Pitoon
Imperial Masterpiece
Make what you feel. I didn't see anything wrong with that pot, other than the drainage. What a shame that it broke.
Need opinions on my pot
- Thread starter August44
- Start date
Make what you feel. I didn't see anything wrong with that pot, other than the drainage. What a shame that it broke.
Gsquared
Shohin
I think it looks damned good for your first venture into pots. Sorry it broke while taking out the zig zags. And I don’t think there’s anything wrong with stains or oxides on pots. A lot of clay bodies are very light and fire very pale. I encounter that issue because the studio where I work only allows a few clays to be used. We fire to cone 10 reduction and many darker clays available here are cone 6 or lower and will slump or even melt at cone 10. I’ve tried all manner of different mixes, but getting a colorant evenly wedged into 10 lbs of clay is nearly impossible without a pug mill.
I think the wall thickness is fine. I often have customers note that my pots are heavy. Yes, they are intentionally that way. I have lost far to many pots to wind and raccoons, so a little thicker wall is dandy by me. As someone mentioned earlier, these are bonsai pots, not mugs. A thicker wall has advantages too, more insulation against cold and heat. There seems to be an issue that people equate thinner walls with better quality. That really is more a critique of one’s wheel skills and much less so in hand building. Perhaps with fine porcelains it may apply , but try making an 18” cascade pot w porcelain ( yes, right now I am slow drying an 18” cascade I'm doing on commission) In general I set the roller to 1/4 in for slab building. Walls hold up and I can actually accomplish much more that if I was doing an 1/8 wall.
Looks like you are off to a great start.cant wait to see more!
I think the wall thickness is fine. I often have customers note that my pots are heavy. Yes, they are intentionally that way. I have lost far to many pots to wind and raccoons, so a little thicker wall is dandy by me. As someone mentioned earlier, these are bonsai pots, not mugs. A thicker wall has advantages too, more insulation against cold and heat. There seems to be an issue that people equate thinner walls with better quality. That really is more a critique of one’s wheel skills and much less so in hand building. Perhaps with fine porcelains it may apply , but try making an 18” cascade pot w porcelain ( yes, right now I am slow drying an 18” cascade I'm doing on commission) In general I set the roller to 1/4 in for slab building. Walls hold up and I can actually accomplish much more that if I was doing an 1/8 wall.
Looks like you are off to a great start.cant wait to see more!
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sorce
Nonsense Rascal
Do you mean Queens English wedging?
Or Queens English Kneading?
(US English wedging with hands?)
Actual wedging is quite the brilliantly quick way to mix 2 clays.
You can slurry up a concentrated colored mix and slap it into the regular.
Sorce
Gsquared
Shohin
you
You knead dough, you wedge clay. Both are the same physical action with very different results from the oven!
It is easy to wedge a little colorant into a handful of clay, but into a big lump sufficient to make a 14" pot, not so easy. Especially if you are trying to get a consistent, homogeneous blend of color. What I've tried recently was to take a bunch of scrap clay, dry it to bone dry, then rehydrate with colorants added. Mix using a drill with a paint mixer. I have a few pots in the works using the clay (with about 1 teaspoon of cobalt, a little black mason stain slip and a little red iron slip for good measure). I've not gotten anything out of the glaze firing yet, so am looking forward to seeing the results.
You knead dough, you wedge clay. Both are the same physical action with very different results from the oven!
It is easy to wedge a little colorant into a handful of clay, but into a big lump sufficient to make a 14" pot, not so easy. Especially if you are trying to get a consistent, homogeneous blend of color. What I've tried recently was to take a bunch of scrap clay, dry it to bone dry, then rehydrate with colorants added. Mix using a drill with a paint mixer. I have a few pots in the works using the clay (with about 1 teaspoon of cobalt, a little black mason stain slip and a little red iron slip for good measure). I've not gotten anything out of the glaze firing yet, so am looking forward to seeing the results.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
Kneading and Wedging clay are different actions.
Wedging clay by the Queen's English is easy to blend 2.
Sorce
AlainK
Imperial Masterpiece
Hi Peter44,
Congrats for your work, neatly done.
It's always a challenge to find the right tree for a pot, or the right pot for a tree, but you did a fine job.
Congrats for your work, neatly done.
It's always a challenge to find the right tree for a pot, or the right pot for a tree, but you did a fine job.
Gsquared
Shohin
I think we are rapidly heading toward a tomato tomahto argument here. Either way, incorporating, by hand, a colorant EVENLY into a clay body is something that is nearly impossible with a large ball of workable clay...at least in my experience. So I choose to use stains...kill me!
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
AlainK
Imperial Masterpiece
Couldn't find the passage about "tomahtoes/tomeitoes", but this one sounds funny enough:
Gsquared
Shohin
Of course...Singing in the Rain! "And I caaaaan't stan' him." Best movie to watch when you're on the couch with a cold...and The Andromeda Strain.
Tomato/tomahto is from the Gershwin song Let's Call the Whole Thing Off from some Fred and Ginger movie i think. "You Say to tomato and I say tomahto, you say potato and I say potahto. Tomato tomahto, potato potahto, let's call the whole thing off." Etc. etc.
Tomato/tomahto is from the Gershwin song Let's Call the Whole Thing Off from some Fred and Ginger movie i think. "You Say to tomato and I say tomahto, you say potato and I say potahto. Tomato tomahto, potato potahto, let's call the whole thing off." Etc. etc.
I have made 8 new pots using suggestions etc mentioned here. Remember, I hand throw. They are anywhere from 12" round to 16" free form pots. I just glaze fired 3 of the smaller ones and they all came out warped to the degree that I will not keep them. Huge disappointment after all of that work. So that you can give me suggestions, I will explain how these are made and maybe I am doing something wrong. I am using Laguna WC394 special red clay, cone 5-6 with correct glazes. Cut clay from block and wedge, roll out on slab roller 3/8-1/2" thick. Work over both sides with plastic drywall tool and get all air bubbles out. Put over (drape) plaster molds and shape. Add feet and décor that I need. Leave on mold for as long as possible before removing. Cover and dry slowly. Work over areas that need trimming etc at correct time and level feet. Bone dry and still very round and not warped in any way. Bisque at 04, glaze at cone 5. Now where in that process did I screw up? I am thinking it might be the clay, but have nothing to support that. I called Laguna and he said maybe it was when I transferred from slab roller table to work table...slab was not kept flat. That is true...I picked it up by one end and put it on work table or if it was a bigger piece, I would carry it by opposite sides to the table with a bow in the middle. The shop where I bought the clay said to score each side individually and then work smooth again to relieve any tension or memory that might be in the clay. Help/suggestions appreciated. Thanks in advance. Peter
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
"Throw" usually means wheel, not that it matters here!
You should be wedging the bubbles out.
Save your ribbing (drywall tool) for when the pot has been placed on the mold. I been using my hand, you can feel more.
Ribbing's largest function for me is holding shape. Smoothing next.
Ribbing flat may cause that "memory", but I have heard memory is a myth. I believe it more than I don't. That it's a myth.
That said......
Did you have cones on the shelf?
My guess is it went higher than 5.
My Manganese Colored Bodies also Warp worst. .ahem...used to, I don't get that clay anymore, though I may mix with it for that dark color.
At over $1 a pound where I found it, that's almost good porcelain pricing. Eeee.
You can probly get better (more forgiving for your use) Standard Clay shipped at those prices.
Sorce
You should be wedging the bubbles out.
Save your ribbing (drywall tool) for when the pot has been placed on the mold. I been using my hand, you can feel more.
Ribbing's largest function for me is holding shape. Smoothing next.
Ribbing flat may cause that "memory", but I have heard memory is a myth. I believe it more than I don't. That it's a myth.
That said......
Did you have cones on the shelf?
My guess is it went higher than 5.
My Manganese Colored Bodies also Warp worst. .ahem...used to, I don't get that clay anymore, though I may mix with it for that dark color.
At over $1 a pound where I found it, that's almost good porcelain pricing. Eeee.
You can probly get better (more forgiving for your use) Standard Clay shipped at those prices.
Sorce
Sorry bout that...wrong word...yes I hand build not throw. I wedge well I think but never get ALL the air pockets out, and that is why I work the slab some after I get it on the work table. It is much easier with new clay right off the block but more difficult with odd clay pieces and scraps. Takes a lot more wedging. They do not use cones at the studio for some reason. They use electric kilns and the computers in the kiln set everything up as you enter what you want at the keyboard. Not sure how much that can be trusted. If I was to buy my own cones I would guess I would need to put a cone 5, 6, 7, in the kiln to see exactly where we are. Is that correct?
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sorce
Nonsense Rascal
Amen!
Though, since it's not likely you'll convince them to change their schedule, you might need different clay too.
No sense knowing your why your pots keep melting if they keep melting!
Can you find out what clay bodies are being used near yours?
Find out what clay is working in these firings?
I mean, if this is a your largest determining factor, their kiln control, kinda gotta work with it.
Sir .....
I think you should get your own kiln!
Sorce
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
There's good days, like your kids being born.
Then there's kiln opening days!
Get one!
I always think about this feller I was working with back in the day, told him I was kicking around getting a second kiln, for shelves or what not....
He was like.....
"Git you a kiln".
Git you a kiln!
Sorce
Then there's kiln opening days!
Get one!
I always think about this feller I was working with back in the day, told him I was kicking around getting a second kiln, for shelves or what not....
He was like.....
"Git you a kiln".
Git you a kiln!
Sorce
Mike Hennigan
Chumono
What degree or warping are we talking about? Can you share pictures of those warped pots. Sorce was using the word melting. There’s a big difference between clay melting because it’s not the correct mix for that cone, and warping. I often will find an air bubble or two in my slab and work it out the same way. I use a drywall tool for compressing my slabs as well. The best thing you can do when moving slabs is to... roll out the slab on canvass. Take a ware-board of some kind and put it on top while it’s still on the canvass, like a sandwich, flip it over so it’s on the board. The less you have to actually pick it up the better. I would say the biggest thing that might help fix your problem, from the info you’ve provided, is to compress that clay again after you put it on your drape mold. Take a smaller rib and compress the shit out of it against your form. That will help to give the clay the “memory” of that shape. It may be as simple as you put it on the form but the clay is trying to pull back to the flat slab shape where it was compressed really well the first time.
Mike Hennigan
Chumono
Also, you will find that part of pottery is doing a lot of work and having something crack or warp. Lol, I’m trying my best to embrace it. But makes up for it when something pops out of that kiln looking SO PERFECT.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
Not melted melting but melting enough to "warp".
I'm not even a fan of "warp" because that's not what's happening at all.
Just the difference in thickness inherent in a drape or slump mold will give different parts different "melting to warpage" rates.
I was pondering this making a slab round right now.
Having a well compressed rim can also "hold up" everything else. If only because of the strength of the circle itself.
The more I think about it the more I don't believe in "memory".
Sorce
Mike Hennigan
Chumono
Thanks for illuminating. I’m still learning a lot about the physical processes involved. I will definitely agree that adding a rim cut from a solid slab definitely helps the walls of you pot stay better in line.
Tieball
Masterpiece
Looks like a backwoods moonshine business.
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