ABS LEARNING SYMPOSIUM: June 11-14, 2015

[lordy]

There is a registration fee to attend that will allow you entrance to displays of trees, vendor area, lectures and demonstrations by most of the artists on the list. If you so choose, you may also purchase material from vendors, or enroll in any of the many choices with a wide range of prices. This is the case with most shows of this caliber.

 

[Vance Wood]

There is a registration fee to attend that will allow you entrance to displays of trees, vendor area, lectures and demonstrations by most of the artists on the list. If you so choose, you may also purchase material from vendors, or enroll in any of the many choices with a wide range of prices. This is the case with most shows of this caliber.

And----these are how much?? Most of the artists??? What exclusions???

 

[lordy]

Here you go Vance. click and read to your heart's content. Feel free to contact the American Bonsai Society with all of your questions.
Over and out.

 

[Vance Wood]

I would if you provided a link, but you put up the information I just assumed you knew. Things are starting to sound like the proverbial amazing free offer all you pay is $???.00 shipping and handeling.

 

[lordy]

My mistake, Mr. Wood. Here is the link I intended to supply before, however it has been in original post since the beginning of this thread.
http://www.absbonsai.org/2015-abs-learning-symposium

My original purpose in this thread was to simply bring to the attention of like-minded individuals an event that might be of interest. If it does not interest you, that's fine. I dont really care one way or the other. We all have choices to make. Mine is to stop discussing your aversion to the event.

 

[rockm]

"Things are starting to sound like the proverbial amazing free offer all you pay is $???.00 shipping and handeling"

Jeez, that is just depressing and you should know better. If you don't want to pay for anything stay home and work on your trees and mutter about the superiority and satisfaction of not paying for anything. If you're going to complain about something at least read about what you're complaining about. How hard is it to Google "American Bonsai Society" and come up with a link to inform your criticism?

FWIW, You DON'T PAY TO HAVE RYAN STYLE YOUR TREE. You pay for material FOR A WORKSHOP WHERE YOU DO YOUR OWN INITIAL STYLING WITH INPUT FROM RYAN (and other experts in other workshops). The money you pay is also for the experience and suggestions from a person with a very long history of working with the species, and with an eye to bring out their best. This can either translate into a "trophy" tree for someone who's into bragging, OR it can be a pretty great learning experience about what can be done with excellent (possibly once in a lifetime ) stock. It's up to the individual as to which. The VAST majority AREN'T paying their money to get a finished trophy, they're in it to learn. Workshops have worked this way for a very very VERY long time.
And yeah, there's probably an admission for some stuff like the exhibit and to observe some workshops. This kind of thing costs money to put on. Clubs can't work for free. This is true for most bonsai exhibitions that involve more than local clubs--and even some local clubs "suggest" an entry fee.

 

[Vance Wood]

"Things are starting to sound like the proverbial amazing free offer all you pay is $???.00 shipping and handeling"

Jeez, that is just depressing and you should know better. If you don't want to pay for anything stay home and work on your trees and mutter about the superiority and satisfaction of not paying for anything. If you're going to complain about something at least read about what you're complaining about. How hard is it to Google "American Bonsai Society" and come up with a link to inform your criticism?

FWIW, You DON'T PAY TO HAVE RYAN STYLE YOUR TREE. You pay for material FOR A WORKSHOP WHERE YOU DO YOUR OWN INITIAL STYLING WITH INPUT FROM RYAN (and other experts in other workshops). The money you pay is also for the experience and suggestions from a person with a very long history of working with the species, and with an eye to bring out their best. This can either translate into a "trophy" tree for someone who's into bragging, OR it can be a pretty great learning experience about what can be done with excellent (possibly once in a lifetime ) stock. It's up to the individual as to which. The VAST majority AREN'T paying their money to get a finished trophy, they're in it to learn. Workshops have worked this way for a very very VERY long time.
And yeah, there's probably an admission for some stuff like the exhibit and to observe some workshops. This kind of thing costs money to put on. Clubs can't work for free. This is true for most bonsai exhibitions that involve more than local clubs--and even some local clubs "suggest" an entry fee.

For your information Mark I plan on staying away, not staying home. Unless I read the registration forms wrongly the least it can cost me to just visit the verdor's area and see the exhibit is $305.00. That is sure a lot more than being fee to see as we were led to believe earlier. I hope one day you remember where you started.

 

[crust]

Should BN sponsor Vance and send him to the $1000.00 Colorado Spruce work shop as a dissenting undercover spy so he can come back and share all the sprucy tidbits with us all? besides he would get an old but runty spruce he could endlessly covet curing him of his cantankerous afflictions.

 

[crust]

Or just send me.

 

[coh]

For your information Mark I plan on staying away, not staying home. Unless I read the registration forms wrongly the least it can cost me to just visit the verdor's area and see the exhibit is $305.00. That is sure a lot more than being fee to see as we were led to believe earlier. I hope one day you remember where you started.

It's extremely unlikely that is the case though admittedly, I looked through the website and couldn't find any indication what the fee might be to just get in to the exhibit/vending area. When I attended the MABS a few years ago they had a nominal fee to just go to the exhibits and vendor area (like $10). Even the National here in Rochester is only $15 (I think? can't recall) to get in for one day. Typically, Bill V's symposiums and colloquiums allow people to get in to the vendor area for no charge.

 

[rockm]

I think,Vance, that you are wrong. The fee you've quoted includes four sessions, the exhibit, lunch for two days, dinner for one day, a reception, and a trip to the National Arb.

Past experience with the 2005 World Bonsai Convention in D.C. put on by the American Bonsai Society, Bonsai Clubs International, the National Bonsai Foundation, and the Potomac Bonsai Association
http://www.usna.usda.gov/Education/5thBonsaiConvention.html
required no such payment. Entrance to the vendor area was nominal, if not free. The exhibit cost $10 to enter at the door. I'd be very surprised if things are much different at this event.
Too bad you've convinced yourself this event (and apparently any other bonsai event that dares to charge for anything) is evil.

 

[Vance Wood]

I just love the way you put words in my mouth. I did not say this was evil, in essence I said I cannot afford it and if the truth be known I bet there are a lot of people out there that feel the same way. People that want to go, would love to go, but cannot afford to go. It's kind of like the regional finals with Supper Bowl Prices. I love seeing people in bonsai make a profit, and dare I say------???? a killing. My fear is that the bonsai community is going to price itself out of the market place.

We used to be friends back in the Bonsai Forum at Garden Web days if you remember, I really don't know for sure what happened though I suspect; and that too is sad.

If I don't care to attend this show what is it to you or anyone else? As to my reasons for not doing so they are, as far as I am concerned legitimate concerns and my business, to follow my concerns and express them as I see fit. It is my right, as long as I am not maligning anyone or lying, to say what I think; as unpopular as it may be. I am not trying to discourage anyone from going to this show, but I cannot be silent about it either. As far as the information I have been furnished, your effort to change my mind by quoting an event from 2005 does not hold water. That event was ten years ago.

Yes some of the greatest talent in America is going to be there and if you want to go and you can afford to go then go.

 

[qwade]

I have to agree with Vance on this one. (not usually the case since coming to bnut). Some stuff is pricey. I think this is all Vance was saying. And I can relate. Seems everyone jumped him for that honest statement. I doubt he was making any reference one way or the other.
Anyway this is a 2.5 hr drive from my NJ home. I hit the national Arboretum every few months.

Not really interested in workshops. However vendors ,viewing trees and maybe a lecture or 2 would be cool. I am now confused on the price just to get in and look around. Also confused if this is like a "pro" event" or will I fit in as just a novice, casual enthusiast? Clarification?

 

[Paradox]

I admit, the registration form is a tad confusing.

The $300 ($260 if you are an ABS member) registration fee lets you attend any and all of the lectures and demonstrations you want, it lets you into the exhibit and the vendor area. It also includs lunch for 2 days and the banquet Friday night. It really isnt a bad deal considering what is available to you. The fact of the matter is, ABS has to pay the hotel something for this event to be there and they have to charge to offset/pay the costs. They arent getting the use of the place and food for free and the people that have to clean up after need to get paid too.

IF you want to do a work shop, those are extra because of the cost of material. The $1900 Ryan Neil workshop includes Yamadori material. That particular workshop is a bit pricy for me so I wouldnt be doing that one either. There are workshops from $50and up, but many with trees are around $200 for the cost of the material (I assume it isnt junk material).
You get a prebonsai and work on it in the room with the instructor/professional giving advice if you want it. It is your tree and you keep it at the end.

This is not a pros only venue, everyone is welcome.

The hotel stay is @$100 per night which for the Baltimore/DC area is a steal.

I am considering driving down there, it is about 5 hours if I hit the traffic right.

 

[Paradox]

Woot Im in! I got the blessing to go! Just registered and waiting to find out if I got into the workshops I picked. Will make the room reservation tomorrow.

I decided you only live once and some of the people there might not be around for he next one.

 

[Dav4]

Woot Im in! I got the blessing to go! Just registered and waiting to find out if I got into the workshops I picked. Will make the room reservation tomorrow.

I decided you only live once and some of the people there might not be around for he next one.

I'm sure you'll have a blast!

 

[Dan W.]

In addition to Paradox's info above, I believe a person can gain "daily" entrance to the just the exhibit and vendor area for something like $10-$30. At least that's how they ran the event here in Denver.

Also, on the pricing. For the $300 (or $260) a person has access to the entire event for the whole weekend (not to mention the food is first class!). You can go to the guided tour of the National Collection, demonstrations, lectures, and even observe the workshops for the weekend without paying another dime. That is if you are strong enough to avoid the temptations of the vendor area... (Honestly I've been considering flying out to do just that. I don't think I would take any workshops or mess with trying to send trees home.)

As for the workshop costs, my experience in Denver was very good. The trees in the workshops were worth every bit of the cost, usually more. I splurged (for me) $400 on a Douglas Fir workshop with Marc Noelanders. I really enjoyed Marc. He made the entire workshop a learning experience for the paying group, as well as the observers. Each of us took our tree up to the front and worked with him on choosing the angles and future design. He then circled the room throughout the rest of the workshop helping and giving pointers to help us achieve that design. -- That Douglas fir, if I decided to sell it, I'm confident I could easily sell it for a grand or more. Paid $400, now have a $1000 tree. Not too bad! The Spruce workshop I took for $200 the same weekend turned out a tree that is easily worth over $500. I gained a lot of experience form very good teachers the whole weekend. There were workshops for $75 and up, mine were both middle of the road. I don't think anyone has to "waste" money at an event like this. Very often, you get out what you want. I feel like a got a great deal on the trees, and free instruction form a Master in the deal.

-- Vance, I'd be willing to bet that several of your Mugo's are worth a heck of a lot more than you think. It's not really about money... but when you're comparing the price of trees in other areas, you might as well realize that your trees have some serious monetary value, as well as their value to you as your own art work.

 

[Vance Wood]

Thanks for the comment on the Mugos. I am quite positive about them but alas I would rather sell one of my Grandchildren than one of them.

 

[erb.75]

I'm sure a decent part of the cost is just because things are expensive in DC...I mean, the price of housing is easily 3-5 times what we pay for here in the midwest. I used to live in Baltimore and people used to commute from 1+ hours into the DC area just because it's too expensive to live there. My sister lives there now.

Does any of the money from the entrance fee go to the clubs on the east coast? I That could explain a higher price if it's party a fundraising event. I think I read somewhere that happens with the entrance fee for the MABA 2015 show. I also know that the bonsai display at the national arboretum is available year-round for free. It has had to close part of the week in recent years because of government funding cuts, and they've been trying to raise funds to open it full time again. I wonder if this is part of the cost. I would love to go to either show, but don't have the cash for either show. If I ever go to one of these, I feel like I'd want to spend more money than just the entrance fee.

The most disappointing part of this event is that I can't go to the show in DC that is free because it's been replaced by this show for the 2015 calendar year. oh well! I just can't wait for my trees to wake up.

 

[erb.75]

ps...totally unrelated. how do I move up from "seedling" to something else? just by posting?