Thuja Occidentalis “Degroots Spire

[Hartinez]

Finally took pics of the first 2 that I styled back in early May. Both $10. I brutalized both. Reducing root mass on 1 by 60% plus and the 2nd- 25% plus. I’ve lost several branches on the first but it’s still alive and growing. Only lost a couple small branches on the second, but I missed a great opportunity to create a long Jin where the originally trunk was emanating past the apex. I carved that section as a means to make it a bit more convincing. It’s more of a twin trunk Literati at this point. I’ll probably remove the top pads of foliage at some point as well. Both need to just grow and survive the winter.

First


Second

 

[Hartinez]

Hey @mattspiniken . Here’s the thread. I’ve been taken with Thuja this year and in particular this variety “Degroots spire”. Such small fronds and foliage.

My question is how you deal with the fronds in collected thuja? I know I’ve read it’s difficult to keep the “pads” tidy, but why specifically is that? I’ve got my foliage laid out as I would a juniper or pine. Horizontal. But the foliage on nursery thuja I see tends to fill in more horizontally. Now with this variety, the foliage seems to be more like Hinoki cypress in its randomness, vertical, horizontal etc. do you think trying to maintain that flat horizontal appearance is futile? Or should I allow the foliage to do its thing and trim the fronds much differently than most other waxy.evegreen? Any tips would be great! Thanks!

 

[mattspinniken]

Hey @mattspiniken . Here’s the thread. I’ve been taken with Thuja this year and in particular this variety “Degroots spire”. Such small fronds and foliage.

My question is how you deal with the fronds in collected thuja? I know I’ve read it’s difficult to keep the “pads” tidy, but why specifically is that? I’ve got my foliage laid out as I would a juniper or pine. Horizontal. But the foliage on nursery thuja I see tends to fill in more horizontally. Now with this variety, the foliage seems to be more like Hinoki cypress in its randomness, vertical, horizontal etc. do you think trying to maintain that flat horizontal appearance is futile? Or should I allow the foliage to do its thing and trim the fronds much differently than most other waxy.evegreen? Any tips would be great! Thanks!

That smaller frond size is really nice on yours, I think your doing well with them so far. Let me see if I can help at all. I have found Thuja a real joy and I like them more and more.

First off they are definitely more work than Pines. I do try and maintain a flat frond, done through a combination of wiring and pruning. The natural ones back bud a lot at the crotches when healthy. Once the trees are really healthy I start cutting out and back all the leggy and weak stuff, I think that’s important.

There is a strong leader on all branches that need to be kept cut back to encourage the branch further back instead of just at the tip. This strong leader is different and more tubular. Natural Thuja will ramify and thicken up quickly. They love fert and sun. To show how quickly they can thicken etc the before pic below is 2016 after is 2019.

 

[Hartinez]

Looks good, nice work!

Thanks!

 

[Hartinez]

That smaller frond size is really nice on yours, I think your doing well with them so far. Let me see if I can help at all. I have found Thuja a real joy and I like them more and more.

First off they are definitely more work than Pines. I do try and maintain a flat frond, done through a combination of wiring and pruning. The natural ones back bud a lot at the crotches when healthy. Once the trees are really healthy I start cutting out and back all the leggy and weak stuff, I think that’s important.

There is a strong leader on all branches that need to be kept cut back to encourage the branch further back instead of just at the tip. This strong leader is different and more tubular. Natural Thuja will ramify and thicken up quickly. They love fert and sun. Before pic below is 2016 after is 2019.
View attachment 255559
View attachment 255561

Yeah I love this Thuja you posted. ABS award winner at a recent show right??

Mine have back budded at the crotch significantly as well and have mostly grown from the tips at this point, some stronger than others. I’ll def work at a Flatish pad over time. And as these fill in I’ll tag you a bit more as questions arise.

Heres the growth on these. And that great frond size!

Thanks for taking the time!

 

[Jiminsauga]

Hey Hartinez, how are these holding up two years in after the initial work? I just discovered this variety myself and wanted to see if you would still recommend the same level of work in the middle of July or otherwise.

 

[Hartinez]

Hey Hartinez, how are these holding up two years in after the initial work? I just discovered this variety myself and wanted to see if you would still recommend the same level of work in the middle of July or otherwise.

Did not hold up at all. They all died within the first year. I would work them entirely different now. Too much too soon on every one. If I can find nice nursery specimen of this variety again, I will def give them another try.

 

[Jiminsauga]

Did not hold up at all. They all died within the first year. I would work them entirely different now. Too much too soon on every one. If I can find nice nursery specimen of this variety again, I will def give them another try.

Thanks for the quick reply. Sorry to hear that you lost them. You had a great eye for styling them. I never would of seen the third styling in that bush, so hopefully you find another in the bargain bin one day.

 

[mattspinniken]

Since this was brought up and I see how bushy my Cedar looks above I thought I would post one of it from a few weeks ago. It honestly needs a few hours of wiring to really look its best but in my opinion it is coming along well. You can also see that I shortened the spire.

 

[Hartinez]

Since this was brought up and I see how bushy my Cedar looks above I thought I would post one of it from a few weeks ago. It honestly needs a few hours of wiring to really look its best but in my opinion it is coming along well. You can also see that I shortened the spire.

View attachment 386491

This is just a lovely tree Matt. It’s beginning to get so well refined. I wonder though, as it is in this pic, do you think the pot feels a bit too heavy for the tree? I could almost see it go in to an oval of sorts to soften the bottom load a bit.

 

[mattspinniken]

This is just a lovely tree Matt. It’s beginning to get so well refined. I wonder though, as it is in this pic, do you think the pot feels a bit too heavy for the tree? I could almost see it go in to an oval of sorts to soften the bottom load a bit.

Hmm maybe an oval would be better. I really think the tree needs a different pot. I was also considering a stone of some type if I could find one. Im open to any ideas on the pot.

 

[Jiminsauga]

View attachment 386491

Did you lime sulphur that post in the background? Between 2019 and now it's gotten awfully white lol.

Great looking thuja, glad it's growing strong.

 

[pandacular]

Did not hold up at all. They all died within the first year. I would work them entirely different now. Too much too soon on every one. If I can find nice nursery specimen of this variety again, I will def give them another try.

Hey Danny, forgive me for digging up an old thread with some less than awesome memories, but I'm hoping to learn from the demise of these trees.

I have a Thuja occidentalis 'IslPrim' that I pruned and styled in September. I removed a pretty significant amount of foliage, but mostly left the top untouched as a sacrificial leader. Given the scope of work here, would you hold off on repotting this tree in the spring if it were yours?

 

[Hartinez]

Hey Danny, forgive me for digging up an old thread with some less than awesome memories, but I'm hoping to learn from the demise of these trees.

I have a Thuja occidentalis 'IslPrim' that I pruned and styled in September. I removed a pretty significant amount of foliage, but mostly left the top untouched as a sacrificial leader. Given the scope of work here, would you hold off on repotting this tree in the spring if it were yours?

When did you do the work? I think it depends on how it responds come spring. Though a repot, raking out field soil with little root removal may work just fine. Considering my failure rate though, I dont know if any of my advice is valid with Thuja

 

[pandacular]

This was done in late September, so it hasn’t had much time at all to respond. One plan I had thought about was doing a late summer/fall repot with very little root pruning if and only if the spring growth is strong.