Seiju!

[JoeR]

This is a very small seiju elm that came a few days ago from Plantcitybonsai.com.

With this tree I see two possible options:
1) Put in the ground and trunk chop after year 3 or so, depending.
2) Create a naturalistic literati style tree by a big cutback and some bending.

I took some cuttings today that I would rather grow out instead of this one so really I am left with option 2.

I think I can pull off option two and make it believable, despite the small trunk size. However the issue is that it lacks any sort of movement. I would like to add a few slight bends in it but the wood is very stiff and I am afraid I will crack it.

I think I could just use raffia and (double) wire to bend it, would that be right? Is now a good time for this?

It is an elm afterall, so I expect that I can do this butyou never know.

Its small; trunk size of 1/2-2/3 of an inch.

Any design ideas welcome.

 

[Smoke]

This is a really unfortunate piece of material. Were there pictures before you purchased this?

 

[erb.75]

you do have other options...you could air layer right below the branches start up top and get a really nice shohin!

i don't think the elm will bend, even at 1/2 an inch...i have lots of elms and by that point I'd be surprised if it bends. If you try it, let me know if it works. And wrap it really tightly, like 10 times...lol.

 

[erb.75]

my personal opinion is that you won't be able to make enough bends to be happy with it. I'd air layer off the top (or just chop the top off and stick it in a pot...elms take hardwood cuttings pretty well. and then chop off everything else down to about 1'' above the roots

you will want to create movement in your trunk, and this is the BEST way (vs bending). This is what experience has taught me with elms. Plus, now you'll have more trees. Elms grow so fast that you will not have to wait that long to get several nice trees out of this. I took cuttings off of my yatsubusa elm this year and now have at least 15-30 more trees, some as thick as 1''

 

[erb.75]

the bad news: you purchased a tree that needs a lot of work and time in order to look great. it's going to be a few years
the good news: you purchased a species that is a slam dunk for bonsai work. it's a REALLY nice species to work with and you'll eventually have killer plants if you plan for the long term correctly

 

[JoeR]

you do have other options...you could air layer right below the branches start up top and get a really nice shohin!

i don't think the elm will bend, even at 1/2 an inch...i have lots of elms and by that point I'd be surprised if it bends. If you try it, let me know if it works. And wrap it really tightly, like 10 times...lol.

I did consider that too but Its too late to do it this year, only have 2-3 months of growing left.

This is a really unfortunate piece of material. Were there pictures before you purchased this?

I assume youre asking if I saw pictures of it before I bought it? If so, no I did not ask for pictures although I could have.

 

[erb.75]

and starting with a trunk that's at least 1/2'' thick is sooooo much better than starting with a twig. you'll actually be able to get a really great shohin out of this in a few years.

If you want to do literati (which I am attempting to do with several deciduous trees like my elms), you CAN do it, but you're going to want MORE movement in your trunk that will look the BEST with multiple trunk chops. trust me on that. Chop it now, then wire the new shoots into cool shapes and it'll be hella tight

 

[JoeR]

the bad news: you purchased a tree that needs a lot of work and time in order to look great. it's going to be a few years
the good news: you purchased a species that is a slam dunk for bonsai work. it's a REALLY nice species to work with and you'll eventually have killer plants if you plan for the long term correctly

Yup I ordered this as a mother tree to get more trees out of! Thats why I really didnt require pictures before I purchased it. I just wanted a seiju of any sort.

I cant chop it now, can I?

 

[erb.75]

honestly, i'm not sure!

 

[erb.75]

my gut tells me to wait

 

[erb.75]

probably the best time is just after the 1st set of leaves harden off if you want the top to grow into a new tree

 

[erb.75]

so spring probably

 

[Smoke]

If you want to do literati (which I am attempting to do with several deciduous trees like my elms), you CAN do it, but you're going to want MORE movement in your trunk that will look the BEST with multiple trunk chops. trust me on that. Chop it now, then wire the new shoots into cool shapes and it'll be hella tight

honestly, i'm not sure!

Classic internet here.

Everyone should learn how to do bonsai via the internet.

 

[JoeR]

Hah thanks for telling me what I was denying even though I knew it was what I should do: let it grow and chop it!

Actually, I have a few pictures saved on my phone that I was aiming for before I bought it:
Or like some that were on bonsaiwest.

 

[erb.75]

Classic internet here.

Everyone should learn how to do bonsai via the internet.

hahah thanks for pointing that out. of course, what I meant to say was that the first thing he should do is trunk chop when trying to style this tree, BUT only when the time is right.

It's funny how the message got so jumbled

 

[erb.75]

see the fat part of the trunk in the picture you posted? right below the first branch? that's probably where the owner of that tree trunk chopped once the trunk got thick enough. everything else was grown on top of that 1-2'' height

 

[Smoke]

see the fat part of the trunk in the picture you posted? right below the first branch? that's probably where the owner of that tree trunk chopped once the trunk got thick enough. everything else was grown on top of that 1-2'' height

....and probably over a period of 10 years, not counting the years it took to get the trunk to the size of the first chop. So maybe 20 years to this point???

 

[JoeR]

....and probably over a period of 10 years, not counting the years it took to get the trunk to the size of the first chop. So maybe 20 years to this point???

What do you suggest I do?

Or like this one that was sold on bonsaiwest.com:

 

[M. Frary]

This doesn't look like it was ever chopped. Who chops pencil thin trunks up high like that?
Since you live where you do,plant it in the ground. They will thicken up there much faster than in any pot or bucket. Let a couple branches that will pop out at the base grow freely to thicken the base. Once it grows to the desired thickness chop it at the appropriate height. Leave it in the ground. Grow the next section to the proper thickness,chop again. Repeat.
These do grow slower than a regular Chinese elm but still do alright.
I killed mine this winter but am now saving to get an even better trunk. They can take cold but 35 below was a little too much.

 

[coh]

Put it in the ground.