Dormant Sprays

[GrimLore]

@JoeR
Most everything this year has received the soil drench of Sulfur 3 times. I water it in, not on the plants. I use 2 Tablespoons of the Sulfur powder to 1 Gallon of water. I only use the Daconil as a preventative in Fall and Spring sprayed on. If there is a Fungal problem with a plant it is usually on something newly acquired and in that case I use the Daconil on a 7 not 10 day schedule and find it very effective.
That is me, and the plants here - mileage could vary depending on the fungal problem with Daconil, I just know it covers what I need here. I can tell you here though I have tried many other things including systemic granular formulas which cost far more with little success. You can also use it as a drench but I have not tried it on enough plants to recommend it without calling their help line first.
The Sulfur drench takes a full season to show real results as far as Cedar Rust and such to break the cycle. Once broken it is of no harm and I continue to use the drench as a preventative. In Fall for instance there tends to be a lot of local leaf drop which lands up in our potted plants and combined with dead leaf removal it most assuredly minimizes contamination from other sources.

Grimmy

 

[Lazylightningny]

You should also consider using a good systemic. If you apply that twice a year, you may have a lot less to stay on top of.

Systemics are illegal in NY as far as I can tell.

 

[markyscott]

Here’s a very nice video walking through the process and timing of dormant spray application.

I’ve posted this on several threads, but I think it’s very educational.

Scott

 

[markyscott]

I really like her commentary on the timing and the reasons behind your choice of sprays in the dormant season.

Scott

 

[markyscott]

Here in Houston, it’s time. Temperatures have warmed up from the hard freeze, but they’re not in the 80s and the trees are in a good dormancy. It’s important to leave about 4 weeks between your application of dormant oil and lime sulfur and the LS spray should be applied as the buds begin to swell. For me, that’ll be about 4-6 weeks from now, so it’s important for those of us on the Gulf Coast to get going before it’s too late. I use this on anything not in leaf at dormant concentrations (8 oz per gallon).


Here’s an article I wrote for my club as that explains the process:
https://www.facebook.com/notes/houston-bonsai-society/dormant-spraying/1335155469848406/

I linked a good video on the subject previously.

Scott

 

[markyscott]

Here in Houston, it’s time. Temperatures have warmed up from the hard freeze, but they’re not in the 80s and the trees are in a good dormancy. It’s important to leave about 4 weeks between your application of dormant oil and lime sulfur and the LS spray should be applied as the buds begin to swell. For me, that’ll be about 4-6 weeks from now, so it’s important for those of us on the Gulf Coast to get going before it’s too late. I use this on anything not in leaf at dormant concentrations (8 oz per gallon).
View attachment 174764

Here’s an article I wrote for my club as that explains the process:
https://www.facebook.com/notes/houston-bonsai-society/dormant-spraying/1335155469848406/

I linked a good video on the subject previously.

Scott

So here in Houston, spring is in the air. At least for one bald cypress.



So it’s time to start thinking about spraying with lime sulfur. I wait for the buds to start swelling and then I spray at dormant concentrations. Have to keep on it all spring.

Scott

 

[markyscott]

So here in Houston, spring is in the air. At least for one bald cypress.

View attachment 176694

So it’s time to start thinking about spraying with lime sulfur. I wait for the buds to start swelling and then I spray at dormant concentrations. Have to keep on it all spring.

Scott

In the early spring, when the leaves began to swell I use this product.



I only use this one, because I’ve found the MSDS report on it. Because of that report, i believe it is the same dilution as the old, Hi-Yield lime sulfur. I can’t say the same for any other pet dip lime sulfur. They might be fine or maybe they’re different. If you use one, I’d recommend doing the research first to make sure it’s the same product.

Because I believe it to be the same, I use the old Hi-Yield concentrations. For dormant application, that’s 4oz per gallon. Here’s a link to the post where I shared the MSDS and the old Hi-Yield product label.

https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/h...-been-banned-in-california.24171/#post-383047

I went ahead and hit the maples too. Even though it’s early. The main fungal problems I have is with them. I’ll spray them again when spring comes for them.

Scott

 

[CasAH]

It was in the forty’s this week so I dusted all my trees with Bondie’s Sulphur fungicide. It is 16*F and snowing today.

It was a mid Winter treatment. I will do another treatment in March.

 

[markyscott]

Spring has arrived for some of the tridents. Although I sprayed a week ago. I’ll give them a good soak today. This week, pretty much everything gets repotted.



Scott

 

[BrianBay9]

Around here (San Francisco Bay area) the experienced club members recommend three rounds of dormant spray, on or around Thanksgiving, Christmas and Valentines Day. Alternating between Daconil and a copper spray. I was going to do my final treatment yesterday but it got too windy.

 

[JoeR]

Is it beneficial to spray diluted sulfur at the beginning of winter as well as before bud swell to prevent/cure fungus? Specifically maples? I’m trying to figure out how I can win this battle with anthracrose. It’s claimed my favorite maple, despite my continuos spraying of peroxide and Daconil...

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

I just hit everything with dormant oil today. Will probably repeat it again in Jan & Feb, then move to lime-sulfur in March.
It won’t hurt to treat your Maple now with LS.

 

[JoeR]

I just hit everything with dormant oil today. Will probably repeat it again in Jan & Feb, then move to lime-sulfur in March.
It won’t hurt to treat your Maple now with LS.

Sorry missed this response until now. Dormant oil is mostly used for pests not diseases correct? Really need to get a good system going after I cure the current diseases.

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Sorry missed this response until now. Dormant oil is mostly used for pests not diseases correct? Really need to get a good system going after I cure the current diseases.

Correct, dormant oil is for overwintering pests/eggs. If you haven’t, go back and find and read Scott’s excellent short article about the importance of timing fungicides and insecticides. It was an “a-ha” moment for my prevention programs.

 

[JoeR]

Correct, dormant oil is for overwintering pests/eggs. If you haven’t, go back and find and read Scott’s excellent short article about the importance of timing fungicides and insecticides. It was an “a-ha” moment for my prevention programs.

Right right. I just read it again, the one he wrote for his FB group.

I think what stumps me is the different approaches between preventative measures and curative measures. I understand how LS is used for prevention, but my trees are already infected- so is spraying alone effective? Or do i need to do something with the soil/roots? Everything I read suggests Daconil for existing infections, and I sprayed it on a 7 day interval for weeks as well as peroxide and still the problem didn’t seem to be resolved. All it appeared to do was slow the trees growth, the leaves continued to open with the symptomatic discoloration.

I think a lot of my problem has to do with my growing environment. We’ve just had so much problematic rain the past few springs, and some of the trees in the surrounding woods may be infected. That, or possibly the new soil I’ve been using is subpar and I should consider something new. I wasn’t super happy with the growth on any of my trees this season, and I’d like to chalk it up to the new soil. I *believe* it didn’t retain any nutrients/fertilizer that I applied, which caused the trees to be weak and susceptible to infection. Boons mix it is, I suppose.

 

[River's Edge]

Right right. I just read it again, the one he wrote for his FB group.

I think what stumps me is the different approaches between preventative measures and curative measures. I understand how LS is used for prevention, but my trees are already infected- so is spraying alone effective? Or do i need to do something with the soil/roots? Everything I read suggests Daconil for existing infections, and I sprayed it on a 7 day interval for weeks as well as peroxide and still the problem didn’t seem to be resolved. All it appeared to do was slow the trees growth, the leaves continued to open with the symptomatic discoloration.

I think a lot of my problem has to do with my growing environment. We’ve just had so much problematic rain the past few springs, and some of the trees in the surrounding woods may be infected. That, or possibly the new soil I’ve been using is subpar and I should consider something new. I wasn’t super happy with the growth on any of my trees this season, and I’d like to chalk it up to the new soil. I *believe* it didn’t retain any nutrients/fertilizer that I applied, which caused the trees to be weak and susceptible to infection. Boons mix it is, I suppose.

Just a couple of points for consideration.
1.Treatment for needlecast will not always show results during that growing season usually! If it is effective, the improved foliage will appear the following year when the buds that were treated properly open to needles that are unaffected or less affected. Systemics do work best but they are not readily available to everyone!
2. Soil mixes that do not retain fertilizer are not a problem if the fertilizer is applied appropriately given the circumstances. Watering methods can improve or reduce the effective use of fertilizer as well. Liquid fertilizer can be effective in those circumstances.
3. Trees that are weak and susceptible to infection could be due to several variables that usually develop over longer periods of time. One needs to examine repotting techniques, watering, placement and fertilizing routines. My nursery is located among natural forest with common health issues, both insect and fungal. I find preventative measures on a regular basis the best approach.
4. You mentioned multiple treatments at regular intervals, another aspect is the appropriate TIMING for prior to and when the fungal issues are most active in your area and the growth stage your trees are at. Stopping when the drier conditions are present.
5. Spraying LS is a general comment. It makes a difference how it is prepared, was a carrier used as well, what happened during the interval between spraying. ( did it rain for three days straight washing off the spray)

PS: i use inorganic soil mixes with particle size that allows for reasonable moisture retention and free drainage.

Your approach to focus on improving overall conditions is the right one, All factors that will improve the basic health will make a difference. I am not being critical of your observations, just being supportive that the approach is on the right track, but the devil is in the details!
The post you referenced is valuable for a general approach. Talk to experienced local area practitioners for the nuts and bolts of the specific details involved in that approach and what exactly to expect. What works for me may not work or be adviseable in your area. However, your climatic zone is very similar to mine. We have hot dry summers with cool wet fall, winter and early spring.

 

[bwaynef]

Is it beneficial to spray diluted sulfur at the beginning of winter as well as before bud swell to prevent/cure fungus? Specifically maples? I’m trying to figure out how I can win this battle with anthracrose. It’s claimed my favorite maple, despite my continuos spraying of peroxide and Daconil...

It looks like there are several fungicides that are registered to treat Anthracnose. Chlorothalonil is the chemical name of Daconil. Biosafe & Zerotol are Peroxide treatments (w/ periacetic acid in different amounts to make the peroxide more effective). The Phytons & thiomyl/clearys3336 are systemic, if you want to tackle it in a couple different ways.


grep -i anthracnose *.txt
biosafe.txt:Anthracnose
captan.txt:Anthracnose
chlorothalanil.txt:Anthracnose
clearys3336.txt:Anthracnose
copper.txt:Anthracnose
daconil.txt:Anthracnose
immunox.txt:Anthracnose
infuse.txt:Anthracnose
mancozeb.txt:Anthracnose
myclobutanil.txt:Anthracnose
phyton27.txt:Anthracnose
phyton35.txt:Anthracnose
potassium-bicarb.txt:Anthracnose
propiconazole.txt:Anthracnose
serenade.txt:Anthracnose
serenade.txt:Anthracnose Fruit Rot
thiomyl.txt:Anthracnose
zerotol.txt:Anthracnose

Also, if you were as deliberate as you say you were about treating with Daconil & Peroxide last year, you may want to send a sample of infected material to have it tested so you can know for certain what you're dealing with.

 

[markyscott]

Right right. I just read it again, the one he wrote for his FB group.

I think what stumps me is the different approaches between preventative measures and curative measures. I understand how LS is used for prevention, but my trees are already infected- so is spraying alone effective? Or do i need to do something with the soil/roots? Everything I read suggests Daconil for existing infections, and I sprayed it on a 7 day interval for weeks as well as peroxide and still the problem didn’t seem to be resolved. All it appeared to do was slow the trees growth, the leaves continued to open with the symptomatic discoloration.

I think a lot of my problem has to do with my growing environment. We’ve just had so much problematic rain the past few springs, and some of the trees in the surrounding woods may be infected. That, or possibly the new soil I’ve been using is subpar and I should consider something new. I wasn’t super happy with the growth on any of my trees this season, and I’d like to chalk it up to the new soil. I *believe* it didn’t retain any nutrients/fertilizer that I applied, which caused the trees to be weak and susceptible to infection. Boons mix it is, I suppose.

I think you may be referring to the dormant spraying article. I wrote another that may be helpful to you as well.

https://m.facebook.com/notes/housto...ose-on-the-texas-gulf-coast/1384161804947772/

S

 

[M. Frary]

I spray my dormant trees with a mix of castor oil,dish soap and water.

 

[JoeR]

Just a couple of points for consideration.
1.Treatment for needlecast will not always show results during that growing season usually! If it is effective, the improved foliage will appear the following year when the buds that were treated properly open to needles that are unaffected or less affected. Systemics do work best but they are not readily available to everyone!
2. Soil mixes that do not retain fertilizer are not a problem if the fertilizer is applied appropriately given the circumstances. Watering methods can improve or reduce the effective use of fertilizer as well. Liquid fertilizer can be effective in those circumstances.
3. Trees that are weak and susceptible to infection could be due to several variables that usually develop over longer periods of time. One needs to examine repotting techniques, watering, placement and fertilizing routines. My nursery is located among natural forest with common health issues, both insect and fungal. I find preventative measures on a regular basis the best approach.
4. You mentioned multiple treatments at regular intervals, another aspect is the appropriate TIMING for prior to and when the fungal issues are most active in your area and the growth stage your trees are at. Stopping when the drier conditions are present.
5. Spraying LS is a general comment. It makes a difference how it is prepared, was a carrier used as well, what happened during the interval between spraying. ( did it rain for three days straight washing off the spray)

PS: i use inorganic soil mixes with particle size that allows for reasonable moisture retention and free drainage.

Your approach to focus on improving overall conditions is the right one, All factors that will improve the basic health will make a difference. I am not being critical of your observations, just being supportive that the approach is on the right track, but the devil is in the details!
The post you referenced is valuable for a general approach. Talk to experienced local area practitioners for the nuts and bolts of the specific details involved in that approach and what exactly to expect. What works for me may not work or be adviseable in your area. However, your climatic zone is very similar to mine. We have hot dry summers with cool wet fall, winter and early spring.

I appreciate the detailed response.

Although the JBP I just purchased does have needle cast, this isn’t the problem I was referring to. I’ve struggled the past year or two with trident/Japanese maples and “Anthracrose”. “” because I don’t know for certain that’s what it is. What I need to do is take a sample to someone for testing.

The soil I used this year was BonsaiJack’s inorganic mix. I’m not saying it’s a bad mix, just that for my specific circumstances it wasn’t the best. I’m living in an apartment in Wilmington, NC (beach town) two hours away from where my trees are. Although they get watered, I’m not there to keep up with fertilizing like I wish I could. I try not to burden other people with them, because after all, they are my responsibility. So I fertilize when I’m in town and can. I know, not ideal at all. But I’m on the fourth floor of an apartment with a small balcony that faces East/sunrise, so that’s not ideal either.

As far as timing, I’m not sure. I want to say it was late spring through summer. I originally used the premixed over priced daconil in a spray bottle then when that ran out I used the concentrate mixed with water but no other carrier as the directions didn’t mention using one.

I’d like to know which systemic you’ve had luck with btw