Ebay bonsai sellers are thieves

[mcpesq817]

This happens all over, and not just with bonsai - same with cars, houses, electronics, repair and maintenance, etc. I don't feel sorry for the buyers - as a buyer, do your due diligence or you might end up paying more than you would have to if you bought the product or service elsewhere. We live in a free market society, and nobody is forcing the buyers to pay for something they don't want (unlike Obamacare - oops, don't want to bring politics in ).

I feel worse for the people that buy the dead junipers from Home Depot with soil glued on. Those people are buying a defective product and might be discouraged from getting into the hobby.

 

[Poink88]

No matter what the venue is (eBay, sidewalk, Craigslist, mall, etc.), taking advantage of someone...especially those who are just starting to get interested, can be detrimental to the growth of this art/hobby. They are the future and sadly, the most vulnerable group.

I've known people who are genuinely interested, bought some $200 INDOOR juniper at the sidewalk and ended with dead trees (who could have guessed?). Now they shy away from bonsai. Instead of the interest getting nurtured, it was literally shot down by greed.

 

[mcpesq817]

So the people making a living from this are expected to set artificially lower prices because people that are buying on a whim have not done their homework? You tell that to the sellers who are putting bread on the table and clothes on their kids' backs.

There's a market when people are willing to pay what a seller is asking. Again, someone selling dead junipers with glued soil is selling a defective product. Completely different case where someone on eBay is selling a live healthy tree and happens to get more for it than you think should be paid. I think that people that complain about the prices for something they have no interest in buying anyway are likely just jealous that the sellers are able to get what they are getting.

Another example - I go to the mechanic to service my car and probably get ripped off every time. Nobody is forcing me to pay those rates, but I don't have the time or inclination to learn about auto work (or do it myself).

 

[GrimLore]

There was a member here MileHigh who used to sell on EBAY. He sold a variety of good quality Saplings at very competitive prices. I agree there is a lot of trash out there but there is a few "good guys"...

Grimmy

 

[Lazylightningny]

No matter what the venue is (eBay, sidewalk, Craigslist, mall, etc.), taking advantage of someone...especially those who are just starting to get interested, can be detrimental to the growth of this art/hobby. They are the future and sadly, the most vulnerable group.

I've known people who are genuinely interested, bought some $200 INDOOR juniper at the sidewalk and ended with dead trees (who could have guessed?). Now they shy away from bonsai. Instead of the interest getting nurtured, it was literally shot down by greed.

That's a good point. And I feel a blanket statement such as "let the buyer beware" is a cop-out, and lays no responsibility on the greater bonsai community. If we can educate the ignorant, things might get better. However, as someone stated earlier, it is incumbent on the buyer to at least make an attempt at some self-education before purchasing.

 

[Vance Wood]

I find it hard to believe what people are selling as bonsai on ebay. Many of them look like they took a big box store tree for $20, did an initial styling on it, stuck it in a pretty pot, and are reselling it at $300 or more. That's criminal if you ask me. I find it hard to believe that anyone with even an iota of bonsai knowledge would pay such exorbitant prices for worthless pieces of crap that even I could do with my very limited experience.

I find it hard to believe that they are that good.

 

[lordy]

I think equally as absurd are the trees on ebay with asking prices of $25000 or even $64000. I bought a 2 bedroom condo for half that.

 

[Paradox]

Caveat emptor

 

[coh]

"Caveat emptor" is correct. Just how are we supposed to educate the ignorant? Who is going to pay for the national television advertising campaign to get the word out? There's all kinds of educational resources available already...forums, blogs, books, magazines...seriously, the existence of crappy, over-priced "bonsai" on ebay or craigslist is pretty far down on the list of concerns in my book.

daily rant over...I feel better, at least!

Chris

 

[lordy]

"Caveat emptor" is correct. Just how are we supposed to educate the ignorant? Who is going to pay for the national television advertising campaign to get the word out? There's all kinds of educational resources available already...forums, blogs, books, magazines...seriously, the existence of crappy, over-priced "bonsai" on ebay or craigslist is pretty far down on the list of concerns in my book.

daily rant over...I feel better, at least!

Chris

Yeah, the ad campaign obviously is out. People still drink and drive, or text and drive. I'm with you on the priorities.

 

[GrimLore]

I think equally as absurd are the trees on ebay with asking prices of $25000 or even $64000. I bought a 2 bedroom condo for half that.

My closing date on a 3 bedroom End Unit Townhouse in a very nice Cul-de-sac Community is November 22nd - Total cost after bargaining and closing will be $139000. I will be spending up to 900 or so on a few trees in the Spring IF they are beyond decent but not a penny more. If none are available then I will just keep growing and practicing until they are...

Grimmy

 

[sikadelic]

I have seen a few trees that I really felt were worth some serious money but usually they aren't even priced. Who can really put a price on generations of hard work?

When I first started buying trees I had the mentality that anything over $30 was over my head and I didn't want to invest too much into a tree if I didn't even know what the hell I was doing yet. Of course, you can't fix stupid and some people enjoy their stupidity.

 

[fourteener]

I think equally as absurd are the trees on ebay with asking prices of $25000 or even $64000. I bought a 2 bedroom condo for half that.

At some point a tree can become priceless. If someone puts up a crazy price and a rich person wants to blow their wad on a tree, that to be honest, your not gonna find anywhere else, more power to them.

If you have trees that are too nice when you retire and want to get out of the hobby, they might be unsellable because they are that valuable.

If someone wants to part with a lot of money for one of my trees in 20 years...I'll take the cash!

 

[coppice]

I will order on rare occasions, rooted cuttings of new trees, but mostly the hunt for a remodel orphan is part of the journey for me of bonsai.

So if Ebay vendors are thieves? are Craig's List vendors murderers? Enquiring minds wanna know...

 

[Lazylightningny]

What part of NY are you in?

downstate- Westchester Cty, just above da Bronx. You're a far piece up from me. You must have had some frosts already.

 

[GrimLore]

I have friends a few miles from my house that purchased this 6 foot tall Skull covered with tiles from the "Ancient Streets of Shang Hi for $450000. They purchased it while they were at one of there properties overseas and flew it here on their jet. Even more odd - they have never spent more then a total of 60 days a year here and to them it is quite simply "a lawn ornament"...





Hard to say what the might spend on a Bonsai but I do know they Import 15000 Tulip Bulbs each year to plant just at that property... *sigh*

 

[Dav4]

I have friends a few miles from my house that purchased this 6 foot tall Skull covered with tiles from the "Ancient Streets of Shang Hi for $450000. They purchased it while they were at one of there properties overseas and flew it here on their jet. Even more odd - they have never spent more then a total of 60 days a year here and to them it is quite simply "a lawn ornament"...





Hard to say what the might spend on a Bonsai but I do know they Import 15000 Tulip Bulbs each year to plant just at that property... *sigh*

Somebody should plant a larch over that thing...

 

[Lazylightningny]

At some point a tree can become priceless. If someone puts up a crazy price and a rich person wants to blow their wad on a tree, that to be honest, your not gonna find anywhere else, more power to them.

If you have trees that are too nice when you retire and want to get out of the hobby, they might be unsellable because they are that valuable.

If someone wants to part with a lot of money for one of my trees in 20 years...I'll take the cash!

I agree with this 100%. When you get up into this skill level, the sky's the limit. It's the $300 paint by number that I take exception to.

 

[coh]

downstate- Westchester Cty, just above da Bronx. You're a far piece up from me. You must have had some frosts already.

Nope, not here! Close enough to Lake Ontario that we've avoided frost so far, but sometime in the next few days we'll get it...and maybe a hard freeze as well.

The reason for my question was based on my interpretation of your initial post (which might have been wrong). It sounded to me like you were frustrated by trying to find reasonably priced material for your level. Of course one can find good stuff both on ebay and craigslist, sometimes even at very good prices. But you still can't see what you are actually buying. I've found one of the best sources for material (and I'm also a beginner, only 3 years in) to be club members who have accumulated too many trees, are moving to a smaller place, have become bored with a tree, etc. Sometimes they are trying to unload a problem, but at least you can look at the actual tree and make a determination as to whether it is worth it.

I don't know what the club situation is like down there. But...if you're serious about bonsai and willing/able to travel a bit, I can suggest considering attending the Rochester (National) show in September. In addition to the displays, there are many vendors carrying a wide range of material. Also two excellent bonsai nurseries in the Rochester area. The other suggestion, closer to home, would be the Mid Atlantic Bonsai Societies Spring festival which is going to be in New Jersey next year. Check out the info at http://midatlanticbonsai.freeservers.com/fescurr.htm

Chris

 

[Lazylightningny]

I have friends a few miles from my house that purchased this 6 foot tall Skull covered with tiles from the "Ancient Streets of Shang Hi for $450000. They purchased it while they were at one of there properties overseas and flew it here on their jet. Even more odd - they have never spent more then a total of 60 days a year here and to them it is quite simply "a lawn ornament"...

Wow, talk about discretional income. That's almost perverse.