D
Trees stolen again... I'm done
- Thread starter Kahless
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Vince Sartain
Seedling
The problem with your figures are that what is considered a crime today is nothing like what was considered a crime years ago. Heck, here in California you don't even get stopped for walking out a store for anything under a $950. They don't even attempt to stop you let alone call the cops! So, the numbers mean nothing now.
Bonsai Nut
Nuttier than your average Nut
Ah.. but perhaps not.
Where there is a need - there is always a business opportunity. I cannot imagine we cannot come up some sort of improved solution. Security cameras are a start. Tracking devices are a start. Motion-activated spotlights... motion-activated sprinklers... motion-activated sirens.
Believe it or not, I live on a three mile road with only one access point. The police have a camera on a pole at that point that records all traffic entering and leaving - with a license plate scanner. They will get a real-time flag for anyone with stolen plates - or for that matter any vehicle that has their license plate number blocked with an overlay, etc. It is surprising the number of car thieves they have caught in our community who were just "passing through" and decided to stop for lunch. If a crime is committed on our road - particularly a crime late at night - the police will have a short list of license plates to review...
Glaucus
Omono
Not true. And you know it.
If you want to believe that actually 5 times more people get murdered than reported in the official statistics because most of those murders don't get reported when they would have in 1992 'because the police are useless 99.9% of the time' then go ahead and stay delusional.
Yes, every bike stolen and every shoplifting doesn't get reported. But neither did that happen in 1960s. You think that if someone robbed a bag of coffee from the town's only convenience store in some rural town in Alabama or Wyoming back in 1963, that theft would show up if I google for theft crime in 1960s right now? No way that crime got reported back then. You think that this shop owner would consider reporting that crime a Tuesday in August 1963 just so that we in June 2024 on some bonsai internet forum, we would actually have the correct crime statistic?. Back then people had no idea crime was even being recorded. Or that you should repot petty crime. They would just solve it inside their own community. Or pretent it didn't happen.
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BrightsideB
Omono
This is a shame. These thief’s look opportunistic. As a former steel fabricator I built many fences and pedestrian gates due to concerns such as this. The term thrown around was honest criminals. They don’t plan or go over and beyond to steal. All they had to do was walk up towards the door and grab the tree’s. Most are like this. They won’t cut/pick locks
BrightsideB
Omono
I know someone who lived between two streets and a lot people cut through the property to get to the other street. It is trespassing. Once they put signs that said no trespassing nobody would cut through the property. If they put a camera up I don’t think that would of got the point across.
Bonsai Nut
Nuttier than your average Nut
I live on a lake. When we first moved here we had people who would pull their boats up on our beach and picnic. We would have to walk down and ask them to leave... private property, liability concerns, etc. So we put a couple of no-trespassing signs down there and haven't had a problem since. But you have to ask... why? Particularly because we live less than 1/2 mile from the state park that has tons of beaches and inlets for people to pull their boats into.
BrightsideB
Omono
@Bonsai Nut same with the person I know. When they moved there they were really uncomfortable with the amount of traffic going through the property. The house was vacant for a while so I figure that’s why. In your case I’d assume the same or that people just saw a less trafficked spot to hang out. I kayak on a lake with homes and everyone has signs.
I think for the op if he can only have tree’s in the front yard there should be a barrier. Sadly it’s what will prevent the usual type of thieves out. I couldn’t count the amount of times I built fences and gates to keep people of private property. Wooden fences don’t have the same effect as well. They actually provide cover. And easy to jump.
Also a less expensive approach could be screening trees like Hollie’s to prevent random people from seeing the tree’s from the street. That with extending the railing height with steel pickets and a simple picket gate with a lock. Not allowing the trees be seen from public property with a barrier would make most think it’s not worth the hassle or even know the tree’s are there. These guys were obviously opportunistic.
I think for the op if he can only have tree’s in the front yard there should be a barrier. Sadly it’s what will prevent the usual type of thieves out. I couldn’t count the amount of times I built fences and gates to keep people of private property. Wooden fences don’t have the same effect as well. They actually provide cover. And easy to jump.
Also a less expensive approach could be screening trees like Hollie’s to prevent random people from seeing the tree’s from the street. That with extending the railing height with steel pickets and a simple picket gate with a lock. Not allowing the trees be seen from public property with a barrier would make most think it’s not worth the hassle or even know the tree’s are there. These guys were obviously opportunistic.
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
Security cameras, locked gates, higher fences, motion detector lighting, GPS tracking are all viable solutions to prevent theft. Some are expensive and not worth it to protect a $40 tree. I've thought about putting signs up in my back yard (out of sight from the street, visible only if you're IN my yard that say "all trees are geotagged, have ID chips and smile you're on camera!" That sign alone might give some thieves pause. Any time bonsai are visible to the public they're in danger of being stolen. Line of sight from a street or sidewalk is unfortunately an invitation to walk off with one.
I have my trees behind a high fence locked gate. They're not visible from the street and I don't talk about them other than with people I've known for years.
Barbells and bonsai
Mame
Bait trees with an air tag, if they are stealing bonsai I’d bet they wouldn’t know the difference between trees of value and those that aren’t. Sorry to see this and I hope you both get your trees back and are able to hold the nerds who stole them accountable
ShadyStump
Imperial Masterpiece
I meant the guns part of the discussion specifically. It was vering towards the outside of "helpful." Just trying to prevent the derailing of someone's thread who isn't here to give the ok at the moment.
Cajunrider
Imperial Masterpiece
'We're throwing the book at criminals': O.C. aims anti-crime campaign at surrounding areas
Using bumper stickers, billboards and advertisements on public buses, Orange County prosecutors this month launched a public safety campaign aimed at deterring people from committing crimes there.
www.latimes.com
My friends now fly in and out of Santa Ana strictly to avoid having anything to do with Los Angeles.
I saw similar situations in other parts of CA as well. San Francisco is horrible but near by cities are OK.
99 Mile Creek
Mame
What I was thinking. There is a tattoo on the left wrist of the second man. The police should be able to run frequent fliers against his description and that tattoo alone.
But I'm sorry to hear that this happened. This is sickening.
Along with other suggestions, maybe keep them wired down. I do it for storms, but this might also prove as another deterrent/obstacle to overcome getting to those trees. I say anything to slow them down in order to catch them in the act or have them panic and run is a win.
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Vince Sartain
Seedling
I live here in California. Born and raised here 61 years in the same location. I know exactly what I'm talking about. It is true and I know it. I'm not talking 1960 numbers! I'm talking 2014. 10 years ago.
Glaucus
Omono
There's polls that ask people if they were a victim of crime. Those polls show the same trend. The theory that people underreport crimes to the police and that's why crime looks like it came done, is debunked. Crime is actually down. People who do this type of research for a job aren't stupid. They check for all ways that their data may not be accurate.
With all due respect, your anecdotes or personal experience are worth zero. That's now how we know crime is up or down.
With all due respect, your anecdotes or personal experience are worth zero. That's now how we know crime is up or down.
Vince Sartain
Seedling
You can live in your lala land if you want but you can ask anyone living here and they will tell you that crime is up. I'm sure we're all a bunch of liars in your head but we live here. I suppose next your going to tell me that illegal immigration is down as well!
Glaucus
Omono
I even showed the graph where people like you claim crime is up by a lot when it is actually down by a lot. You are 'proof' that that graph I provided is also correct.
Do you also need the graph where GOP voters completely switch their opinion on the economy in the 3 months after Trump left office and Biden became president?
That's what is going on.
Illegal immigration went down a lot because of covid. Which happened during Trump's presidency. That's also why inflation went up after covid ended. And why the deficit went up under Trump.
Illegal immigration went up as the pandemic wound up UNDER TRUMP. And Trump's policies made it go up while Biden was president. It is now up by a lot. But Trump started it and Biden didn't change it. maybe because of what Trump said. Namely that he wants chaos to be at the border. Which is why he made Maga Mike Johson torpedo the the bipartisan border deal in congress. So there would be chaos at the border and he Trump can campaign on it.
Do you also need the graph where GOP voters completely switch their opinion on the economy in the 3 months after Trump left office and Biden became president?
That's what is going on.
Illegal immigration went down a lot because of covid. Which happened during Trump's presidency. That's also why inflation went up after covid ended. And why the deficit went up under Trump.
Illegal immigration went up as the pandemic wound up UNDER TRUMP. And Trump's policies made it go up while Biden was president. It is now up by a lot. But Trump started it and Biden didn't change it. maybe because of what Trump said. Namely that he wants chaos to be at the border. Which is why he made Maga Mike Johson torpedo the the bipartisan border deal in congress. So there would be chaos at the border and he Trump can campaign on it.
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Vince Sartain
Seedling
Look, this is not the place for this type of conversation. I think you would agree that if I tried to tell you what was really going on in the Netherlands you would dismiss what I had to say, as you should.
Glaucus
Omono
If we were talking about crime rate here in the Netherlands, and I living here was just saying what I feel like the crime rate is. And you, not having been in the Netherlands ever before, would give me sourced data from the actual government agency. Then I'd be just as wrong as you are wrong now.
You came here and bumped that thread to tell us all your feeling about what the crime rate is actually matters. That's on you.
Then you start talking about illegal immigration. Which is not a good topic to go to for you.
What do you want me to say? I visit the US once and I didn't see any crime. Or illegal immigrants. What I did see in the NYC metro was a hipster with expensive shoes, a fancy watch, with an iPod in yelling at me because he didn't pull his feet in and I tried to pull my suitcase into the metro wagon. And I pulled the suitcase over his toes, just barely. And he was really annoyed by that. He was leaning backwards, resting his back against the wall of the wagon, which meant his feet were planted more forward, pointing his feet into where people would walk. And he was annoyed and yelled at me. Because an annoying tourist, the bane of NYC residents, pulled the wheel of a suitcase across his fancy hipster shoes. Can a late 20s Yuppie not travel from New Jersey to his Manhattan office job in peace? Without being harassed by European tourists? Who are way too tall and athletic to actually stand up to?
So can I say now that NYC has a rude rich hipster problem which is underreported and a pressing election issue. Because I am speaking now from my own experience. Which gives me this feeling. And feelings can never be wrong, right?
You came here and bumped that thread to tell us all your feeling about what the crime rate is actually matters. That's on you.
Then you start talking about illegal immigration. Which is not a good topic to go to for you.
What do you want me to say? I visit the US once and I didn't see any crime. Or illegal immigrants. What I did see in the NYC metro was a hipster with expensive shoes, a fancy watch, with an iPod in yelling at me because he didn't pull his feet in and I tried to pull my suitcase into the metro wagon. And I pulled the suitcase over his toes, just barely. And he was really annoyed by that. He was leaning backwards, resting his back against the wall of the wagon, which meant his feet were planted more forward, pointing his feet into where people would walk. And he was annoyed and yelled at me. Because an annoying tourist, the bane of NYC residents, pulled the wheel of a suitcase across his fancy hipster shoes. Can a late 20s Yuppie not travel from New Jersey to his Manhattan office job in peace? Without being harassed by European tourists? Who are way too tall and athletic to actually stand up to?
So can I say now that NYC has a rude rich hipster problem which is underreported and a pressing election issue. Because I am speaking now from my own experience. Which gives me this feeling. And feelings can never be wrong, right?
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ralfish
Sapling
So in an attempt to perhaps get this thread back on track in terms of usefulness for all in this international community, I have bought air tags (after upgrading my phone from android to apple because air tags are cheaper in Canada but still 4 of them cost me close to $120 CAD, not inc the waterproof cases and also a 360 field of view camera (https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B0BW2CYQZJ?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1 ) and 512 GB memory card. None of my bonsai plants are visible from the street but a recent theft has left me concerned especially because the local donut eaters did zero. I chose the 1080p over the 2k camera as it comes in at about half the price (I'm on a super tight budget) and I feel having the extra definition more or less useless in my specific context (ie no need for reading license plates for example) plus the memory card should last longer before its full. The camera also has a high rating but who knows how useful these ratings actually are. I absolutely hate having to spend so much of my meager disability pension that is already woefully inadequate especially knowing the donut eaters will do nothing should theft happen again. Im hoping this all acts as a deterrent more than anything. It maybe useful for others contemplating security measures to mention what camera you've chosen and your experience with it. Same with airtags vs the android version and how functional they actually are.
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