Shimpaku pale green

[coh]

Spraying with water is not good enough IMO. Certainly won't work for juniper scale. At least use a dilute lime sulphur or soap or oil. Your hydroponic store should have suitable acaricides. But first you need to be sure what it is!

I have removed some scale from pines using water sprays. The scale removed may have already been dead, I can't be sure. But even if it doesn't remove the adult scale, it will remove any crawlers that are present, which can only help.

Regular water spraying in my opinion is part of the regimen to keep trees healthy with as few chemicals as possible. You can definitely control and even eliminate mites with just that alone (I have done it). I actually find mites easier to deal with than scale...I've lost trees to scale infestations that I just couldn't control, even with oil sprays and systemics like imidacloprid.

 

[GrimLore]

I've lost trees to scale infestations that I just couldn't control, even with oil sprays and systemics like imidacloprid.

Scale thrives in warm moist areas and coupled with fertilizers high in Nitrogen do even better I have found that here if I strictly water at the top of the substrate, have good air circulation, sun, and only mist them in that two week heat blast we get yearly scale does not occur. I must add that during the time I mist to cool them off I do not use any fertilizer. Over the last several years I am noticing that that type of regiment applies to most everything I have had potted and greatly reduces other problems such as fungal, mites, and aphids... Just my 2 cents based on what I see here and used to see in New York.

Grimmy

 

[coh]

The only trees that I've lost to scale have been tropicals that spent lots of time indoors where it is warm and dry . I suspect being indoors is a big factor. Outdoors there are predators, wind, rain to help combat the bad critters, and overall tree health is better. I do have a low level scale infestation on a couple of pines that are in the ground.

I don't spray the canopies everyday, but once or twice a week unless I've noticed a problem.

 

[CWTurner]

For color reference, the shimpaku in the video I posted is a fairly old itoigawa.

Wow, that is an amazing contrast in color.
CW

 

[markyscott]

Wow, that is an amazing contrast in color.
CW

It is. Something changed. Same tree, same soil, same fertilizer, same water, same sun, same me. Those pictures were taken a couple of years ago - today they're covered with healthy growth and you can barely tell they ever had an issue with spider mites. The only thing I sprayed them with was water and a single dormant season spray of horticultural oil each year in January. I used to think spider mites were a big pain in the neck, but now I think that they are one of the easiest pests to get rid of.

And it's not just the color - note how the water beads up on the new foliage, but doesn't at all on the old. The wettability has completely changed as well - the old foliage is water wet and the new foliage is not. Really fascinating.

 

[augustine]

I am absolutely in agreement with using a strong jet of water to keep the insects at bay and also control mites with a mixture of neem oil and soap.

 

[Paradox]

I would not use ironite on a bonsai. The product may be high in arsenic and some heavy metals.

 

[Vance Wood]

Aside from the Spider mites it appears that you may have scale as well, I can actually see them. I don't think you are giving the tree enough. There is definitely something worng. It is really a problem to get a Kishu to push a lot of Juvenile growth unless it is under extreme stress.

 

[Vance Wood]

Scale thrives in warm moist areas and coupled with fertilizers high in Nitrogen do even better I have found that here if I strictly water at the top of the substrate, have good air circulation, sun, and only mist them in that two week heat blast we get yearly scale does not occur. I must add that during the time I mist to cool them off I do not use any fertilizer. Over the last several years I am noticing that that type of regiment applies to most everything I have had potted and greatly reduces other problems such as fungal, mites, and aphids... Just my 2 cents based on what I see here and used to see in New York.

Grimmy

I have to slightly disagree: Scale in Michigan especially Pine Scale will hit in may and again in July. There seems to be a scale that attacks the Junipers as well and must be closely related as it acts the same way.

 

[MichaelS]

I have removed some scale from pines using water sprays. The scale removed may have already been dead, I can't be sure. But even if it doesn't remove the adult scale, it will remove any crawlers that are present, which can only help.

Exactly. you remove some, even most. But not all

You can definitely control and even eliminate mites with just that alone (I have done it).

You cannot eliminate them that way. (unless maybe if you have a couple of trees and you jet spray 2 or 3 times per week. I don't want to control them I want to exterminate them. The sometimes hysterical aversion to chemicals is unwarranted. Most of the newer chemical controls used in the West now are quite safe if used properly. They don't work as well as the old ones but they work better than water.

 

[markyscott]

Aside from the Spider mites it appears that you may have scale as well, I can actually see them. I don't think you are giving the tree enough. There is definitely something worng. It is really a problem to get a Kishu to push a lot of Juvenile growth unless it is under extreme stress.

?

Are you talking to me? It's beaded drops of water, as I mentioned. Not scale. I appreciate your concern, but the trees are fine. The photographs were taken a couple of years ago - I posted them to demonstrate the results of blasting away with increasingly harsh and ineffective chemicals to eliminate a mite infestation that is easily controlled by other methods. Some will prefer to blast away anyway despite that lesson and what is discussed in the references I posted. And that's totally fine - not my garden, time, money or trees. I made my point and the OP can take my suggestion or leave it.

 

[coh]

You cannot eliminate them that way. (unless maybe if you have a couple of trees and you jet spray 2 or 3 times per week.

Um, yeah, you can, and I have. And yes, it was an infestation on just a couple of trees and I sprayed every day until they were eliminated.

I don't want to control them I want to exterminate them.

See previous statement.

The sometimes hysterical aversion to chemicals is unwarranted. Most of the newer chemical controls used in the West now are quite safe if used properly. They don't work as well as the old ones but they work better than water.

I don't have a "hysterical aversion to chemicals" and find your characterization quite insulting. I have acquired quite the chemical arsenal over the past few years. However, I always choose to use the least dangerous option first, and for mites that is water. You may choose differently, but that doesn't mean I have a "hysterical aversion." Even the "safer" chemicals, when used properly, have impacts, and we may not fully understand all the impacts until years later (see imidacloprid, bees).

 

[dirk hoorelbeke]

Not said before unless i've read over it. Move the sick (spider mites imho) tree away from your healthy ones...

 

[armetisius]

It really looks like spider mite damage. Doesn't have to be, but that would be my first suspicion. Several times a week and you'll really keep populations down. The pale color will not go away. It has to be replaced by new growth.

http://www.ent.uga.edu/pest-management/GA-Pest-Management-2016-Home-ORNAMENTAL.pdf

 

[vaibatron]

http://www.ent.uga.edu/pest-management/GA-Pest-Management-2016-Home-ORNAMENTAL.pdf

You've got to be kidding me...Green Light?

Laughable man!

 

[Paradox]

I had scale on one of my mugos last year that were in between the 2 needles in the cluster and way down where the needle pair comes out of the sheath.

I defy you to blow scale off there with a stream of water. You'll remove the needles first.

I take no chances with things any more. Ive spent to much time and money on my trees to risk them when it's something I can easily control. That way it doesn't become a long term problem.

I've had to spray insecticides maybe 6 times in 5 years and most of those was the scale infestation on this one pine which I treated 3 times because it was kinda bad.
The tree is still alive though.

Usually it's one treatment and it's done.

 

[markyscott]

http://www.ent.uga.edu/pest-management/GA-Pest-Management-2016-Home-ORNAMENTAL.pdf

Use it. Use all of them. Good luck.

 

[coh]

I love that they recommend imidacloprid for scale insects. Maybe they should read this:

http://aenews.wsu.edu/Jan02AENews/DavidJames/DavidJamesPDF.pdf (title: Imidacloprid Boosts TSSM Egg Production)

 

[coh]

I had scale on one of my mugos last year that were in between the 2 needles in the cluster and way down where the needle pair comes out of the sheath.

I defy you to blow scale off there with a stream of water. You'll remove the needles first.

You don't have to "defy" anyone as no one suggested you try to do that. No one suggested you could remove all the scale from all the nooks and crannies with water. Basic reading comprehension. For those situations, chemicals are appropriate.

 

[MichaelS]

Um, yeah, you can, and I have. And yes, it was an infestation on just a couple of trees and I sprayed every day until they were eliminated.


See previous statement.


I don't have a "hysterical aversion to chemicals" and find your characterization quite insulting. I have acquired quite the chemical arsenal over the past few years. However, I always choose to use the least dangerous option first, and for mites that is water. You may choose differently, but that doesn't mean I have a "hysterical aversion." Even the "safer" chemicals, when used properly, have impacts, and we may not fully understand all the impacts until years later (see imidacloprid, bees).

I'm sorry if you thought I was referring to you personally coh. I don't pretend to know your feelings on the subject. It was a general statement released into the ether. Apologise for the misunderstanding