Multiple issues with this JBP including long second flush. Is it the heat?

[Brian Van Fleet]

Correct.

Pretty sure you won’t want to summer candle-cut a Kotobuki, but in the fall, it needs to be pruned back pretty hard to get some back-budding. Repeated pruning over a few years will increase the density and allow you to compact the design around that big fat base.

 

[dacoontz]

Is this one a ‘Kotobuki’?

Any additional thoughts guys and gals on this one? BVF, does it really just come down to pruning back to the most inside buds? I’m reading various opinions on needle plucking as well. Should old needles be left? Is that where new budding will come from because I didn’t think that was the case.

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Any additional thoughts guys and gals on this one? BVF, does it really just come down to pruning back to the most inside buds? I’m reading various opinions on needle plucking as well. Should old needles be left? Is that where new budding will come from because I didn’t think that was the case.

Caveat, I don’t have a Kotobuki. But if it behaves like other JBP, yes, it is a matter of chasing back to the inside buds in early fall. I wouldn’t pull any needles at this point…leave everything close to the trunk to increase chances of back-budding.

 

[River's Edge]

Any additional thoughts guys and gals on this one? BVF, does it really just come down to pruning back to the most inside buds? I’m reading various opinions on needle plucking as well. Should old needles be left? Is that where new budding will come from because I didn’t think that was the case.

Back budding can occur in two circumstances, needle buds at the base of old needles, and adventitious buds from bare areas!
needle thinning can be of value if it improves the exposure to light which also promotes stronger back budding. however it can also reduce the opportunity for additional buds. When needles are removed it is wise to remove needles on the bottom of the branch or top of the branch. this leaves better exposure to the branch and a higher likely hood that buds will form on the sides. This is generally considered a more desirable outcome for side branches to develop. retaining sufficient needles for healthy growth is another factor to consider. I typically advise that needles should be removed if the area is congested or they are in poor health. Otherwise the additional photosynthesis just promotes a healthier tree and stronger response to pruning.
Pruning back is the key factor to trigger a response. Another factor is taking the time to wire the branch in a slightly downward position after pruning, and wiring out shoots to open the area to more sun exposure. fertilization in late summer, early fall helps tp prepare the tree for winter and a stronger response in the spring.
Just some additional details to the advice you have already received.

 

[dacoontz]

Ok experts, here’s the tree now. Looks like it’s got plenty of vigor. Still just let it be???

The last pic is the Kitobuki that I also mentioned. It seems to be staying about as is. Not sure if I am missing out on something here to get it to be anything but stagnant.

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Ok experts, here’s the tree now. Looks like it’s got plenty of vigor. Still just let it be???

The last pic is the Kitobuki that I also mentioned. It seems to be staying about as is. Not sure if I am missing out on something here to get it to be anything but stagnant.

Yep, let it be for a few more weeks. In late September you can reduce every cluster of shoots that grew this summer down to a pair, you can pull old needles, and wire branches. The name of the game is balance. Notice how strong the top is and how much weaker the bottom is? It’s very pronounced in the photos, so use them as your guide. You want to leave as much as you can on the lower branches, and reduce the growth of the upper branches until all branches appear to have roughly the same volume of needles. Keep feeding it for now. You’re doing a good job of keeping them healthy.

You’ll know it’s safe to work on the tree when the new needles stay attached to the tree when you give them a good tug.

And your Kotobuki is growing…compare the last couple photos to see that. Bonsai progress is measured in years, not weeks. Keep at it and this can become a really cool progression thread of two pines in a few years. Most people destroy their first few attempts at pines, me included.

 

[WNC Bonsai]

Since we’ve started down this rabbit hole here are a couple of questions. If you cut back the second flush candles that are now extending how far back should/can you cut? I know that with the first flush candles if they are cut back to just above the node then you will likely get multiple new buds that form the second flush candles. So I am assuming the same is true for fall cutbacks except of course they will form in the fall/winter period and push next spring. But what if you cut back to before the last node? Will that generate backbuds on the remaining internode?

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

But what if you cut back to before the last node? Will that generate backbuds on the remaining internode?

Look at this example. I labeled each years’ growth for the past 3 growing seasons. Forget for this discussion it is a Kotobuki.

The ‘19 growth has no needles left now. If you cut back to anywhere in that ‘19 area, the branch will likely die.

If you cut back into anywhere along the ‘20 growth shoot, leaving some needles, it is likely next spring the tree will set adventitious buds from the fasicle between needle pairs on one or more of the needle pairs. These will be weak, and look spindly and blue/gray for a year, but they will strengthen if they live. If the tree is strong, it may also set a stronger bud at the top of the cut that next growing season.

If you cut into the ‘21 shoot, it is more likely to set strong buds at the cut for next year. It may also set some adventitious buds in the ‘21 and ‘20 shoots, possibly also at the base of the ‘21 shoot.

 

[dacoontz]

Mr Van Fleet, you da man. Thank you much for your wisdom. My trees thank you more.