Die grinder recommendations please
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sorce
Nonsense Rascal
They make nice stuff.
By nice I mean....
thoughtful, ergonomic, easy to change out and operate, without a lot of stupid spacecraft bells and whistles that you have to, uh oh, busting myself out, read the manual to operate !
Sorce
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Not wanting to ruin this thread, I made a different one for folks who "think outside the box"... feel free to take part, if you so desire.
https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/unscientific-pruning-and-deadwood-study-group.26789/
https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/unscientific-pruning-and-deadwood-study-group.26789/
SU2
Omono
How do you find those burrs to compare to carbide barbed 'rasps'? I've just gotten some basic tools to start practicing with and for my die-grinder I've just got a set of rasps, I've looked at that page before (kutzall's burrs) but thought those would be significantly inferior to rasps (since they have no 'teeth'/protrusions I figured their removal rate would be wayyy lower than with rasps!)
Was going to be placing an order for better rasps but reading your post has me reconsidering burrs... wish they weren't so expensive so I could just buy a bunch to try!
Joe Dupre'
Omono
Being kinda cheap, I settled on a $5.00 1/2" rotary rasp attachment that chucks up in a regular hand drill. It obviously won't do what one of those Kaisen bonsai Terrier bits will do, but it works very well on trees with bases in the 1" to 3" range. For finer work, I tried a 5/16" screw tap chucked in a hand drill. It works surprisingly well on finger sized carving areas.
Vindeezy
Yamadori
I suggest a cordless dremel tool you can get them anywhere and they make a ton of nice fine detail bits.
SU2
Omono
What kind of power does that drill have? My die-grinder is 1/4" and 4.2A / 25k rpm, it goes through wood like butter- if I put those rasps into my drill I know it'd be bouncing / incapable (though my drill is kinda crappy, am genuinely curious at what you have as I want my drill to be more capable for this type of stuff, right now my wire-wheel set for it is the only reason I'd ever use it for bonsai short of making containers/stands!)
And those terrier bits are incredible, one of those is on my wish/splurge list right now (that for my die-grinder, and their (or Kutzall's) 4.5" rasp disks for my angle-grinder, would be able to do all the wood-work I imagine my trees ever needing w/o any (tool) problems at all!!
SU2
Omono
Thanks but ended up going with a higher powered setup, just too-much wood to carve I got a 4.2A 25k rpm die-grinder as well as a 4.5" angle-grinder that I'm going to get a rasp disk and(/or) a lancelot/chainsaw-style disk for , will be able to go through my giant stumps like butter
Vin
Imperial Masterpiece
Dremels are for wimps or fine detail work in my case. 
I have a 60 gallon air compressor because of the work I do on old cars. Several companies make air powered mini die grinders but I bought a used Cornwell off ebay several years ago and haven't had any issues with it. If you wear eye protection and don't go stabbing the grinder at the wood or trying to remove massive amounts of material in a few seconds there really is no great danger. However, if you want to feel "one with the tree" then hand tools are the way to go. Electric die grinders are too big and clunky for my liking.
I have a 60 gallon air compressor because of the work I do on old cars. Several companies make air powered mini die grinders but I bought a used Cornwell off ebay several years ago and haven't had any issues with it. If you wear eye protection and don't go stabbing the grinder at the wood or trying to remove massive amounts of material in a few seconds there really is no great danger. However, if you want to feel "one with the tree" then hand tools are the way to go. Electric die grinders are too big and clunky for my liking.
Joe Dupre'
Omono
SU2, I have a pretty standard corded drill. Nothing special. Like I said, it's nowhere near the tool that a Terrier on the end of a die grinder is. With the rotary rasp, it is harder to use and takes a bit more care, but I carved the top of my two largest cypress trees ...........2" and 3" at the apex..... with little trouble. It works well to carve down big branch stubs and such and blend them in to the trunk.
Now, you can't carve down a 12" length of 3" diameter trunk into deadwood like Graham Potter. I haven't found the need to do that anyway.
I do plan on getting a Dremel for the finer stuff, though.
This is what I have.
Now, you can't carve down a 12" length of 3" diameter trunk into deadwood like Graham Potter. I haven't found the need to do that anyway.
I do plan on getting a Dremel for the finer stuff, though.
This is what I have.
SU2
Omono
ROFL! Yeah I was tempted to go the dremel route, the prices are so much better (1/4" shaft stuff that can handle 25k is much pricier than dremel stuff) but after discussion about it on reddit I realized that with my trees (big stumps yammas, am going to be removing LOTS of wood to get any semblance of taper in them) I decided against it...maybe at a later date, as you say for detail work it seems they've got their place but for now the angle-grinder for big stuff and the 1/4" collet die-grinder (4.2A) is perfect, I'm very gentle with it I don't push into it as you say and I do wear eye protection (though it's not truly 'shop gear' so am unsure how useless it could be...am always very aware of the angle of rotation relative to myself as well!!), I found it clunky at first but have been learning how to use two hands properly and kind of have a 'pivot' hand that's holding the tool while resting on the material so you can really control it and be precise (though after practicing a couple weeks on my topiaries and finally deciding to take a spot off a bonsai, of course I mess-up and the rasp bounced and put a nick in the trunk where it wasn't wanted!)Dremels are for wimps or fine detail work in my case.
I can't say I feel one with the tree haha but I very much like hand-tools for all wood-work on my 'shohin' trees, I don't think I'd ever need to use any powered tools on them unless I were trying to do 'detail work' like carving depressions or something, for now I'm really just focusing on making clean lines though!
With those cutters I can do most-anything I need on my smaller trees, for my larger ones the angle- and die-grinders work like a hot knife through butter!
SU2
Omono
SU2, I have a pretty standard corded drill. Nothing special. Like I said, it's nowhere near the tool that a Terrier on the end of a die grinder is. With the rotary rasp, it is harder to use and takes a bit more care, but I carved the top of my two largest cypress trees ...........2" and 3" at the apex..... with little trouble. It works well to carve down big branch stubs and such and blend them in to the trunk.
Now, you can't carve down a 12" length of 3" diameter trunk into deadwood like Graham Potter. I haven't found the need to do that anyway.
I do plan on getting a Dremel for the finer stuff, though.
This is what I have.
Wow you gotta tell me what drill you're using! That is almost identical to a rasp I have and use with my die-grinder, with the die-grinder it just goes right through wood like it was nothing I couldn't imagine putting my rasp in my drill though I feel like it'd 'kick' the plant!! My drill's very wimpy though, and I know there's very very powerful drills out there- what model drill do you have (or do you have the power specs?)
Joe Dupre'
Omono
It's just a garden-variety 3/8" Dewalt hand drill. It DOES take a more careful approach because it WILL kick out on you. You said "I found it clunky at first but have been learning how to use two hands properly and kind of have a 'pivot' hand that's holding the tool while resting on the material so you can really control it and be precise " That's pretty much the technique I use.
BUT..........$5.00 as opposed to $250-$300 for a die grinder and Terrier bit?? Only the bonsai enthusiast can make that call for himself. I've had too many interests over the years to justify buying a full compliment of the best tools for each hobby.
BUT..........$5.00 as opposed to $250-$300 for a die grinder and Terrier bit?? Only the bonsai enthusiast can make that call for himself. I've had too many interests over the years to justify buying a full compliment of the best tools for each hobby.
SU2
Omono
That 'kick out' you refer to isn't good though, when that's happening (insufficient power to cut-through causing the bit to buck or bounce) it's transferring energy to the tree, I imagine if the tree was reallly well-secured into its pot that wouldn't be that big a deal but for some of my trees that aren't, I'd be very afraid of using something that'd risk bounce-back!
I'm the same way, too many hobbies and they can all become money-pits real fast - but I wouldn't rule-out higher-powered stuff just yet if I were you, Harbor Freight's stuff gets laughed-at by many but I've got two grinders from them and am so beyond impressed, anyways though for example my die-grinder cost me $40 (retail there was $50 though, but still that's very cheap) and for $11 I got a 2-yr, even-if-it-was-my-fault warranty - I look at home depot's site, their cheapest comparable products are the makita (which is weaker, mine's got 20% more amperage) for $105, their cheapest that has the same power (well, 0.3A more) is $200.... And yeah terrier bits are ~$50, but rasps are cheap and they just eat through wood! Between my die-grinder with rasps for smaller stuff, and my angle-grinder for larger stuff (using a 4.5" burred rasp disk for real hogging-out, and 3.5" or 4" flap disk for smaller removals), I can do soooo much and I'm not even $100 into this (am close but even w/ tax I didn't pass $100 altogether for my entire setup:
Have spent the past month doing work on random landscape plants, mostly topiary trees, and recently did my first work on a bonsai (did knick it but not badly!), can't wait to hone my skills with these and, despite them being HF tools and thus likely to be inferior, they work fantastic as far as this newbie can tell *and*, at such a cheap price-point, I've got these grinders with warranties covering me for 2yrs, I couldn't be happier with my purchases there!!
[edit- I *do* plan on getting a terrier bit TBH, the terrier bit and the Lancelot chainsaw disk as well (4.5" for the angle-grinder), as $$ allows! In a lot of the videos I've seen of that thing in action, if you've got a lot to carve and your die-grinder's powerful, that thing seems to move through wood like it wasn't even there!!]
Dav4
Drop Branch Murphy
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https://www.harborfreight.com/electric-die-grinder-with-long-shaft-44141.html
Right tool for the right job. $50 is probably less expensive then a trip to the ER.
daudelus
Mame
Rinse and repeat that! I could have written this myself... I don't think your die grinder selection is as important as the bits you invest in...I got a cheap die grinder at harbor freight - discovered it cuts flesh better than I could have expected!
Be careful
Wee
Chumono
Harbor Freight has a %25 off coupon good for Monday....I think it's on their website if not let me know and I'll post it here. I have been going to purchase that same long shaft grinder for awhile....For carving and with a wire wheel to grind the surface rust off the vette frame.
Brian
Brian
SU2
Omono
I failed to note it earlier so instead of editing will just mention here, there *is* some degree of misalignment in the long-shaft die-grinder, I never noticed it in working with it but the build-up on rasps isn't 100% equal, and I know it's not because this is a bad/damaged unit, I swapped it to be sure and the other one was almost identically slightly-off - I imagine all die-grinders are off to some degree (ie none are 100.0% precise) but am sure there's tighter tolerances/precision the higher-up you go in brands. That said, I'm in love with my HF grinders, particularly the die-grinder, so much that I went back to put the warranty on it (you can do that within 30 days of purchase), can't wait to get a terrier bit for it from Kaizen Bonsai, that's going to be my splurge (it *was* going to be one of their 4.5" rasp disks, but ended up finding one at HF when I swapped the die-grinders, can't believer I didn't notice it the first time it's the one in my picture up-thread was only $10
)I'd be more concerned about precision if I were doing other types of work, but like I said I couldn't even notice it I finally noticed it due to uneven build-up on the rasps, working with it is definitely a pleasure!! It's powerful to go through much more than wood so doing woodwork is just a breeze
(re the wire-wheel for the frame rust I don't know how easily you'll find a wire product that can handle the 25k rpm of the die-grinder, I know that'd shred my wire wheels to pieces the second they touched surface! Also something to keep in-mind is the HF die-grinder has a max disk size of 1.5", some of the better name brands allow 2" and I can only imagine that that has to do with how tight the tolerances/precision of the grinder are)
SU2
Omono
100%! I just got into this (powertools for woodworking) and initially had gotten the 'sanding stone' types of bits for the die-grinder, got a diamond-tipped 1.5" disk, they were all very underwhelming (I hadn't found the rasps yet at that point), as soon as I got the rasps it was a different world with the grinder the rasps just eat wood!!
Would be very interested in your recommendations for bits, am currently just using those rasps (and a burred/rasp 4.5" disk on my angle-grinder for larger work) but was looking to buy the 'Terrier' bit to round out the collection, bridge the gap between rasps and rasp-disk! Besides rasps and the Terrier I don't even know what I'd want!
