Olive stump

[ConorDash]

found some more images of what i had in mind, but didnt go to plan, but i think the canopy can still be achieved, all boils down to what you like and what the material is better suited to........

the next step of carving would of been to hollow the tree from the top down, similar to the image fourth tree down.

Lol. Yeh, no I gotcha in terms of that image.. I am with you but I simply thought it needs more primary branching, more branches from the trunk to achieve more of a broom style?
That’s what I think I can’t get.. unless I treat that main bigger branch as an extended trunk and get as much branching from that?

I gotta find some time to maybe do just a rough virt of my thinking..

See the carving I’m intimidated by currently... which is my problem..

 

[ConorDash]

Lol. Yeh, no I gotcha in terms of that image.. I am with you but I simply thought it needs more primary branching, more branches from the trunk to achieve more of a broom style?
That’s what I think I can’t get.. unless I treat that main bigger branch as an extended trunk and get as much branching from that?

I gotta find some time to maybe do just a rough virt of my thinking..

See the carving I’m intimidated by currently... which is my problem..

@BobbyLane what are your thoughts on my reply?

I think I’ll let it grow this season. You are probably right and I could cut but I just want to firm up my plan for it in my head, before I cut.
Cutting without an idea in mind is no good.
Also I’d like to continue to build vigor and health.

That main primary is thicker and longer everyday, seriously! Almost gonna be a shame to cut but I’m grown up enough by now to know it’s necessary! Lol

 

[BobbyLane]

but I simply thought it needs more primary branching, more branches from the trunk to achieve more of a broom style?

The best known broom form has a main trunk that divides at a certain point into three or more branches of roughly equal thickness which grow out diagonally upwards from the central trunk.
http://bonsai4me.com/Basics/Basics_StylingForms.html


Cutting without an idea in mind is no good.

i posted lots of ideas for a shape and design and what i think the material suits. i suggested cutting back branches for taper.

if still unsure, then i would just leave it alone and look at it again in a few months when you have a better eye and more knowledge.

 

[Adair M]

Olives grow like weeds given the right conditions.

One thing I would suggest is next time use a coarser (larger grained) soil. Larger grain soil makes thevtoots grow faster. Faster growing roots makes the top growth grow faster.

Right now, you want rank uncontrolled growth to bulk up some branches and encourage lots of buds to break on the trunk to get more branches. And build callous around the edge of the chop.

Small substrate holds more water. Roots don’t have to grow out to find water. You want root growth? Larger substrate holds less water, roots have to grow to find it.

Fertilize well.

Wire movement in the little young shoots. Let grow. Remove wire in 6 weeks. Let grow. Cut back. Let grow. Wire. Let grow. Remove wire. Let grow. Cut back. Repeat...

You can get fancy and remove old leaves, and trim downward growing leaves and stems.

But the whole let grow, wire, let grow, remove wire, let grow, cut back process works.

 

[BobbyLane]

as you said youre not happy with the amount of branches coming from the main trunk, probably best to go with what Adair says and try to induce further backbudding.
Kaizen number 3 i believe is a good soil for olives, i believe there is a write up on the kaizen website.

 

[ConorDash]

Olives grow like weeds given the right conditions.

One thing I would suggest is next time use a coarser (larger grained) soil. Larger grain soil makes thevtoots grow faster. Faster growing roots makes the top growth grow faster.

Right now, you want rank uncontrolled growth to bulk up some branches and encourage lots of buds to break on the trunk to get more branches. And build callous around the edge of the chop.

Small substrate holds more water. Roots don’t have to grow out to find water. You want root growth? Larger substrate holds less water, roots have to grow to find it.

Fertilize well.

Wire movement in the little young shoots. Let grow. Remove wire in 6 weeks. Let grow. Cut back. Let grow. Wire. Let grow. Remove wire. Let grow. Cut back. Repeat...

You can get fancy and remove old leaves, and trim downward growing leaves and stems.

But the whole let grow, wire, let grow, remove wire, let grow, cut back process works.

Definitely, I’ll take the larger particle size recommendation on board, thank you .

The cut grow wire, I’m familiar with. I certainly could have wired more movement in to these branches last year (potentially still can, I’ll have a look). But they will be cut short so hopefully I’ve not wasted too much time or potential.
+ hopefully the cut back can help induce further back budding.
Thanks for your suggestions Adair, I appreciate it.
If you’ve any progressions showing off your time or technique with an olive, please do link me. Alternatively I’ll go hunting about.

as you said youre not happy with the amount of branches coming from the main trunk, probably best to go with what Adair says and try to induce further backbudding.
Kaizen number 3 i believe is a good soil for olives, i believe there is a write up on the kaizen website.

Thanks Bobby, yeah I’m very much behind your previous post info, the best brooms having 2-4 main primaries. I’m aiming for that with this but I think I’ve only 2 at the moment.

Do you think the kaizen mix will promote better growth than 100% inorganic? I know this varies per species and what they like but would it genuinely make a large difference?
I quite liked the simplicity of my inorganic cat litter.

 

[BobbyLane]

Definitely, I’ll take the larger particle size recommendation on board, thank you .

The cut grow wire, I’m familiar with. I certainly could have wired more movement in to these branches last year (potentially still can, I’ll have a look). But they will be cut short so hopefully I’ve not wasted too much time or potential.
+ hopefully the cut back can help induce further back budding.
Thanks for your suggestions Adair, I appreciate it.
If you’ve any progressions showing off your time or technique with an olive, please do link me. Alternatively I’ll go hunting about.



Thanks Bobby, yeah I’m very much behind your previous post info, the best brooms having 2-4 main primaries. I’m aiming for that with this but I think I’ve only 2 at the moment.

Do you think the kaizen mix will promote better growth than 100% inorganic? I know this varies per species and what they like but would it genuinely make a large difference?
I quite liked the simplicity of my inorganic cat litter.

Ive not looked into it much tbh, this article should tell you all you need to know about growing them in your climate

https://www.kaizenbonsai.com/bonsai...of-the-mediterranean-the-olive-tree-as-bonsai

 

[ConorDash]

Ive not looked into it much tbh, this article should tell you all you need to know about growing them in your climate

https://www.kaizenbonsai.com/bonsai...of-the-mediterranean-the-olive-tree-as-bonsai

I remember reading this a while ago, I will reread. I meant more about that mix compared to the one I use.. Kaizen will always say their mix is best, right? Lol. So I just wanted to get your take on it, experience

 

[BobbyLane]

Adair suggested to you to try a courser, faster draining soil, with larger particles in it, which is why i pointed out the kaizen 3 mix to you

https://www.kaizenbonsai.com/premium-bonsai-compost-no3-superior-drainage-mix it has all the components highlighted in the olive article, pumice, large particle chipped pine bark

i flitted around with olives for a few months before losing interest in them, so my experiences are limited.

ive used kaizen 1 or 2 on all deciduous trees and so far so good really. ive tried the number 3 on yews and i might have used some on an olive at one point or another, i find number 3 dries out extremely quickly on my balcony in a bonsai pot so i tend to do my own mixes. thats why you have to try stuff for yourself and see what works in your garden, hope that helps. all the write ups are in the links, this was how i learnt. by reading and then experimenting.

you only have one olive, so i guess it wouldnt hurt to try a small bag of number 3 at some point, its pretty cheap for a small sack. after sampling various ready made mixes and components you tend to get a feel for trying your own mixes.

 

[ConorDash]

Adair suggested to you to try a courser, faster draining soil, with larger particles in it, which is why i pointed out the kaizen 3 mix to you

https://www.kaizenbonsai.com/premium-bonsai-compost-no3-superior-drainage-mix it has all the components highlighted in the olive article, pumice, large particle chipped pine bark

i flitted around with olives for a few months before losing interest in them, so my experiences are limited.

ive used kaizen 1 or 2 on all deciduous trees and so far so good really. ive tried the number 3 on yews and i might have used some on an olive at one point or another, i find number 3 dries out extremely quickly on my balcony in a bonsai pot so i tend to do my own mixes. thats why you have to try stuff for yourself and see what works in your garden, hope that helps. all the write ups are in the links, this was how i learnt. by reading and then experimenting.

you only have one olive, so i guess it wouldnt hurt to try a small bag of number 3 at some point, its pretty cheap for a small sack. after sampling various ready made mixes and components you tend to get a feel for trying your own mixes.

That does help, thanks.
I know that some species prefer different substrate.

Funny thing is, I’ve read in a few places now (like that kaizen link), that olives like free draining medium, above all else.
What is more free draining that inorganic, like I’m using? Apart from a large particle mix, a Adair suggests. It would seem as if the mix I use now, is good for that.
Or perhaps I could use Kaizen No. 3 and add more of my inorganic to it...

In the end, these small alterations probably make such a small difference.. the kinda thing someone like W.P. might say is a waste of time. We could spend so long testing and discussing.. perhaps unnecessary effort and “stress”.
Anyways, thinking out loud here. Will do more research and try a different substrate next time in either case .

 

[BobbyLane]

mate, if youre happy using pure cat litter, then carry on using pure cat litter.

 

[ConorDash]

mate, if youre happy using pure cat litter, then carry on using pure cat litter.

I’m happy to take on board different ways and try it out

 

[Adair M]

Thanks for your suggestions Adair, I appreciate it.
If you’ve any progressions showing off your time or technique with an olive, please do link me.

I have several nice olives, but I think this progression should suit the purpose:

As purchased:



Let grow:


Cutback and wire:



More to follow...

 

[Adair M]

More Olive progression;

Let grow:



Time to begin reducing rootball for bonsai pot:


I actually cut more off the bottom after I took the picture.

Potted and wired:



Cut back:



Wait! There’s more...

 

[Adair M]

More Shohin Olive progression:



See what I mean about them growing like weeds?

And you have to let them do it to stay strong! Let them grow, then cut back as hard as you want. If they’re strong, you’ll be rewarded with tons of backbudding!

 

[Adair M]

And you’ll just have to wait a bit for the final image now that it’s been repotted again! I’m not at home, and somehow, I don’t have a picture!

 

[ConorDash]

And you’ll just have to wait a bit for the final image now that it’s been repotted again! I’m not at home, and somehow, I don’t have a picture!

Very good , thank you.
I associate cut and grow with Elms, that basically looks to be the same with Olives.
I’ll let it grow and cut back in late winter/early spring, as you advised. Also put some time in to more of a final image in my head.

I’ve not had it on the table and just looked at it. Not given it the proper time to just look and see.

I hope it grows like that much of a weed in my climate though! They like warmth, we don’t get as much round here! .

 

[Adair M]

And you’ll just have to wait a bit for the final image now that it’s been repotted again! I’m not at home, and somehow, I don’t have a picture!

As promised:

 

[amcoffeegirl]

This little one is on FB auction right now.
If I thought I could grow it I would definitely grab it.

 

[Adair M]

This little one is on FB auction right now.
If I thought I could grow it I would definitely grab it.
View attachment 206167View attachment 206168

Yes, that’s a nice one! If I didn’t already have 4 olives, I’d buy it in a heartbeat!