Results of Joshua New Talent Contest !
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Brian Van Fleet
Pretty Fly for a Bonsai Guy
Stacy, very well done...nice balance and airy feel.
Clearly I miss-picked which was yours!
Clearly I miss-picked which was yours!
MACH5
Imperial Masterpiece
Congrats Stacy on a great job! It must be very difficult to execute under the time pressure. I appreciate what you did!
I picked 5 as the best simply on the basis of its design concept from where it started. Its movement with the jin work creates an energetic image executed with bravado. Clearly it needs refinement work but great basic structure.
I think yours looks refined and well executed. I think for me it was a very close second. I wish yours had a bit more of that movement and energy. It feels a bit contrived and stiff. Regardless great job! Congrats again!
I picked 5 as the best simply on the basis of its design concept from where it started. Its movement with the jin work creates an energetic image executed with bravado. Clearly it needs refinement work but great basic structure.
I think yours looks refined and well executed. I think for me it was a very close second. I wish yours had a bit more of that movement and energy. It feels a bit contrived and stiff. Regardless great job! Congrats again!
ghues
Omono
Who were the judges?
ChrisV
Shohin
To start this might seem as a bit of a negative post but it actually isn't.. 
Just pointing some things out.
I think judging these things is very difficult.
Judges have to look at the end result, the work done, techniques used, branch placement, design and future development of the tree etc etc.
They all have flaws and all have really good things.
However Imo this contest was about styling bonsai in a certain amount of time and who had the most finished tree.
Not looking to much at future development.
That bothers me.
First off all I don't think there should be any competitions in bonsai at all as it is an art form were everyone says patience is the pace we should have.
I've entered one myself and didn't like the concept at all.
Second with the time pressure in these events people tend to overwork trees and health is put second place because the judges want to see end results.
In Europe they use to do it like this too, but too many work was done and trees didn't survive. That is not how you create bonsai so they chanced the rules.
Shari's, bends and pruning are ok but not at the same time because the tree simply won't have enough energy to recover both and grow etc when shari's are placed random.
It needs to have time to redirect their live veins.
As for bending it is really stressful for a tree and sucks up a lot of energy repairing all the little cracks made in the proces.
And there is also no balancing of the roots and foliage as they can't be repotted at that time.
In a lot of cases it will die back later certain areas and gone is the image the tree was judged on.
Also I need to add that looking at the time given I really think the results (not all of them) could have been much better.
I saw it was from morning till evening? That is a lot of time.
In that amount of time all trees should be detail wired like the 3th one.
So I think judging should definitely be done with future development in mind, because bonsai is all about working towards a long term goal and healthy trees. And as they say it is never finished.
A new talent shouldn't be judged on what he/she can do with a tree in a couple of hours, but what one can do with it in a couple of years than you really can judge someones skill.
However still I think you guys did a great job!
Just pointing some things out.
I think judging these things is very difficult.
Judges have to look at the end result, the work done, techniques used, branch placement, design and future development of the tree etc etc.
They all have flaws and all have really good things.
However Imo this contest was about styling bonsai in a certain amount of time and who had the most finished tree.
Not looking to much at future development.
That bothers me.
First off all I don't think there should be any competitions in bonsai at all as it is an art form were everyone says patience is the pace we should have.
I've entered one myself and didn't like the concept at all.
Second with the time pressure in these events people tend to overwork trees and health is put second place because the judges want to see end results.
In Europe they use to do it like this too, but too many work was done and trees didn't survive. That is not how you create bonsai so they chanced the rules.
Shari's, bends and pruning are ok but not at the same time because the tree simply won't have enough energy to recover both and grow etc when shari's are placed random.
It needs to have time to redirect their live veins.
As for bending it is really stressful for a tree and sucks up a lot of energy repairing all the little cracks made in the proces.
And there is also no balancing of the roots and foliage as they can't be repotted at that time.
In a lot of cases it will die back later certain areas and gone is the image the tree was judged on.
Also I need to add that looking at the time given I really think the results (not all of them) could have been much better.
I saw it was from morning till evening? That is a lot of time.
In that amount of time all trees should be detail wired like the 3th one.
So I think judging should definitely be done with future development in mind, because bonsai is all about working towards a long term goal and healthy trees. And as they say it is never finished.
A new talent shouldn't be judged on what he/she can do with a tree in a couple of hours, but what one can do with it in a couple of years than you really can judge someones skill.
However still I think you guys did a great job!
ChrisV
Shohin
Hmmm Politics... nah leave that to the pro's
But I just wanted to say this because I think it's rather important for beginning people to have a good start and understand that bonsai takes time and can't be made in one day.
When I entered our competition reactions were oh so that is how it works etc. from people just starting out.
That is why and because I think in general new talent competitions because they are there, can be much better and more long term so you can really judge a someones talent.
Not just by a quick creative idea.
But I just wanted to say this because I think it's rather important for beginning people to have a good start and understand that bonsai takes time and can't be made in one day.
When I entered our competition reactions were oh so that is how it works etc. from people just starting out.
That is why and because I think in general new talent competitions because they are there, can be much better and more long term so you can really judge a someones talent.
Not just by a quick creative idea.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
You snapped.
The judges must have just been jealous of that hat!
Sorce
The judges must have just been jealous of that hat!
Sorce
Cadillactaste
Neagari Gal
I think...everyone was a winner! To have been chosen an honor in itself. All had good points...some stuck out more than others...but, a lot had to deal with structure of what one was working with. Stacy...you defiantly showed a great display of wiring on yours.
Bonsai Nut
Nuttier than your average Nut
Late comer to this thread... but I liked 2, 3 and 5. It is hard to evaluate these trees because I know how you can run out of time and not accomplish everything you wanted. They are all a little unkempt and bushy - not because of the skills of the stylists but because of the time required to do detail work. Additionally, you don't always want to do all the work in one go - if you think it might overstress the tree. Better to do half now and let it rest for a year if you are doing a ton of stressful work.
Bonsai Nut
Nuttier than your average Nut
I guessed at Stacy's tree and got it right... because of the wiring You can't fully wire a tree like that (especially with time constraints) unless you have a lot of experience.
You can't fully wire a tree like that (especially with time constraints) unless you have a lot of experience.
Poink88
Imperial Masterpiece
I am getting a lot of comments regarding how I have styled my tree, that for some it
looks contrived, un-natural and even stiff... Although I appreciate the responses, I would
ask that those who have raised these views to do a google image search, of cascading
bonsai... Where one will find, that just about every other image has a similar or almost
exact branch structure, with curving / bent branches and placement.
The design I have chosen as well as how I have done the styling is in fact a very common
approach and a very natural occurrence. So, I am not sure how these views are correct.
This is not to try and be insulting, but to rather understand how I am incorrect. So, perhaps
further elaborating is needed. Thanks
Stacey,
For me, the tree was "undecided" whether it wants to be a semi-cascade or informal upright. I know you have to work with what you got but if it was to be a semi-cascade maybe (just maybe) you should have tilted it more to the left? Maybe reduce the top? I don't know, but those threw the image off for me.
For an informal upright, the almost vertical downward branch at the left threw the image off for me also. Maybe that portion could have been eliminated.
As everyone said, you did good (everyone did) with the time you have.
Vance Wood
Lord Mugo
By the way it's good to see you posting again.
Gene Deci
Shohin
Some time ago I went to a major juried art show when on a visit to the east coast to visit relatives. It was all high quality work but I thought a portrait and a landscape really stood out. They were both done in a classical style. The great majority of the paintings were impressionistic or abstract as were all of the prize winners.
On the way out the receptionist asked me, “What did you think of our show?”
I said, “I thought it was excellent but none of the paintings I liked won a prize.”
“That just goes to show you don’t know much about art.” she said.
Well, that is true enough. But that whole episode has given me an appreciation for People’s Choice awards. In bonsai, as well as other art forms, they very seldom agree with the judge’s choices. I wonder about that. In any case, I think a work of art that has broad public appeal ought to get more respect. In a way, isn’t that what art is all about?
Victrinia Ridgeway
Omono
The competition was amazing... The guys were awesome! We all had a memorable time for sure. I can appreciate everyone's perspective except for the gent who thinks we could have done more with the time we had... that's not true. Most of us took almost no breaks other than biological. I thought that the time we had was obscene until I saw the material. I quickly found out it wasn't. I managed my time from the perspective of showing my talents and skill set in the working of the dead wood. Stacy did his (brilliantly) in wiring. Ryan did his in large branch movement. That, in my opinion, is why those three trees stand out as having a strong image. We three each concentrated on those talents which are most innate to us.
If we had had the time to patiently bring out those things which are not most innate to us, the end results would had been spectacular on those three trees especially.
I GOT the tree I wanted.... I don't regret that at all... I would have enjoyed seeing what I could do with the others, but I was seduced by the deadwood and rot that was obviously in that base. I damaged almost no live bark in the creation of that sculpture. I surely would have enjoyed having a muscly trunk... but I'm happy with what I got and what I did. I made my friends, family, and teacher proud... made some amazing new friends... and that's winning enough for me.
V
If we had had the time to patiently bring out those things which are not most innate to us, the end results would had been spectacular on those three trees especially.
I GOT the tree I wanted.... I don't regret that at all... I would have enjoyed seeing what I could do with the others, but I was seduced by the deadwood and rot that was obviously in that base. I damaged almost no live bark in the creation of that sculpture. I surely would have enjoyed having a muscly trunk... but I'm happy with what I got and what I did. I made my friends, family, and teacher proud... made some amazing new friends... and that's winning enough for me.
V
Victrinia Ridgeway
Omono
Stacy...
If someone said your tree was contrived... they are idiotic. I'd like to see them tackle what we did.
Always at your back,
V
If someone said your tree was contrived... they are idiotic. I'd like to see them tackle what we did.
Always at your back,
V
Dav4
Drop Branch Murphy
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The competition was amazing... The guys were awesome! We all had a memorable time for sure. I can appreciate everyone's perspective except for the gent who thinks we could have done more with the time we had... that's not true. Most of us took almost no breaks other than biological. I thought that the time we had was obscene until I saw the material. I quickly found out it wasn't. I managed my time from the perspective of showing my talents and skill set in the working of the dead wood. Stacy did his (brilliantly) in wiring. Ryan did his in large branch movement. That, in my opinion, is why those three trees stand out as having a strong image. We three each concentrated on those talents which are most innate to us.
If we had had the time to patiently bring out those things which are not most innate to us, the end results would had been spectacular on those three trees especially.
I GOT the tree I wanted.... I don't regret that at all... I would have enjoyed seeing what I could do with the others, but I was seduced by the deadwood and rot that was obviously in that base. I damaged almost no live bark in the creation of that sculpture. I surely would have enjoyed having a muscly trunk... but I'm happy with what I got and what I did. I made my friends, family, and teacher proud... made some amazing new friends... and that's winning enough for me.
V
Vic, I have to admit that when I evaluated the pictures presented here, I didn't focus on the deadwood of each tree, but the image as a whole. With that in mind, I'm sure if I had seen these trees in person, it would have been a different story. In fact, if I had only seen pictures of the deadwood, I'm sure I would have picked your tree out from the bunch
....you worked the deadwood like a pro. By the way, how much of the work was done with power tools...I assume a fair amount?
MACH5
Imperial Masterpiece
Hi Vic. Indeed I was the one that did. No worries I'll be sure to keep my idiotic comments to myself next time. It is only one man's opinion and that is all. Once again congrats to you all!
Victrinia Ridgeway
Omono
Vic, I have to admit that when I evaluated the pictures presented here, I didn't focus on the deadwood of each tree, but the image as a whole. With that in mind, I'm sure if I had seen these trees in person, it would have been a different story. In fact, if I had only seen pictures of the deadwood, I'm sure I would have picked your tree out from the bunch
Considering this is what I started with:
I have to admit it was largely power tools... with torch and wire brush... I would have liked to have had more time to make it better... but alas it was not to be. Time was moving, and I had none to spare for fine level detail.
What these photos fail to do is convey the scale of them... as raw material, they were daunting... and thrilling... all at the same time.
V
coh
Imperial Masterpiece
Every so often I think, maybe some day I'd like to participate in one of these. But seeing the raw stock you had there...I realize I'm nowhere near ready.
Wish there was a way to standardize the starting stock a bit more so everyone was on more equal footing at the beginning.
Wish there was a way to standardize the starting stock a bit more so everyone was on more equal footing at the beginning.
Victrinia Ridgeway
Omono
Well hell.... don't listen to me for God's sake. lol
I apologize, truly... it was a knee jerk reaction to a word I generally regard as insulting, to someone whom I have recently gone through a protracted stressful event with. I feel very protective of all of them.
I can't agree with your opinion in regards to that particular descriptive, but I ought not to have added a slander to it, that was poorly done by me.
Humbly,
V
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