Most important components for bonsai?

[leatherback]

@leatherback of course I can’t find it but I did find this one immediately so I figured I’d share it. This at a botanical garden no less.

looks like salt pellets.. I am always frustrated when I open a box with that stuff, assuming it was a more organic form. Scared shittless to put that straight in the pot, worrying about salt overloads. Seems like this guy does not..

 

[jaco94]

"The best fertilizer is the gardener's shadow"
Japanese proverb

 

[sorce]

that mists for 20 seconds every 2 hours during midday hours.

Is that ALL?

This sounds like a bad situation.

Sorce

 

[Trenthany]

Is that ALL?

This sounds like a bad situation.

Sorce

I think it’s supplementary to the actual watering though. Just to keep trees cool and moist in blistering hot dry days.

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

I had to go back because out of OP’s context I couldn’t remember. It’s controlled release fertilizer like osmocote plus.

Ah, you open the door, and the light goes on, amazing.

I use controlled release fertilizer all the time, but not on everything. CRF has very good uses, but not "blanket use". I add some to specific pots, usually younger trees I want to have growing more rapidly than my light, liquid fertilizer regime would promote. So nursery pots, trees in early phases of development get a dose of CRF, refined trees, in bonsai pots never get CRF. Then everybody, all my trees, get the same dose of relatively dilute liquid fertilizer that is adjusted to be right for mature bonsai trees in bonsai pots. That way, the youngun's get extra, via the CRF.

 

[Trenthany]

Ah, you open the door, and the light goes on, amazing.

I use controlled release fertilizer all the time, but not on everything. CRF has very good uses, but not "blanket use". I add some to specific pots, usually younger trees I want to have growing more rapidly than my light, liquid fertilizer regime would promote. So nursery pots, trees in early phases of development get a dose of CRF, refined trees, in bonsai pots never get CRF. Then everybody, all my trees, get the same dose of relatively dilute liquid fertilizer that is adjusted to be right for mature bonsai trees in bonsai pots. That way, the youngun's get extra, via the CRF.

I like this strategy.

 

[sorce]

supplementary

I hope it is extra, but still think it is more detrimental than helpful.

Sorce

 

[BobbyLane]

with that amount of misting, you can easily run into fungal problems as the leaves are continuously staying wet for large periods, so be mindful. you can raise the local humidity levels around the tree by top dressing the soil with sphagnum moss and keeping it wet/moist.

 

[JonW]

Ah, you open the door, and the light goes on, amazing.

I use controlled release fertilizer all the time, but not on everything. CRF has very good uses, but not "blanket use". I add some to specific pots, usually younger trees I want to have growing more rapidly than my light, liquid fertilizer regime would promote. So nursery pots, trees in early phases of development get a dose of CRF, refined trees, in bonsai pots never get CRF. Then everybody, all my trees, get the same dose of relatively dilute liquid fertilizer that is adjusted to be right for mature bonsai trees in bonsai pots. That way, the youngun's get extra, via the CRF.

I use a similar approach - 1/2 strength liquid on all plants on a regular basis, varying amount of CRF depending on the size of the plant and what I'm hoping to do.

 

[JonW]

with that amount of misting, you can easily run into fungal problems as the leaves are continuously staying wet for large periods, so be mindful. you can raise the local humidity levels around the tree by top dressing the soil with sphagnum moss and keeping it wet/moist.

No fungal issues, the water doesn't even hit the leaves - I wouldn't assume there are problems before understanding the situation. Works very well, and a common approach to keeping plants watered. I use moss on some plants - this is another controversial topic. Some people thing it leads to issues and should only be used before shows, while others consider it to be essentially symbiotic with bonsai. I'm in the latter camp, though I've moved away from using it on tropicals because the moss doesn't fair to well with my indoor overwintering. Some of my hardy trees benefit from moss while others don't seem to need it - my crepe myrtle will grow roots up to the surface of the soil and into fertilizer on the soil surface without moss. I use sphagnum in spaces where I want more surface roots - I have a couple boxwoods that have a start to a nice nebari, but not enough roots close to the base. A thin layer of sphagnum packed in those spaces has helped roots to grow there thus far.

 

[JonW]

Is that ALL?

This sounds like a bad situation.

Sorce

I use additional water, mostly when its time for liquid fertilization. I adjust the amount of time and frequency by the season: 20-seconds for mid summer, but I've been able to back off to 10-seconds now that the temps are 95-100 degrees F daily. Rarely do I need supplemental watering actually - there were only a few days I came back from work and and had to water (when the days were getting hotter in early summer before I turned the timer up from 10 to 20 seconds). Rather, I'll add more spray emitters on certain plants that are larger or thirstier. I tried to setup the system that it works consistently even if I have to go out of town for a few days. I will say, you need to take time to adjust and make sure each pot has adequate coverage, but this is a really common approach to watering. Maybe I'd do it by hand if I didn't have a day job!

 

[BobbyLane]

No fungal issues, the water doesn't even hit the leaves - I wouldn't assume there are problems before understanding the situation. Works very well, and a common approach to keeping plants watered. I use moss on some plants - this is another controversial topic. Some people thing it leads to issues and should only be used before shows, while others consider it to be essentially symbiotic with bonsai. I'm in the latter camp, though I've moved away from using it on tropicals because the moss doesn't fair to well with my indoor overwintering. Some of my hardy trees benefit from moss while others don't seem to need it - my crepe myrtle will grow roots up to the surface of the soil and into fertilizer on the soil surface without moss. I use sphagnum in spaces where I want more surface roots - I have a couple boxwoods that have a start to a nice nebari, but not enough roots close to the base. A thin layer of sphagnum packed in those spaces has helped roots to grow there thus far.

oh im very familiar with folks misting plants in one way or another. lts common knowledge that leaves that stay wet for too long are prone to fungal issues like black spot on some species. im sure it works very well, its been used in horticulture for many years, i would still be mindful though.

i was talking about Sphagnum moss, i use it often as a top dress for recently repotted trees, the extra humidity helps roots to establish, as we know it has other uses like inducing root formation.

looking forward to seeing some of your projects in action.

 

[JonW]

oh im very familiar with folks misting plants in one way or another. lts common knowledge that leaves that stay wet for too long are prone to fungal issues like black spot on some species. im sure it works very well, its been used in horticulture for many years, i would still be mindful though.

i was talking about Sphagnum moss, i use it often as a top dress for recently repotted trees, the extra humidity helps roots to establish, as we know it has other uses like inducing root formation.

I agree about keeping leaves dry for multiple reasons. I'm very careful with plants like my dwarf boxwoods - they will easily get fungal infections if the foliage is sprayed regularly. Sometimes I will intentionally let the spray emitters hit the branches of my schefflera to encourage aerial roots.

I also think wetting the leaves can be problematic for transpiration - it cools the leaves, reducing transpiration which maybe could be helpful in emergency for a really thirsty plant, but if you have a setup that maintains aeration (water/air balance) and including adequate water available during the hottest part of the day, I personally think it is better to keep the leaves dry. I know some of the gurus say not to water foliage while others endorse it as a good practice, but I avoid it.

 

[BobbyLane]

I agree about keeping leaves dry for multiple reasons. I'm very careful with plants like my dwarf boxwoods - they will easily get fungal infections if the foliage is sprayed regularly. Sometimes I will intentionally let the spray emitters hit the branches of my schefflera to encourage aerial roots.

I also think wetting the leaves can be problematic for transpiration - it cools the leaves, reducing transpiration which maybe could be helpful in emergency for a really thirsty plant, but if you have a setup that maintains aeration (water/air balance) and including adequate water available during the hottest part of the day, I personally think it is better to keep the leaves dry. I know some of the gurus say not to water foliage while others endorse it as a good practice, but I avoid it.

my set up is pretty much like most others, i keep my trees all outside. sometimes i water and wet all the leaves, usually in the morning which gives them time to dry out through the day. other times i only water the soil. i find that both practices can be useful especially if im adding a little sea weed or fish emulsion in the watering can. the trees always look lush after a good soak, whether watering from above or if its just rained.
using heavily diluted ferts steady and often is also common. i use a houseplant dose in a large watering can at every watering through most of the season.
i think it was Walter pall who coined the phrase, 'aggressive feeding' yeh its been around a while.

 

[JonW]

my set up is pretty much like most others, i keep my trees all outside. sometimes i water and wet all the leaves, usually in the morning which gives them time to dry out through the day. other times i only water the soil. i find that both practices can be useful especially if im adding a little sea weed or fish emulsion in the watering can. the trees always look lush after a good soak, whether watering from above or if its just rained.
using heavily diluted ferts steady and often is also common. i use a houseplant dose in a large watering can at every watering through most of the season.
i think it was Walter pall who coined the phrase, 'aggressive feeding' yeh its been around a while.

I was just reading his article, if I recall he states there are 3 factors: using modern well-draining soil which allows for aggressive watering, and, if watering aggressively, you need to fertilize aggressively as to not have weak trees (if your soil drains well and takes frequent waterings, it will hold less fertilizer). Thats one reason I use some CRF (controlled release fertilizer) - so that rain and my spray system doesn't deplete the soil of fertilizer. I think I'm going to try Jobes organic next year. I also try to make sure to use aggregate with good CEC:
https://www.americanbonsai.com/UltraAgg-Data-s/1903.htm . I'm still experimenting with my liquid fertilizer amounts. I'm currently using dyna gro foliage pro, which I like in terms of non-organic fertilizer as it has a good compliment of micro nutrients, but I felt that the full-strength dose was maybe not so great for roots on some plants. This summer I'm doing half-strength 2x week on almost all my plants. I'm trying humic acid monthly - I did low strength last month and full strength this month. No noticeable effect yet aside from brown water...

I have a few plants that are new and very early in development: a trident with a chunky base, but I want to grow out the trunk and cut back a few times over the next 3-5 years; a cork bark elm; and I'm getting a Paul's Scarlet Hawthorn and Kiyohime Maple in a couple weeks. I plan to repot them into 3 gallon pots in the Spring, and debating between a nursery pot or some sort of air pruning pot. I'm intrigued by the air pruning pots and its only $40 or so for 4-6 of them, but I'm not convinced if the benefit especially compared to using one of the many nursery pots I already have. I might plant one or two in ground, but I don't really have space (and my wife might not appreciate my disturbing the landscape once to plant it and once more to dig it up!).

 

[coh]

my set up is pretty much like most others, i keep my trees all outside. sometimes i water and wet all the leaves, usually in the morning which gives them time to dry out through the day. other times i only water the soil. i find that both practices can be useful especially if im adding a little sea weed or fish emulsion in the watering can. the trees always look lush after a good soak, whether watering from above or if its just rained.
using heavily diluted ferts steady and often is also common. i use a houseplant dose in a large watering can at every watering through most of the season.
i think it was Walter pall who coined the phrase, 'aggressive feeding' yeh its been around a while.

I like to water the foliage pretty frequently - almost every day when it is hot (sometimes more than once a day when it's in the 90s). Believe it is helpful to control pests, especially mites but also aphids/ants and other critters like leafhoppers that like to hide out on the underside of the leaves. Haven't noticed any fungal problems but I do make sure to not water the leaves too late in the day.

I have wondered whether wetting the leaves in the middle of a hot day is counterproductive and whether it might interfere with the plant's normal cooling system (closing stomata, for example) but haven't seen any evidence of problems.

 

[BobbyLane]

I like to water the foliage pretty frequently - almost every day when it is hot (sometimes more than once a day when it's in the 90s). Believe it is helpful to control pests, especially mites but also aphids/ants and other critters like leafhoppers that like to hide out on the underside of the leaves. Haven't noticed any fungal problems but I do make sure to not water the leaves too late in the day.

I have wondered whether wetting the leaves in the middle of a hot day is counterproductive and whether it might interfere with the plant's normal cooling system (closing stomata, for example) but haven't seen any evidence of problems.

yeh on hot days i just go for it, a full soak twice at times. in the earlier part of the season its been fine, but in the latter end as leaves begin to look tired ive had mildew issues on a few trees, nothing too bad but a light coating. it doesnt affect the health of the tree, but it did cause me to hold back a bit. with that said, i got a new nozzle for my can yesterday and ive been soaking them again! its been very windy here anyway.
there is a large turkey oak right beside my building that has a coating of mildew and that could be part of the problem.
a lot of others have had the mildew issues on a facebook page im on so could just be down to hot humid weather too. leaves will be falling off in a few weeks so not much cause for concern there.
i agree about the mites, they dont like getting wet, they tend to attack trees in very dry sunny spots.

 

[coh]

yeh on hot days i just go for it, a full soak twice at times. in the earlier part of the season its been fine, but in the latter end as leaves begin to look tired ive had mildew issues on a few trees, nothing too bad but a light coating. it doesnt affect the health of the tree, but it did cause me to hold back a bit. with that said, i got a new nozzle for my can yesterday and ive been soaking them again! its been very windy here anyway.
there is a large turkey oak right beside my building that has a coating of mildew and that could be part of the problem.
a lot of others have had the mildew issues on a facebook page im on so could just be down to hot humid weather too. leaves will be falling off in a few weeks so not much cause for concern there.
i agree about the mites, they dont like getting wet, they tend to attack trees in very dry sunny spots.

I don't quite understand mildew.

What I see in my yard is, trees and shrubs seem to get mildew when we have a very dry summer. Lilacs are really prone to it, but I've also seen it on an English oak in my bonsai growing bed. I think I've read (but don't quote me on this) that plants that are water stressed (too dry, not too wet) are prone to it. Now, whether there is a humidity component I don't know, I haven't done a careful study. But there does seem to be a strong correlation between lack of rain and occurrence of mildew.

Maybe there are a number of varieties of "mildew" and some are more likely under dry conditions, and some are more likely when things are too wet? Or maybe the dry period weakens the plant and then a period of rain or humidity causes the mildew to "bloom."

I don't think I've ever seen it on any of my bonsai.

 

[JonW]

I don't quite understand mildew.

What I see in my yard is, trees and shrubs seem to get mildew when we have a very dry summer. Lilacs are really prone to it, but I've also seen it on an English oak in my bonsai growing bed. I think I've read (but don't quote me on this) that plants that are water stressed (too dry, not too wet) are prone to it. Now, whether there is a humidity component I don't know, I haven't done a careful study. But there does seem to be a strong correlation between lack of rain and occurrence of mildew.

Maybe there are a number of varieties of "mildew" and some are more likely under dry conditions, and some are more likely when things are too wet? Or maybe the dry period weakens the plant and then a period of rain or humidity causes the mildew to "bloom."

I don't think I've ever seen it on any of my bonsai.

Hydrangea are also susceptible. Maybe plants with greater transpiration generate their own humidity levels on the leaves that can support mildew.?. I had some on some bonsai I purchased recently - a couple sprays seemed to get rid of it.

 

[BobbyLane]

I don't quite understand mildew.

What I see in my yard is, trees and shrubs seem to get mildew when we have a very dry summer. Lilacs are really prone to it, but I've also seen it on an English oak in my bonsai growing bed. I think I've read (but don't quote me on this) that plants that are water stressed (too dry, not too wet) are prone to it. Now, whether there is a humidity component I don't know, I haven't done a careful study. But there does seem to be a strong correlation between lack of rain and occurrence of mildew.

Maybe there are a number of varieties of "mildew" and some are more likely under dry conditions, and some are more likely when things are too wet? Or maybe the dry period weakens the plant and then a period of rain or humidity causes the mildew to "bloom."

I don't think I've ever seen it on any of my bonsai.

yes that is true. not so much on my zelkovas or elm but did notice a little on hornbeam and a hackberry.
i have used spray and it seems to have cleared up.