Minimum Requirements

[SquatJar]

Guy posts complaining novices don't post their trees so it should be compulsory, novice posts a 3 year progression. Guy completely shits on the novices tree without realising he has completed a massive self own in only 2 posts. Irony huh

 

[BobbyLane]

I take my journey seriously.
When I started I posted my sticks in pots.
I was terrified but I did it.
I’m still here. I have trees I’m not embarrassed of now. I know I can still post a stick but now it will have character.
No one told me to give up so I never did.

thats part of the thing. sometimes im seeing paragraph after paragraph without a single tree in sight.

I hope you didnt take that as me being mean or rude. It's just that was the first throught i had reading your post. As for a stick in a pot.

https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/japanese-maple-shindeshojo-2019

Look I dont even know how to link to a topic.

i really dont mind looking at sticks in pots, gotta start somewhere. what bores me the most are endless paragraphs of chatter without a single tree in site.
i think some folk are intent on using the place for social chat, which i think in part is what the opening post was eluding to.

 

[BobbyLane]

I hear you @Smoke , I personally need to up my skills in photographing my work. I will make a point of putting together more threads, mind you the closest thing to real activity in one of my threads was two dudes debating how kotobuki JBP are propagated.

smartphones nowadays have superior picture taking qualities, its become so easy now to take top quality photos of your trees at the touch of a button.
no excuses, get snapping

also following on from my previous post. its not just about showing your sticks in pots or whatever stage your trees are in. but lets see what drives you, what inspires you, what images are you looking at for inspiration.
etc

 

[Cadillactaste]

I can understand complaints about trolling and some of those way off topic fights that occur, but this suggestion goes far beyond some base moderation.

I've seen that Smoke is constantly demanding this of folks, he is constantly demanding you "post your trees". But then each and every time someone takes the risk of showing them he derides them about how bad they are. So he claims he wants to see your trees, but then it seems those trees have to meet some other unstated requirements. If he only wants to see refined, fully styled and filled out trees, maybe an open forum site full of learning and sharing threads isn't for him. I do not mean to intentionally disrespect him but he clearly isn't one for providing meaningful advice to beginners, only snide comments. Me might provide an answer but it will ALWAYS have some insult attached. It seems folks wanting to learn the basics are beneath him. And for complaining about trolls he will jump into a thread as fast as anyone to throw an insult at someone.

With how easy it is to ignore stuff I can't understand the complaint. Those that have "finished" trees are free to congregate in a particular forum and do what he is asking, so maybe just make a Smoke forum where other suitors can post pictures to please Smoke.

An Internet forum being treated like an educational institution where you have to basically "make the grade" isn't very welcoming. It doesn't seem logical to have a forum site where basic learning is frowned upon, after all that's not how the community is at large. I for one have been helped in lots of topics by having this site which isn't just a bunch of pictures of fine art. If this site was full of progression threads and no real discussion it wouldn't be nearly as meaningful.

This isn't an art gallery, it's an internet forum.

I do get it...like for example. Al has preferences. I think we all do. I shared this ROR...on a thread discussing ROR. And was told to my surprise by Al. It wasn't a ROR... because it didn't have that melting trident roots that,develop over time. (Thank the good Lord. I don't prefer that look. But don't knock ones who do ) I laughed actually...Al is Al. But someone new...may take it to heart...and post less photos. But we need thick skin...I have several non-purist trees. They bring me joy...and that is what my journey is about. I must admit...I'm spending more time on a FB group... offering direction to newbies. Trying to remember my own roots. How ones guided me to where I am now. And I encourage character in material...but don't knock a stick in a pot either. Because even Bill Valavanis works with raw young material...he did a forest grouping at a club not long ago... Explaining inferior material when grouped together is more. Which has been said here even.

But to critique without adding any compliment derails ones desire to share photos.

I don't think to demand photos...is the way to go. We need to find a positive comment in with a critique given. So ones feel less threatened to share.

My not so ROR winged elm... Al is a QUIRKY guy for sure. Has experience and knowledge. So...he liked melting roots where a tree looks impaled. I get that. Many do...

 

[A. Gorilla]

Smoke is a statist. Lol

 

[Owen Reich]

Forums exist for free for what people want to use them for. I pushed too hard on Study Group trying to be helpful and likely fast-forwarded a page in decline (a great resource for old, still accurate posts). Lots of good resources here as well if you look.

 

[PABonsai]

I mean, don't get me wrong. I want to progress. Otherwise I wouldn't be here. I think the overwhelming majority of us want to progress. And we would all like to have great trees to show off. But when I see the proposed "solution" it concerns me because honestly I have no clue whether my skills will be up to what he considers good in 3 years. I've been participating in this since June, and I don't have anything one would consider a bonsai. And I don't think I will next year either. But I'm not going to let some bully determine the value of what I do. I'm going to work to get better but as long as I enjoy it I don't care if my trees are as good as a bunch of folks in CA who have every bonsai resource at their disposal. It's like every activity. An arbitrarily set timeline of progressing skills is stupid because not everyone is even devoting the same amount of time to it. Some here are young, some old, some single, some with families, some with homes, some in apts without balconies. And your time as a member here has no correlation to how long you've been doing the hobby. So having goals to prove you're progressing trees in a given manner is nonsensical, especially given not every tree progresses at the same rate. This is an Internet forum, not a bonsai school.

 

[Silentrunning]

A while back I posted a picture of a pre-bonsai Literati that I am working on. There were mostly negative reviews but also some helpful advice. One person pretty much said it was a lost cause, so now that tree is my #1 project. It will go to club meetings when we have advisors. I am going to make a show tree out of it if it kills me. Or the tree.

 

[Saddler]

Ahhhhh Smoke, the most demanding person on the forum, yet the least helpful. And even when he is helpful, it seems to be out of spite. I have to give him credit though for making me Laugh over my morning coffee at his post. I view most of his posts as satire and it becomes comedic gold.

 

[Warpig]

I want to point out one more thing on this matter that we all seem to over look. In the year and a half that I've been around here, im willing to bet well more then half of the topics that get way off topic to the point of there being 7 pages of crap, gets that way from people that has well over 1,000 post. This has nothing to do with someone being new or not.

 

[PaulH]

Nice job Al! Light the fuse and stand back. LOL

 

[MrWunderful]

What a terrible idea lol. You are losing your edge Smoke!

 

[sorce]

We can stop being bitches and impart this conflict into the design of our trees.

If we think these arguments and disagreements don't help our trees.....

We suck at life....I mean art.

Life too.

Sorce

 

[August44]

Start your own forum. Then you can implement whatever rules suit you.

Or, if you're truly bored...just go away.

And I don't think telling someone to "go away" because you don't agree with their thoughts or ideas is the way to go at all. To me that is rude and shows a lack of patience and communication skills. We all are entitled to an opinion and should not have to suffer heavy criticism for those opinions.

The suggestion that, after a certain period of time (three years) we should have to show progression with one of our trees and explain what we are doing doesn't sound right to me either. What if we have a dumpster tree to start with and after three years, because of time, abilities etc, we still have a dumpster tree. Now we get to listen to all the bad feedback from members (some) and all of a sudden we just feel like crawling in a hole and ditching this bonsai thing. I think we should all be ready to help verses criticize. Just my opinion of course...

 

[Cadillactaste]

I want to point out one more thing on this matter that we all seem to over look. In the year and a half that I've been around here, im willing to bet well more then half of the topics that get way off topic to the point of there being 7 pages of crap, gets that way from people that has well over 1,000 post. This has nothing to do with someone being new or not.

I must admit I don't see a lot of that with ones who are on my ignore. Cleans up the forum for me. Sometimes it seems slower than norm. Most likely because of that. But peace of mind is a great thing.

 

[grouper52]

Perhaps a wee bit too much Arrogant Bastard Ale lately, Al ....

Other than that, great respect for all you have contributed to BN and the art over the years.

Will

 

[grouper52]

I hear you @Smoke , I personally need to up my skills in photographing my work.

If you haven't already, check out my tutorial on such in the Resources section of the BN site.

Also, for people still posting sticks in pots, you might want to check out my tutorial "The Importance of Starting With a Good Trunk".

Enjoy.

 

[grouper52]

My not so ROR winged elm...

May I offer a suggestion, Darlene, to take this tree - which has really great potential - to the next level?

1. Take it out of its pot, but leave it draped over the rock.
2. Make a number of small nicks through bark to the sap wood of the exposed roots, from way up pretty high (even, perhaps, to the very base of the trunk where the roots start), down to about mid way to where the soil had been when it had been in the pot.
3. Put root stimulator lavishly along the ares you have nicked.
4. Put some moist/wet soil thinly around the roots, wrapped in plastic wrap.
5. Hang it down as a cascade on the edge of a really huge, deep pot, (since it will be hard to put a cascade in the ground).
6. Starting in the Spring, feed the crap out of it for the next 5+ years.
7. When you dig it up, the way the roots will look draped over the rock should be stunning, and it will be a spectacular cascade in the right pot.

Hope that helps.

 

[Cadillactaste]

May I offer a suggestion, Darlene, to take this tree - which has really great potential - to the next level?

1. Take it out of its pot, but leave it draped over the rock.
2. Make a number of small nicks through bark to the sap wood of the exposed roots, from way up pretty high (even, perhaps, to the very base of the trunk where the roots start), down to about mid way to where the soil had been when it had been in the pot.
3. Put root stimulator lavishly along the ares you have nicked.
4. Put some moist/wet soil thinly around the roots, wrapped in plastic wrap.
5. Hang it down as a cascade on the edge of a really huge, deep pot, (since it will be hard to put a cascade in the ground).
6. Starting in the Spring, feed the crap out of it for the next 5+ years.
7. When you dig it up, the way the roots will look draped over the rock should be stunning, and it will be a spectacular cascade in the right pot.

Hope that helps.

So your talking an angle change when it's repotted in the spring? If I go that route. Would need to look for a pot. Over potting basically.

 

[amcoffeegirl]

A while back I posted a picture of a pre-bonsai Literati that I am working on. There were mostly negative reviews but also some helpful advice. One person pretty much said it was a lost cause, so now that tree is my #1 project. It will go to club meetings when we have advisors. I am going to make a show tree out of it if it kills me. Or the tree.

I like that- determination and drive.
I admire that and wish you the most luck with this tree.
Please share updates as it progresses.