to trees that I have.

 

[erich_raudebaugh]

I watch both of the guys, each one has his stronger and weaker points,

Peter - He is i think around 80 years old, he has a lot of expirience, but i guess his show trees prime time is gone, as someone else said, he went more for commercial aspect now, no time to focus on couple fo trees. i watch all his videos and aleways find some good advice or something to think about. There is no single doubt about what he is doing, he has done in the past and worked for him, the only aspect i dont like - he is mainly working on maples. He really loves nature and trees, you should see his face being around that massive old Yew tree, you can see passion and love. He has done a lot for bonsai world, he should be treated with respect.

Nigel - i think his my favorite guy to watch, i guess he is the only person that is honest and shows/talk the trees that died on him, ive never seen anyone else saying/showing trees that didnt make it. He has a knowlege and expirience, he know how to pass it on, his natural behavior and the way he talks makes him really pleasant to watch. Also i like to see his work and involvment in community work etc, he is very excited to do it also.
I cant stand the vidoes that are looking like from hollywood productions, it looks fake and artificial to me and mostly they will work on very old refined trees that needs more likely only more ramification and maybe repotting, dont get me wrong its interesting to watch but thats not im looking for. I like Nigels vidoes simply because he shows trees in different stage of growth, did you see anyone else planting seeds ? He has advice on each stage of growth and uses clip and grow which is very intersting too, its natural way.

Anyway that was me

Think twice before you do the same what was on the video

Nigel seems like a nice enough guy, and he uses accessible material, but he doesn't have much of a design sense. I wonder if he doesn't know how to wire, because most of his trees could benefit from it.
If you like free videos (who doesn't) with accessible material, check out Peter Warren, and with reasonable but maybe more expensive material, Harry Harrison and Graham Potter. All three are professionals who are very knowledgeable. Nigel appears to know what he's talking about, but sometimes I think he gives bad advice (like on soils).

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Interesting threas and responses. Thank you for starting it.

I must admit I really enjoy watching Peter Chan’s videos and reading his books and have learned quite a bit from him. His recent videos are longer, more informative than the earlier ones. He actually made this change based upon his viewer’s input on how to make his presentations. Lately the COVID19 fiasco has had him resort to filming on his own, which as anyone who films on there own for and instructional video, resulting in a less then perfect presentation.

Since I was laid up for a year after a car wreck I spent a good deal of time watching multiple people present bonsai techniques, reading many bonsai books (my wife teases me on having over “50 bonsai dusty old bonsai books”, some over 60 years old.) , taking many courses and watching others in person.

Being an educator myself, I can say that Peter is really good at conveying his life’s work in an enthusiastic way to his viewers, encouraging the novices to want to try more sophisticated techniques. Peter isn’t afraid of showing flaws in his trees while also showing viewers how to fix them, or avoid them totally. But make no mistake about it, Peter is a master at bonsai.

I’ve also watched and listened to Nigel, Ryan, Walter, Morton, Mauro, Harry, Bjorn, Michael, Peter, and many other practitioners. I like them all, I especially Peter’s plainspoken way of delivering information and Bjorn’s and Morton’s etc...

All the folks I’ve watched and read have something valuable to convey and each has his own way of presenting and each has their flaws. Its up to each student to learn how to translate this information in a way that they can better themselves ....or tune into someone else.

That’s what self education is all about.

Cheers
DSD sends

 

[roberthu]

I have watched a lot of his videos too. And to me, he is clearly skilled and experienced. But he also does it for a living and like many others have already stated, he has so much materials that it’s impossible for him to refine every single one of them. A lot of times he will show how to make a commercial “bonsai” with some twist and it’s nothing different from what you find from imports from China.
However, when he gets his hands on a material that’s worth working on, he shows his true capability and really brings the potential out of the trees.
Job vs. Hobby I guess.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

It seems that I'm not a Chinese scholar after all.
I want to say a lot of other things, but I think the sentence above is sufficient.

 

[Vance Wood]

It seems that I'm not a Chinese scholar after all.
I want to say a lot of other things, but I think the sentence above is sufficient.

If I had done a bonsai like this I would have been banned from the site. Is this OK? Yeah I suppose so but this is not the direction I would have sent a beginner down.

 

[Joe Dupre']

Vance, I think you may have overlooked the fact that the tree came to him in a pretty sorry state to begin with. Not much you can do with sub=-standard material. Peter also had to do something that would hopefully please the client. Is it a top-quality , show ready bonsai. Absolutely not, in my opinion. Is it a fair output for the situation at hand. I would have to say yes.

 

[keri-wms]

I can see the client’s tree side of the argument....but then again I wouldn't share something I wasn’t proud of on youtube! The maple energy-balancing pruning was probably the best video of his that I’ve seen though, although the “why” wasn’t very clear.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Fair enough Keri-wms, that works for you as a bonsai person.
However as an experienced educator myself, who's taught in many situations to many different folks and ages, that's the whole point. Learning from the imperfect.
I've often found myself demonstrating on less than perfect materials and in situations that aren't ideal.... sometimes on purpose. Over the years I've found if all you show learners is the ideal situation and use the very best materials in every situation; that's all that learners... especially novices... know how to do and use. Then when they find themselves in a new or less than perfect situation its hard for them to adapt and react meaningfully.
Kudos on looking for the better things too!
Cheers
DSD sends

 

[Vance Wood]

Fair enough Keri-wms, that works for you as a bonsai person.
However as an experienced educator myself, who's taught in many situations to many different folks and ages, that's the whole point. Learning from the imperfect.
I've often found myself demonstrating on less than perfect materials and in situations that aren't ideal.... sometimes on purpose. Over the years I've found if all you show learners is the ideal situation and use the very best materials in every situation; that's all that learners... especially novices... know how to do and use. Then when they find themselves in a new or less than perfect situation its hard for them to adapt and react meaningfully.
Kudos on looking for the better things too!
Cheers
DSD sends

I understand, those of you who have responded are making excuses for Mr. Chan, not wanting to mention anything derogatory toward him. I don't want anything derogatory about him either, but you wouldn't let anyone else get away with this.

Why do you guys (generic) put up a question on this site then argue the results? If you did not want the truth then why ask for it? The truth, as I see it, is after all just my opinion.

 

[Tieball]

I think Nigel tries to help others and has a lot of help videos posted in that direction. He has the trees to prove that he knows what he is doing IMO. I'm sure he's not perfect according to others, but I'm glad his videos are out there.

I totally enjoy Nigel's videos. I like his practical approach and his candid decision making at the moment conversation style. I find his commentary engaging. Very much like me. I like that he doesn’t have to own every tool to get the job done. And, that hair just cracks me up....not in any critical way...it is who he is.

 

[BonjourBonsai]

I recognize Peter Chan's mastery, expertise and experience. I enjoy learning from his videos. I hope to meet him one day and take a class in person. Two things would make his videos immeasurably more valuable to me would be 1. to always include the date so the viewer can have an idea of when the work was done on the tree and 2. Make follow up videos on the trees to see how they have progressed. Thank you Mr. Chan for your videos and your sharing your life's work.

 

[amcoffeegirl]

He may have been able to make other choices with that material if it was his. In trying to respect the client wishes he did what he could. That is my opinion.
I wouldn’t have chosen a smaller pot at that moment. I do understand why he didn’t want to use the rectangle after the design change.
My wishes would have been to give it a little more room to increase vigor.

 

[Tieball]

Does a lot of age and little accomplishment qualify?

I hope so...I’m well underway toward that qualification.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Hmm... no offense intended on my part to anyone here. I agree, that is the beauty of having your own opinion, its yours and correct from your point of view.
As far as the back and forth, that IMO is just the way post discussions go, (including on this site it seems) swaying back and forth, gathering information, exploring nooks and crannies of information and a securing a variety of opinions. I too find it sometimes frustrating, but I also find it enlightening.
However one of the things I've gained while reading for 6 months before joining and since then, is a healthy respect for the vast pool of bonsai knowledge swirling around this site, including from yourself.
Cheers
DSD sends

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

I understand, those of you who have responded are making excuses for Mr. Chan, not wanting to mention anything derogatory toward him. I don't want anything derogatory about him either, but you wouldn't let anyone else get away with this.

Why do you guys (generic) put up a question on this site then argue the results? If you did not want the truth then why ask for it? The truth, as I see it, is after all just my opinion.

Hmm... no offense intended on my part to anyone here. I agree, that is the beauty of having your own opinion, its yours and correct from your point of view.
As far as the back and forth, that IMO is just the way post discussions go, (including on this site it seems) swaying back and forth, gathering information, exploring nooks and crannies of information and a securing a variety of opinions. I too find it sometimes frustrating, but I also find it enlightening.
However one of the things I've gained while reading for 6 months before joining and since then, is a healthy respect for the vast pool of bonsai knowledge swirling around this site, including from yourself.
Cheers
DSD sends

 

[bluecat]

I've visited Heron's a couple of times on the hunt of cheap material. Each time, I've come away with alot of young material for a decent price (£5-15 per tree).
His contributions to the UK/World Bonsai scene are pretty incredible and as many have said, running a business that specialises in creating material for beginners will always mean his time per tree is quite low. I watch a few of the japanese youtube videos and the things they do to young junipers might get some objections here but again, they do it very rapidly and very often so its cost effective for their business.

I've thoroughly enjoyed Peter's videos over the years because of his enthusiasm and knowledge. Even if I don't agree with the final styling, there'll be something I learn from each video. His key message of bonsai being accessible is also a refreshing alternative to the highly focused, formal Mirai streams that span 40-120 minutes and feel like a university lecture on often expensive material (his intro to bonsai tree would have cost about £70-200). I'm still very thankful for the generous knowledge Mirai shares for free.

Peter Warren's series of live streams during lockdown have been a nice relaxed option to learn bonsai in more depth and the atmosphere feels more friendly and inviting (perhaps I just find British people more relaxing ).

I recognize Peter Chan's mastery, expertise and experience. I enjoy learning from his videos. I hope to meet him one day and take a class in person. Two things would make his videos immeasurably more valuable to me would be 1. to always include the date so the viewer can have an idea of when the work was done on the tree and 2. Make follow up videos on the trees to see how they have progressed. Thank you Mr. Chan for your videos and your sharing your life's work.

1. Peter usually states the date at the start of his videos but its perhaps less common for workshop videos.
2. Lots of the trees are done to be sold so aren't revsited. There are some that he'll show during walks through his greenhouses.

 

[Adair M]

I can appreciate Chan’s efforts to bring bonsai to the masses. But sometimes, the things he does are just stupid. For example, in one video he goes on about how he doesn’t use a spray head on his hose he uses for watering. He just uses his thumb to create a spray at the end of the hose. That’s false economy! A spray nozzle is what? $10? Sure, you can spend more, I use the Masakuni ones, and they’re a LOT more, but I use them twice a day! And with them, I never accidentally wash all the soil out of the pot. I mean, I can understand if he were to say, “you don’t need expensive Masakuni spray heads, just get one that makes a fine spray”. After all, a large part of being successful at doing bonsai is watering correctly. But, no, he says to use your thumb which can make the spray very inconsistent. To me, it just makes good sense to spend a little something on a tool you use everyday, sometimes twice a day!

 

[rollwithak]

I like his videos, but I take his advice with a grain of salt. He does things that I wouldn't do, like put sick trees in 100% sphagnum. But I guess they work for him, so I dont judge.

Chan is pretty matter fact when it comes to putting sick trees in sphagnum moss. He’s been doing it for many years, experience is hard to negate. With respect, why do you disagree with this approach?