Marco Invernizzi's new tool - "Ichiban"

[Anonymous User]

Why? How does it do those things? I guess the second it would take me to stop and pick up something else might speed me up a mite, but how it'll make my work better is the thing I haven't heard one person actually explain. How does it help your design... or wiring? Pruning with a little more comfort maybe... but will it help you pick the right twiglet? Doubtful.... So when statements are made that it'll make your work better, I am lost.

I'm open to being convinced... but aside from pat assurances, please someone, show me via photographs what the difference it makes in the end work on the tree. But I do totally concede the tool cleaning up thing... that's a plus for sure. But I generally only use one hand tool anyway... so maybe not so much for me.

I'm sure you'll enjoy it... have fun. I have picked up Jim Gremel's and held it... the one thing I would give it is that it's very light.

Do concave cutters make your work better, let's say than simply using anvil cutters?

Do blunt tipped wire cutters make your work better than using a pair of diagonal cutters?


No tool will give you talent, no tool will pick the right branch to cut, or the right place to cut it, but the tools you choose to use certainly can make the work you do better. If this was not the case there would be no bonsai tool market, we would all be using anvil cutters and hack saws. (not to say bonsai could not be created with such, but to make the point that the right tool can help, as anyone who has tried to open a can with a screwdriver can tell you.)







Will

 

[Victrinia Ridgeway]

Hahahahha.... sorry Will... I had to laugh.. you picked two tools I don't use... one is just no use to me (concave cutters) and I cut wire with my scissors.

As to your point... as far as I can tell we are of an accord. I agree a tool can facilitate work, but I worry people think this thing is going to make them better at bonsai... when it's not. Walter did a fine job of calling a spade a spade... it's a status symbol, as much if not more than it is an effective tool.

Kindest regards,

Victrinia

 

[Anonymous User]

No use for concave cutters? Well that's another debate....another time. Although I would like to see how you remove wire with your scissors.....

I believe Walter's exact point was that the price is higher because of the names, but it is actually highly useful, maintains an edge, and one tool he wouldn't give up.


Will

 

[JasonG]

Yes Will, it is all of those things you and Walter mention. It is by no means the only tool one should use. You still need large branch cutters, you still need a hand saw, still need carving tools, etc... and wire cutters for large copper. I cut through 12 with my Ichiban but wouldn't go any thicker. Matsukuni is known for creating the highest quality tool money can buy for bonsai and this is no different than that.

What I find as kinda funny and sad all at once is the fact that so many people are so quick to poopoo the tool and talk crap about it when 90% have never seen one in person and if they have they haven't used one. I am all for the advancement in bonsai and congratulate anyone who comes up with a better tool or idea to take bonsai to the next step. Not sure why most here are wanting to poopoo innovation and hold bonsai back in the stone age?

If you were to spend a few days getting use to it then one would understand what it is about. Like I said, in bonsai nobody only uses a few tools, we have many many tools in our bags. For example many of my big trees require big tools so I would need a supersized Ichiban, lol, but I am able to use it for most things on big and small trees. I just say don't knock it till you've tried it.

 

[ghues]

Interesting points Jason. Reading throught the post I get a feeling that most see the cost as the biggest issue. To me if it replaces 4 (or so) tools then the cost seems reasonable.
What I'd be itnerested in is.................how many are sold in Japan? Or is the market for us in the West?
G

 

[Victrinia Ridgeway]

No use for concave cutters? Well that's another debate....another time. Although I would like to see how you remove wire with your scissors.....

I believe Walter's exact point was that the price is higher because of the names, but it is actually highly useful, maintains an edge, and one tool he wouldn't give up.


Will

I unwind wire the same way it goes on... very carefully. Cutting wire means you can't use it again... but let's preface this with the fact that I use aluminum wire for the most part. But as you said... it's another debate.

At any rate... I was not so much attempting to direct quote Walter... but state rather, my own opinion based on the things he said, and things I read on the inchiban website. Sorry for the confusion.

Kindest regards,

Victrinia

 

[Victrinia Ridgeway]

Jason...

Thanks for responding... I am sorry you think people who are skeptical of the hype are poopooing them. I was asking to be convinced... that's all. But it is what it is in the end... a designer label that also involves an exclusive club membership. You bought a label item that is well made... I hope you have a lot of enjoyment in it.

Kindest regards,

Victrinia

 

[Rick Moquin]

What I find as kinda funny and sad all at once is the fact that so many people are so quick to poopoo the tool and talk crap about it when 90% have never seen one in person and if they have they haven't used one. I am all for the advancement in bonsai and congratulate anyone who comes up with a better tool or idea to take bonsai to the next step. Not sure why most here are wanting to poopoo innovation and hold bonsai back in the stone age?

... and Ichiban is going to take it to the cosmos? How is not using an Ichiban keeping us in the stone age? By your analogy when Walter refers to Ichiban as a Porsche, this means by your definition that we are still traveling with horse and buggy, no wait, the stone age = the wheel has not been invented yet, or is coming about.

For those who have them bravo! I bet there probably would be more people using them if they were more affordable. I believe this is what 90% of folks who spend wisely are saying.

If you were to spend a few days getting use to it then one would understand what it is about. Like I said, in bonsai nobody only uses a few tools, we have many many tools in our bags. For example many of my big trees require big tools so I would need a supersized Ichiban, lol, but I am able to use it for most things on big and small trees. I just say don't knock it till you've tried it.

Buy me one for Christmas I'll give it a whirl, but I prefer spending $350 elsewhere.

 

[greerhw]

The only thing missing is a quick draw holster, I tried to talk Marco into it last year, but I never got through to him, maybe I'll market one.........

keep it green,
Harry

 

[Rick Moquin]

The only thing missing is a quick draw holster, I tried to talk Marco into it last year, but I never got through to him, maybe I'll market one.........

keep it green,
Harry

... that should retail around $150-175

 

[greerhw]

... that should retail around $150-175

Yeah, but it will be genuine Corinthian Leather.

keep it green,
Harry

 

[JasonG]

Jason...

Thanks for responding... I am sorry you think people who are skeptical of the hype are poopooing them. I was asking to be convinced... that's all. But it is what it is in the end... a designer label that also involves an exclusive club membership. You bought a label item that is well made... I hope you have a lot of enjoyment in it.

Kindest regards,

Victrinia

More importantly than getting a so called "designer" item is this is one that actually works better than it is given credit for. There will be no way to convince you of it other than for you to work with it. But I doubt you would still be convinced since you already have a bad taste in your mouth for it. Thats fine, not everything is for everyone

... and Ichiban is going to take it to the cosmos? How is not using an Ichiban keeping us in the stone age? By your analogy when Walter refers to Ichiban as a Porsche, this means by your definition that we are still traveling with horse and buggy, no wait, the stone age = the wheel has not been invented yet, or is coming about.

For those who have them bravo! I bet there probably would be more people using them if they were more affordable. I believe this is what 90% of folks who spend wisely are saying.
Buy me one for Christmas I'll give it a whirl, but I prefer spending $350 elsewhere.

By stone age I meant that nothing new or exciting had been introduced to bonsai in many years. It is creative innovations that take things to the next level (not cosmos like you suggest) no matter what the industry is.

To me the price is a bit spendy, sure.... but to say it is hype or a glorified bandage scissor, etc... without trying one is just crazy.

But I am done trying to fight the good fight here......those that have used one understand what it is all about and those that haven't used one well they won't understand it. Its pretty simple.

Now back to bonsai.

 

[reddog]

Jason, you have a good point about people not able to understand the value of this tool until they try it. I believe what you say is valid. But to try it for $350 is a big leap of faith. I would suggest the distributors and/or marco offer a trial period to test this product. If they don't like it return the tool and receive a refund.

 

[Ashbarns]

Jason, you have a good point about people not able to understand the value of this tool until they try it. I believe what you say is valid. But to try it for $350 is a big leap of faith. I would suggest the distributors and/or marco offer a trial period to test this product. If they don't like it return the tool and receive a refund.

Quite impractical as the second hand market would prove to be loss for this enterprise. $350 is pocket change for some people. We need more customers, who are not directly linked to Marco to offer opinions on Ichiban. Only then will you get the true evaluation of this revolutionary tool.

Ash

 

[treebeard55]

... We need more customers, who are not directly linked to Marco, to offer opinions on Ichiban. Only then will you get the true evaluation of this revolutionary tool.

Ash

Emphasis added. Good point, Ash.

I wouldn't mind having one. Like anything new, you have to learn to use it to its full potential. But I'm not one for whom $350 is pocket change!

And Walter, you're right: you don't buy just a tool, you buy a name, you buy a status symbol -- and you buy an established reputation for workmanship which gives that name its status. And as always, you pay for what you get.

 

[JasonG]

Quite impractical as the second hand market would prove to be loss for this enterprise. $350 is pocket change for some people. We need more customers, who are not directly linked to Marco to offer opinions on Ichiban. Only then will you get the true evaluation of this revolutionary tool.

Ash

Hey Ash,

I am by no means linked to Marco....I met him once and spent a day with him. This was last year. Other than that we are friends on Facebook. I do consider Marco a friend and look forward to him visiting Oregon again in the future.

Thanks, Jason

 

[Anonymous User]

I am by no means linked to Marco....

Ditto.



Will

 

[greerhw]

I can't say that, in all truth............

keep it green,
Harry

 

[Ashbarns]

No implication or bias was intended it was merely a simple statement. What I am saying is that when Mr. Smith of Alabama starts raving on about how much he reveres his purchase of the Ichiban, then we will get a broader perspective. I would think that this tool has been carefully thought out and put together, along with using a maker of high esteem, makes it a very credible and valued addition in our tool box.
Marco would never put his reputation on the line to anything that was not high quality. How about making that 'long awaited' video on how you use it Mr. Invernizzi? This is the missing marketing device you need.

Ash

 

[Victrinia Ridgeway]

More importantly than getting a so called "designer" item is this is one that actually works better than it is given credit for. There will be no way to convince you of it other than for you to work with it. But I doubt you would still be convinced since you already have a bad taste in your mouth for it. Thats fine, not everything is for everyone

Hmmm.... after some thought... I have to think you are right... It's just a personal thing. Oh well... Guess I'm just not a Marco fan-girl is all... and to borrow what you said, not every artist is for everyone. Which is something I know quite well.