Help with first tree selection

[BBNJ88]

Hey there, looking to start bonsai and I think I'd like to start with a trident maple ( unless there is another tree you'd suggest first I'm in central/shore NJ zone 7A)

The tree will definitely be outside on a south facing porch while we are crashing with our in laws.

Few questions

Would the trident maple or something else be more appropriate?

The garden centers around here are pretty sparse and I can't travel too far on account of the young kids. Any place online to get quality pre bonsai stock ?


When I purchase the pre bonsai stock to get it growing for a few years before training should I leave it in the pot it comes in or use something like the pond basket ( size ?) I see a lot of mention of those , if so what potting mixture should I make up for the suggested species ?


Side note what's the typical progression for folks get a fair amount of pre bonsai stock work on keeping those alive while reading and watching bonsai stuff and wait to start training ? Or buy some pre bonsai and a tree with training started and work on that in the interim ?


Thanks so much !

 

[yashu]

I picked up one of these last week. Arrived well packed and healthy. It would be a great starter tree if you want a trident. I would be careful leaving the tree on a porch. Not enough sun will leave you with very long internodes and a crappy looking tree.

Amazon.com

 

[Paradox]

A trident will do fine in your area.
Id recommend getting a starter prebonsai rather than cuttings or small seedlings that youll need to spend years growing out
Some good online sources with pre bonsai with a range of prices for you to decide what you want to spend on your first tree:

Brussels Bonsai - has some nice starters for $50-$150 up to trees over $1000
Eastern Leaf Bonsai - has some starters for a bit cheaper but IMO not as nice as those at Brussels

I know there are others, I just cant think of them atm.

Side note what's the typical progression for folks get a fair amount of pre bonsai stock work on keeping those alive while reading and watching bonsai stuff and wait to start training ? Or buy some pre bonsai and a tree with training started and work on that in the interim ?

Start with 2-3 trees of different species and try to learn those before getting in too over your head. There is a lot to learn and it can seem overwhelming.
Every species has its differences and it can be confusing for new folks to get a handle on the nuances.

What you do with a tree depends on what you want for the future of the tree. If you want a bigger trunk, you have to allow it to grow out. If you are happy with it as is, you can work on branch development and refinement. You really cant decide until you have the tree in hand. Post pictures, ask questions. Lots of folks here willing to give advice. Put your location in your profile so we dont have to repeatedly ask you where in the world you are. It will help folks give you the best advice.

Do lots of reading online, maybe a basic book or two, join a club. Go to a bonsai show if you can. There is one coming up in PA in April called the Mid Atlantic Bonsai Societies Show
Link:

MidAtlantic Bonsai Societies Home

 

[yashu]

Photo from the day it arrived;

 

[jkennedy2316]

I think deciduous conifers are some of the best overall starter material. They respond well to bonsai techniques and are very forgiving. Being vigorous growers helps beginners learn about development planning within a more approachable timeframe. So in your zone a dawn redwood.

 

[GREENBRIER]

Hey there, looking to start bonsai and I think I'd like to start with a trident maple ( unless there is another tree you'd suggest first I'm in central/shore NJ zone 7A)

The tree will definitely be outside on a south facing porch while we are crashing with our in laws.

Few questions

Would the trident maple or something else be more appropriate?

The garden centers around here are pretty sparse and I can't travel too far on account of the young kids. Any place online to get quality pre bonsai stock ?


When I purchase the pre bonsai stock to get it growing for a few years before training should I leave it in the pot it comes in or use something like the pond basket ( size ?) I see a lot of mention of those , if so what potting mixture should I make up for the suggested species ?


Side note what's the typical progression for folks get a fair amount of pre bonsai stock work on keeping those alive while reading and watching bonsai stuff and wait to start training ? Or buy some pre bonsai and a tree with training started and work on that in the interim ?


Thanks so much !

A trident is a great idea but most people kill there first couple of trees so make sure to get two or three. I would let it grow in the ground for a couple of years to get it thick then transition to a pond basket and use good well draining mix. For a first tree I would strongly recommend the bald cypress which is easy to find at most garden centers, they are water loving trees which are almost impossible to kill/drown (I have multiple BC siting in trays of water) and should be somewhat cold hardy in the north. - sorry for bad English

 

[LeftHandLuke]

No, I'm pretty good with trees but I killed my first three tridents. Not sure how, but live and learn. What you need is a good old fashioned (virtually) indestructible Chinese elm. Best choice for serious beginners.

 

[Shibui]

This thread is definitely showing the adage: Ask 6 different bonsai growers and you'll get 8 different opinions.

Many species are good for bonsai. To start with I'd recommend any of: trident maple, Chinese elm, juniper but there's plenty more that would also suit a learner.

Where to start depends how much you want to invest and how long you want to spend getting to the stage of having a 'bonsai' in a pot.
Many start with a starter in a bonsai pot but, in my experience, just being in a bonsai pot almost doubles the cost of a similar starter tree in a nursery pot and many of them have only just been potted up recently. I'd always go for the cheaper nursery pot, buy a suitable pot and soil then enjoy the potting up process but you'll need to make your own decisions depending how confident you feel and what might be available.
You can also start bonsai with trees from regular garden centres (junipers are commonly available).
We can also use plants transplanted from gardens. We regularly see great azalea bonsai created from trees from someone's garden. Keep an eye out for gardens that are being renovated or demolished. All you usually need is the fortitude to walk up and ask.

Note the advice above that few first trees survive the learning process. That's normal so I'd also recommend having some backups. Extra plants also helps avoid the newbie syndrome of loving a single plant to death by continually doing things.

 

[Woocash]

Welcome! Testing out the water on a bonsai forum somehow tells me you won't be stopping at the odd one or two...

I went from 0 to over a hundred trees (things in pots) in less than a year. Killed lots, kept lots, learnt lots, but mainly I've learnt that unless sufficient time can be dedicated, just keeping a modest collection (mine's currently around 10 half decent, 30 total) is more worthwhile. You will kill things but equally, if you show any aptitude for keeping your tree alive, you will likely quickly want to progress to getting some (lots of) things more interesting than the standard beginner fare.

By all means purchase a trident or chinese elm, juniper or whatever but for the above reason, I'd be as inclined to finding (digging* or purchasing) a load of whatever saplings grow like weeds around where you live and put them in pots to experiment on with soils and watering, light etc. This'll get you used to keeping things alive in pots and to home your eye in on the details for when you inevitably want to splash out on some more interesting material.

*GET REQUIRED PERMISSIONS

 

[Cadillactaste]

My go-to guy is Jason Schley. He has a nursery and is also on Facebook. I find his pricing reasonable and shipping fees not scalping.

New England bonsai I've also purchased from.

Both places shipped to me with no hiccups.

I agree with Chinese elm. They are a great species. Trident...also as suggested.

Schley's site. Note he has far more than showing. You can shoot him a line with price point.

Quality Bonsai Trees - Bonsai Tree Care

schleysbonsai.com

New England bonsai

Bonsai Trees - Indoor Plants - New England Bonsai

Browse Our Online Selection Of Bonsai Trees Shipped Directly From Our Nursery Now! Safe Custom Packaging. Plants & Supplies and Japanese Tools. Quick Shipping.

www.nebonsai.com

 

[BBNJ88]

I picked up one of these last week. Arrived well packed and healthy. It would be a great starter tree if you want a trident. I would be careful leaving the tree on a porch. Not enough sun will leave you with very long internodes and a crappy looking tree.

Amazon.com

I'll definitely try and get it out into full sun I don't have a ton of flexibility here but it gets a lot of sun back there it's southern facing at least.

 

[BBNJ88]

Photo from the day it arrived;

View attachment 585463


View attachment 585464

That's actually a pretty nice looking tree, would you be keeping or suggest keeping something like that in the small pot like that or take it out and repot in a net pot with looser substrate to grow a bit ?

 

[BBNJ88]

A trident will do fine in your area.
Id recommend getting a starter prebonsai rather than cuttings or small seedlings that youll need to spend years growing out
Some good online sources with pre bonsai with a range of prices for you to decide what you want to spend on your first tree:

Brussels Bonsai - has some nice starters for $50-$150 up to trees over $1000
Eastern Leaf Bonsai - has some starters for a bit cheaper but IMO not as nice as those at Brussels

I know there are others, I just cant think of them atm.



Start with 2-3 trees of different species and try to learn those before getting in too over your head. There is a lot to learn and it can seem overwhelming.
Every species has its differences and it can be confusing for new folks to get a handle on the nuances.

What you do with a tree depends on what you want for the future of the tree. If you want a bigger trunk, you have to allow it to grow out. If you are happy with it as is, you can work on branch development and refinement. You really cant decide until you have the tree in hand. Post pictures, ask questions. Lots of folks here willing to give advice. Put your location in your profile so we dont have to repeatedly ask you where in the world you are. It will help folks give you the best advice.

Do lots of reading online, maybe a basic book or two, join a club. Go to a bonsai show if you can. There is one coming up in PA in April called the Mid Atlantic Bonsai Societies Show
Link:

MidAtlantic Bonsai Societies Home

Took your advice and got a few books and got my location into the profile!

 

[BBNJ88]

I think deciduous conifers are some of the best overall starter material. They respond well to bonsai techniques and are very forgiving. Being vigorous growers helps beginners learn about development planning within a more approachable timeframe. So in your zone a dawn redwood.

I like that idea ! I'll definitely have to check those out today.

 

[BBNJ88]

A trident is a great idea but most people kill there first couple of trees so make sure to get two or three. I would let it grow in the ground for a couple of years to get it thick then transition to a pond basket and use good well draining mix. For a first tree I would strongly recommend the bald cypress which is easy to find at most garden centers, they are water loving trees which are almost impossible to kill/drown (I have multiple BC siting in trays of water) and should be somewhat cold hardy in the north. - sorry for bad English

The ground really isn't an option at least here since I rent and we are moving shortly. Would a pond basket and mix be a good idea for thickening the trunk maybe just take longer ?

What's your thoughts on mix composition ?

I'll have to look for quality bald cypress pre bonsai I'm not sure how hardy it would be here I'll need to look into it.

 

[BBNJ88]

No, I'm pretty good with trees but I killed my first three tridents. Not sure how, but live and learn. What you need is a good old fashioned (virtually) indestructible Chinese elm. Best choice for serious beginners.

Do you think the Chinese elm would be viable in regards to handiness here in 7a?

 

[BBNJ88]

This thread is definitely showing the adage: Ask 6 different bonsai growers and you'll get 8 different opinions.

Many species are good for bonsai. To start with I'd recommend any of: trident maple, Chinese elm, juniper but there's plenty more that would also suit a learner.

Where to start depends how much you want to invest and how long you want to spend getting to the stage of having a 'bonsai' in a pot.
Many start with a starter in a bonsai pot but, in my experience, just being in a bonsai pot almost doubles the cost of a similar starter tree in a nursery pot and many of them have only just been potted up recently. I'd always go for the cheaper nursery pot, buy a suitable pot and soil then enjoy the potting up process but you'll need to make your own decisions depending how confident you feel and what might be available.
You can also start bonsai with trees from regular garden centres (junipers are commonly available).
We can also use plants transplanted from gardens. We regularly see great azalea bonsai created from trees from someone's garden. Keep an eye out for gardens that are being renovated or demolished. All you usually need is the fortitude to walk up and ask.

Note the advice above that few first trees survive the learning process. That's normal so I'd also recommend having some backups. Extra plants also helps avoid the newbie syndrome of loving a single plant to death by continually doing things.

Understood I'll definitely go for one of those trees, if it's in a nursery pot should I repot it into a pond basket and some sort of mix ( any you would reccomend ?)

What would you suggest for fertilizer if I may ask.

 

[BBNJ88]

Welcome! Testing out the water on a bonsai forum somehow tells me you won't be stopping at the odd one or two...

I went from 0 to over a hundred trees (things in pots) in less than a year. Killed lots, kept lots, learnt lots, but mainly I've learnt that unless sufficient time can be dedicated, just keeping a modest collection (mine's currently around 10 half decent, 30 total) is more worthwhile. You will kill things but equally, if you show any aptitude for keeping your tree alive, you will likely quickly want to progress to getting some (lots of) things more interesting than the standard beginner fare.

By all means purchase a trident or chinese elm, juniper or whatever but for the above reason, I'd be as inclined to finding (digging* or purchasing) a load of whatever saplings grow like weeds around where you live and put them in pots to experiment on with soils and watering, light etc. This'll get you used to keeping things alive in pots and to home your eye in on the details for when you inevitably want to splash out on some more interesting material.

*GET REQUIRED PERMISSIONS

Haha yeah I'm pretty new to area so I'll have to see what kind of saplings are prevalent , I know pitch pine is since I'm in the pine barrens.

 

[BBNJ88]

My go-to guy is Jason Schley. He has a nursery and is also on Facebook. I find his pricing reasonable and shipping fees not scalping.

New England bonsai I've also purchased from.

Both places shipped to me with no hiccups.

I agree with Chinese elm. They are a great species. Trident...also as suggested.

Schley's site. Note he has far more than showing. You can shoot him a line with price point.

Quality Bonsai Trees - Bonsai Tree Care

schleysbonsai.com

New England bonsai

Bonsai Trees - Indoor Plants - New England Bonsai

Browse Our Online Selection Of Bonsai Trees Shipped Directly From Our Nursery Now! Safe Custom Packaging. Plants & Supplies and Japanese Tools. Quick Shipping.

www.nebonsai.com

Awesome I appreciate the advice on where to buy from I'll have to message schley and see if he has any sub 100 Chinese elm.

 

[Cadillactaste]

Awesome I appreciate the advice on where to buy from I'll have to message schley and see if he has any sub 100 Chinese elm.

Quite welcome. I do love Chinese elm. They broke my golden rule of one species per bench. I think...I've 6 maybe? I'm tired...I can't think. Sorry.