THIS is what happens to a refined pine when...

[Adair M]

It makes the edges look photoshopped.

You mean around the edges of the needles?

Ok, i’ll go take a few more pictures without the portrait effect. And some close ups so everyone can see I have not cut or trimmed any needles.

To me, the portrait effect picture looks exactly how it actually is.

 

[Adair M]

Meanwhile, here’s another photo w/o portrait I took last week:



And this one was taken maybe 4 weeks ago:



But I used the iPhone portrait mode for this one.

 

[Adair M]

So...You really think you're in charge?

I try!

Here’s a definition of bonsai: “Obedience training for trees”.

Lol!!!

 

[Cadillactaste]

You cannot keep a tree like a JBP in show ready condition eternally and keep it alive. This is the down side of bonsai with this variety of Pine. I have seen this tree in person and the needle length was amazing as was the ramification. If you have not grown one of these guys you have no clue how difficult getting a tree to this stage is. Most people don't have the knowledge to do it or the commitment to work the process through to the end including letting the tree run wild to regain strength. I think Adair has done a spectacular job on this tree and is sharing the other side of the coin.

Agreed...but so many you hear on a band wagon...saying they don't see having a "world class" tree a challenge. Understanding when to do what...and proceed further is definitely a skill factor many have no idea what goes into it. I loved this thread. For it's an eye opener. I knew they were work. But there knowing how to proceed is an art itself.

 

[Adair M]

You cannot keep a tree like a JBP in show ready condition eternally and keep it alive. This is the down side of bonsai with this variety of Pine. I have seen this tree in person and the needle length was amazing as was the ramification. If you have not grown one of these guys you have no clue how difficult getting a tree to this stage is. Most people don't have the knowledge to do it or the commitment to work the process through to the end including letting the tree run wild to regain strength. I think Adair has done a spectacular job on this tree and is sharing the other side of the coin.

Thanks, Vance!

I appreciate the recognition of the work that goes into a tree like this. 350 days of the year, they’re easy peasy. Those other 15 are intense! And, the nature of JBP is such that all the JBP in your garden need to be worked at the same time! If you have 10 of these, all 10 need to be decandled the same day (or thereabouts). When it’s time to thin buds and pull needles in the fall, they all need thinning and pulling! And, wiring, of course.

So, having one or two highly refined JBP is rewarding and fun. But, if I were to have two dozen? There’s no way I could keep up during those critical times of the year.

And, so, it also helps to have them on a rotation. Let’s say you have 4 or 5 trees like this. You wouldn’t want to have all 5 “take a year off” at once. Do one a year. It manages the work flow.

Ok, let’s step back to March of this year, and look at what preceded this fuzziness:

Before anything was done. Probably still had some wire on it:



Picture of me taking wire off:

(The early morning March sun felt good on my back!)



I also pulled all the old needles off. I should have done that back in the fall. That’s a job that can be done pretty much anytime between fall and spring. Jus do it before the buds start growing in the spring.

Contemplating how far to cut back:



A branch that’s grown a bit too long:



And the solution!



We put a guy wire on the branch to the right, and pulled it over to closer to where the original branch had been.

More cut-back:



A bit of wire to tidy up the apex:



And now, all cut back!

 

[Cadillactaste]

Thanks for sharing that Adair. Your dedication surpasses my mentality grasp. But I can grasp why you chose Boon as a teacher. He's taught you well...and it shows in your trees.

Side note: what a lovely home you have as well!

 

[PeaceLoveBonsai]

This is an awsome tree @Adair M thanks for sharing this update. I have a question, and I hope I can explain what i'm thinking...here goes. Would the needles we see now on the tree be the same size or smaller had you cut candles this summer (back in June/July of 18)?

In other words, when we cut candles and new candles are formed (along w/ elongating pairs of needles around that shoot), do the previous needles stop growing, slow down growing or keep growing?

I can tell by the 4 weeks ago photo and today that those needles are definatly still growing, but what would be happening to them had you candle cut?

 

[Anthony]

@Adair M ,

Hey Sifu, thanks for the images, much apprecited.

A question - diameter of trunk to height [ in inches ] please.
I am checking a rough density ratio.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Adair M]

@Adair M ,

Hey Sifu, thanks for the images, much apprecited.

A question - diameter of trunk to height [ in inches ] please.
I am checking a rough density ratio.
Good Day
Anthony

Gee whiz, Anthony,I’ll have go measure. I have no idea.

 

[Adair M]

This is an awsome tree @Adair M thanks for sharing this update. I have a question, and I hope I can explain what i'm thinking...here goes. Would the needles we see now on the tree be the same size or smaller had you cut candles this summer (back in June/July of 18)?

In other words, when we cut candles and new candles are formed (along w/ elongating pairs of needles around that shoot), do the previous needles stop growing, slow down growing or keep growing?

I can tell by the 4 weeks ago photo and today that those needles are definatly still growing, but what would be happening to them had you candle cut?

When I cut candles, they are cut completely off. And when I cut them, they are not just candles, they have formed needles. So, I’m cutting off all the foliage that was produced this year. So, it would probably have looked something like this:



Around July 4, which is when I would normally have decandled. So, virtually all the stuff you can see would have been removed, leaving only the foliage it began with. It would then have looked something like this:



All over again! All the growth from March to July, gone!

My other trees that I did decandle have new “summer candles”. They are maybe an inch long, but instead of where I had one strong candle, i now have three weaker candles. They will not grow as long, nor will the needles grow as long as the “spring candles” that I removed when I decandled. I will let them grow until the end of October, then I will thin the new shoots down to two and eliminate any in excess of two.

 

[LanceMac10]

Real "red neck"? Blue tarps ARE the rugs!!!!!

Tree bangin', as usual. Original image did look odd, figured wind......

Can't see you "cutting" needles...….

 

[coh]

Lol!!!

Oh, lord, I don’t want to KILL it! Lol!!!

OK, but if you change your mind, you know where to find me! BTW, I don't leave my JBP out to take the full brunt of winter, they spend the season in a controlled environment with a min temp of about 26-27 F. So far so good...

 

[LanceMac10]

a min temp of about 26-27 F. So far so good...

It is what it is, but I've been A LOT lower.... Somehow they made it. But then I kill most at repot or what have you...

Still got three, though....

 

[Adair M]

New picture, taken with the 2x telephoto lens. No portrait mode.



@Anthony, the nebari is 9 inches wide at the soil level. The round barrel of the trunk is 4 inches across. The tree is 21 inches tall from the rim of the pot to the top top of the tallest needle.

Next year, it will get shorter after I pull these long needles (3 inches) and it puts on 3/4 inch needles again.

 

[Anthony]

Running on a 4 to 18 + that's very masculine.
Visually very powerful.
Great density - Healthy
Thanks Sifu.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Adair M]

Running on a 4 to 18 + that's very masculine.
Visually very powerful.
Great density - Healthy
Thanks Sifu.
Good Day
Anthony

And there’s a hell of a lot more than 6 branches!

 

[M. Frary]

Oh, lord, I don’t want to KILL it! Lol!!!

Had someone tell me they should be fine where I live!
I wouldn't want to kill it either.

 

[Anthony]

@Adair M ,

Sifu,
the 6 branch bit is a Japanese quote from Bonsai Today.

"The secret of the J.B.pine is a few, but very thick branches."

I will later today give you the page and B.T. number.

Plus Design wise, it was noted how few branches gave the
effect and how many branchlets couldbe had from only a
few branches.
And how small leaves would become without needing
defoliation.

Also the ratio of trunk size to how few branches to how
small leaves [ needles ].
Without having to interfere with the tree.
Health making the smaller leaves/needles and saving
the 15 days for bud tidying.
Thanks again for responding.
Slow Turtle
Anthony

 

[Adair M]

@Adair M ,

Sifu,
the 6 branch bit is a Japanese quote from Bonsai Today.

"The secret of the J.B.pine is a few, but very thick branches."

I will later today give you the page and B.T. number.

Plus Design wise, it was noted how few branches gave the
effect and how many branchlets couldbe had from only a
few branches.
And how small leaves would become without needing
defoliation.

Also the ratio of trunk size to how few branches to how
small leaves [ needles ].
Without having to interfere with the tree.
Health making the smaller leaves/needles and saving
the 15 days for bud tidying.
Thanks again for responding.
Slow Turtle
Anthony

Well, Bonsai Today is a Magazine with different contributing artists. That was one artist’s opinion. Not a universally held one. In fact, YOU are the only person I have ever heard be an advocate of it! And I know several Japanese and Japanese trained artists. These are artists who have won the Kokofu prize, and the Prime Minister awards!

Methinks you put too much attention on that BT article.

There is NO “one way” in bonsai. Lots of people consider John Naka’s books to be gospel. His teaching reflects “his way”, not the “only way”.

Besides, new approaches and techniques are developed over time. Tastes and fashion change. Just as they did in European painting.

I have told you the problem with perspective that comes from having too thick branches. Yes you choose to ignore it.

Would you change your mind if I wrote an article in BT with my ideas of bonsai design? I could then say, look in BT, Issue xx, page xxx. See??? There it is in black and white. “Lots of thinner but tapering branches make the trunk look thicker”. Would that convince you? Why??? Or why not???

It’s funny. If you search around long enough, you can find an “expert” who will agree with anything you say. Oh, I’m not saying they will hear you and say, “I agree with that”, I mean, they will have an opinion, and you can search around and eventually find them. Doesn’t mean they’re right. Or wrong. It’s just they have that opinion.

Colin Lewis was giving a critique on a bonsai show, and he was discussing how changing the front of a particular tree might improve it and make the “flow” more consistent. And a voice comes from the crowd saying something like, “But a Master told me that the tree has decided its flowing a different way now”, or something like that. Colin laughed, and said, “Oh! You’ve met Kathy Shaner!”

So, the point is, there are many approaches to design. No “one way”.

But it would seem the dogma you are following, 6 thick branches, would tend to limit your design choices.

Edit: just from the photo, I see 16 branches on my tree. I’ll have see if I can count them. It will be really hard to see with these long needles in the way!

 

[Adair M]

Had someone tell me they should be fine where I live!
I wouldn't want to kill it either.

JBP are not as cold hardy as other pines like Scots or Mugo. Bill Valavanis told me he had a lot of his students lose a lot of their JBP one especially cold winter. They were in the habit of overwintering them in their unheated garages which worked just fine for years. Until it didn’t.

He now concentrates on Scots pine. Because of his climate.