Ceramics for Sale - Piedmont Bonsai

[scottydog]

That's your choice to spend that amount. I'm just stating, I'll probably never do that and probably 85%+ of folks on this forum, especially those in colder climates.

So instead of responding to why that kiln closed or the statement of knowing an item true value, I get attacks. Forget I even mentioned anything...I'm wrong, your right....that's what you want to hear.

 

[Piedmont Bonsai]

No one has attacked you.
I’m suggesting you read into bonsai pottery. Here i will help you by providing some information.

TOKONAME BONSAI POTS │ YAMAAKI

TOKONAME BONSAI POTS Official Site

tokonamebonsaipots.com

 

[Bonsai Nut]

But not pottery...knowing how much things cost, let's you know what things are worth...

Would you pay $20 for a 4 pack of beer knowing it cost less than $3 to produce and can? If so, then that says alot about you...

That's like saying a Rembrandt is worth $20 because it was made with $10 of oil paint and a linen canvas.

And some beer that cost $3 to produce and can I wouldn't pay $1 for

There's a lot that goes into pricing bonsai trees, pots, etc that has nothing to do with the cost of raw materials or manufacturing. It isn't elitism - and if you don't want to pay the price it doesn't mean someone else won't - or that they might be completely happy to do so. I've got tons of cheap pots - mass-produced Chinese ones. I've got fewer nice Chinese pots. And just a handful of show pots from domestic and Japanese potters. To me the difference is immediately noticeable - though the cost of materials might be identical.

 

[Excalipoor]

Kiln stopped so it increases value? It's pottery...a kiln fires the piece but has nothing to do with the quality or craftsmanship of the piece. You would get the same end product if you took the unfired piece to another kiln with same firing temp...etc.

No offense but if the kiln was that special and the quality of work was that good, why did they close?

I may never own an expensive bonsai but I'd never buy a $200+ pot living in the north...can't guarantee it not to crack over winter.

One of Japan's 6 ancient kilns (Bizen-ware) almost died off not because it was bad but because it was low in demand at a certain point in time. I can imagine this happening to a kiln specializing in the creation of bonsai pots.

To my knowledge, different kilns have different clays and firing processes so each should slightly differ if not be all entirely different.

Wait till you see the price of tea ceremony items. You're in for a treat!

 

[rockm]

I heard stories of this forum having elitists...beginning to think that might be true

This forum simply has people who know what they're talking about.

There vast differences among the quality and workmanship of bonsai pots. The Japanese "kilns" referenced are AREAS of Japan known for the quality of materials they're working with AND the craftsmen that traditionally worked at the many kilns IN THOSE AREAS. Tokoname is a town in Japan that has been a traditional home of noted bonsai potters for centuries. Seto and Echizen, , Shigaraki, Tanba, and Bizen, as well as Tokoname are known for their individual characteristics and styles. They're all different. They all have many actual kilns, as well as many craftsman potters.

Tokoname has been something of a "standard" for quality bonsai pots for quite some time. The extra money attached to their prices tags is because they're generally worth it in terms of durability and style for bonsai use. Also it takes money to import them into the U.S. The kiln towns also produce other clay wares along with bonsai pots. Demand for bonsai pots has been declining in Japan along with the bonsai hobby. Potters are also dying off. Scarcity can drive up prices, but FWIW, Japanese bonsai pot prices have actually declined in the last decade or so, as there are many specialized importers selling them online in the U.S.

"knowing how much things cost, let's you know what things are worth..."

This is a kicker. Would a world-class bonsai be worth $100 because you can get a Juniper in a pot at a nursery for the same money? Not really, all boils down to what the maker put into it. Understanding what things are worth involves actually understanding what things are worth instead of simply reducing them to materials costs.

As for not using good ceramic pots because you're "in the North" and it freezes, you're the exception. Good bonsai pots are not vulnerable to freezing used properly. Bad quality bonsai pots do get damaged in freezes sometimes. You can buy bad or lower quality pots five times, and buy good quality once. Which is more expensive?

Sorry if all this sounds 'elitist'

 

[Piedmont Bonsai]

I misspoke in my earlier post, sale ends Sunday at 11:59pm. Use code Freedom20 for 20% off at checkout.

Piedmont Bonsai

Bonsai nursery providing top quality bonsai and pre-bonsai material.

www.piedmontbonsai.com

 

[scottydog]

That's like saying a Rembrandt is worth $20 because it was made with $10 of oil paint and a linen canvas.

And some beer that cost $3 to produce and can I wouldn't pay $1 for

There's a lot that goes into pricing bonsai trees, pots, etc that has nothing to do with the cost of raw materials or manufacturing. It isn't elitism - and if you don't want to pay the price it doesn't mean someone else won't - or that they might be completely happy to do so. I've got tons of cheap pots - mass-produced Chinese ones. I've got fewer nice Chinese pots. And just a handful of show pots from domestic and Japanese potters. To me the difference is immediately noticeable - though the cost of materials might be identical.

And a Rembrandt cost no where near it is today. What do you think it went for when it was made, other than they were commissioned by royalty because of status. Unless history changed, most artists of tge Renaissance and other periods lived and died poor. The true value of 99% of the art out there is TIME. Value goes up after the artist dies and more time.

The most highly valued bonsai are pretty old...again, time. Think what you want and pay what you want...I don't care. If you can find sucker's willing to spend that much, good on you. No convincing any set minds on your end...

Love the gang up when someone gives an opinion...

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Love the gang up when someone gives an opinion...

If you piss in the pool, don't complain when it smells.

 

[scottydog]

Opinions equal to pissing in the pool...very mature

 

[lehigh4me]

Think it was an analogy, not an equation.

 

[rockm]

That's your choice to spend that amount. I'm just stating, I'll probably never do that and probably 85%+ of folks on this forum, especially those in colder climates.

So instead of responding to why that kiln closed or the statement of knowing an item true value, I get attacks. Forget I even mentioned anything...I'm wrong, your right....that's what you want to hear.

And a Rembrandt cost no where near it is today. What do you think it went for when it was made, other than they were commissioned by royalty because of status. Unless history changed, most artists of tge Renaissance and other periods lived and died poor. The true value of 99% of the art out there is TIME. Value goes up after the artist dies and more time.

The most highly valued bonsai are pretty old...again, time. Think what you want and pay what you want...I don't care. If you can find sucker's willing to spend that much, good on you. No convincing any set minds on your end...

Love the gang up when someone gives an opinion...

Oh for crying out loud...this is just plain silly, although the dollop of self-pity at the end is a nice touch--although predictable. "Woe is me. None of these fools appreciate me and my opinion that they're fools..." Uh excuse me, but if that's what you think of bonsai, WHY are you interested in it? Oh and I bet you do bonsai "for yourself" and no one else... ammiright?

And no, a Rembrandt in the commoditized, speculative investment high end global art market is nothing like bonsai. And yes, art transcends craft and is worth more. Finding the line between art and craft is not easy to do. FWIW, a good bonsai pot will always be worth more than a Walmart popcorn bucket.

 

[Paradox]

That's your choice to spend that amount. I'm just stating, I'll probably never do that and probably 85%+ of folks on this forum, especially those in colder climates.

You are correct in that it is the purchaser's choice whether to spend the amount asked.
They might not be worth the price to you but the Tokoname and the Yixing pots are absolutely worth around that asking price, particularly if they are older.
Hell even new pots of similar size by some pot makers are up in that price range. The price of pots like everything else has escalated lately.
Like lots of things, there is a wide price range for everything in bonsai, from trees, to tools to pots, etc

Tokoname and Yixing show pots are considered the Mercedes of bonsai pots. Whereas the cheaper Chinese pots are more like a Toyota Camry.
If I had a worthy tree that was ready for a pot and I needed one, Id consider these. But I dont have a tree ready and I have pots already in reserve waiting for them when they are.

Both of those pots would be fine in colder climates because they are high fired and made for that.
I live where it freezes and I've never had a well made pot crack on me due to freezing, at least not yet.

 

[Piedmont Bonsai]

Still have a few pots left. Independence Day sale ends tonight at midnight. Use code Freedom20 for 20% off at checkout

Piedmont Bonsai

Bonsai nursery providing top quality bonsai and pre-bonsai material.

www.piedmontbonsai.com