Hedging Cutting Junipers ???

[A Random User]

Wondered if anyone out there has ever tried hedge cutting Junipers ?
By this I mean not pinching, or cutting back to the next branch in the foliage,
But just taking scissors and cutting straight across the top of the pad...

Now obviously one would not want to do this with a tree in its final stages
Of development... for it might revert to juvenile foliage, and the tops all turn
Brown, but what about in the early stages of pad development where one is
Wanting to increase foliage mass, and begin defining a tree.

I remember at the end of a Lindsay Fair video, where he did just this, grabbed
His scissors and whacked straight across... saying he had years before this
Tree would be ready for displaying, and for the moment he was only concerned
With it back budding and tightening up the foliage.

 

[M. Frary]

Was wondering the same thing. Was just going to buy a cheap one and see what happens. I'm thinking like you in that it might not matter too much but would be faster than cutting out each one at a time.

 

[jkd2572]

Yes I have done this with nana and San Jose. Big brown tips afterwords, but very easy way to cut back. The tree needs to be very healthy. Like I said very brown tips, but if it's healthy it's hidden in a month of healthy growth. You then have awesome pad like growth. Can't believe you have never done this. You see this done with those awful topiary trees they sell at box stores. I do this in the beginning stages of trees when trying to build pads.

 

[M. Frary]

Ah. Ha! Never thought of that. Duh.

 

[A Random User]

Yes I have done this with nana and San Jose. Big brown tips afterwords, but very easy way to cut back. The tree needs to be very healthy. Like I said very brown tips, but if it's healthy it's hidden in a month of healthy growth. You then have awesome pad like growth. Can't believe you have never done this. You see this done with those awful topiary trees they sell at box stores. I do this in the beginning stages of trees when trying to build pads.

Sorry, my wording with my post probably wasn't to clear...
I have done this before, was just curious if others were doing and what
Everyone felt about it...

I started actually doing this along time ago, when after spending many hours
Pinching multiple trees, that there was no way in hell a mass producing bonsai nursery
Had the time to spend doing this... Even the good nurseries that didn't produce
Junk, I'm sure were not spending such time on starting off material.

 

[jkd2572]

What's the questions? Was it a retorical remark. Of course it works. Sorry if I misunderstood the original question.

 

[A Random User]

What's the questions? Was it a retorical remark. Of course it works. Sorry if I misunderstood the original question.

No, you didn't misunderstand the question. I was at the time when I posted this thread currently working on a tree and doing this
exact process. It is a tree that is further along than just starting off, but I am not satisfied with the
amount or should I say lack of foliage. And was just curious if anyone else had or was doing this...
That's all. Often I will be working on my trees and will take a break for the moment and flip through my phone.

 

[Tona]

My teacher, Roy Nagatoshi promotes severely cutting back (hedging) certain types of junipers when in the pre-bonsai stage. He does not promote hedging Shimpaku or Procumbens and I believe a few others as well. I have used hedging on San Jose and Prostrata junipers with great results, promoting back-budding and new growth.
Tona

 

[Beng]

Why! Do you all have so many trees you can't spend a few hours pruning a juniper properly?

Of course you could hedge a juniper like so many americans across the US do to their bushes but you'll leave brown tips everywhere... Doesn't seem smart for selling visually good looking trees, or for viewing them on your benches in the near future. I guess if your hiding them away for a few years then why not.

 

[lordy]

My teacher, Roy Nagatoshi promotes severely cutting back (hedging) certain types of junipers when in the pre-bonsai stage. He does not promote hedging Shimpaku or Procumbens and I believe a few others as well. I have used hedging on San Jose and Prostrata junipers with great results, promoting back-budding and new growth.
Tona

This is a tecnique (tactic?) of his for more than junipers. He does it on kingsvilles as well... =/

 

[lordy]

I get the feeling again that I'm listening to a politician. Sometimes doublespeak is just the norm.

 

[A Random User]

My teacher, Roy Nagatoshi promotes severely cutting back (hedging) certain types of junipers when in the pre-bonsai stage. He does not promote hedging Shimpaku or Procumbens and I believe a few others as well. I have used hedging on San Jose and Prostrata junipers with great results, promoting back-budding and new growth.
Tona

This is curious... I wonder why not Shimpaku or Procumbens as well ???
Reason being, the only downside I would see, would be it sending out juvenile
foliage. Which wouldn't be any different from the rest if hedged.

 

[A Random User]

Why! Do you all have so many trees you can't spend a few hours pruning a juniper properly?

Of course you could hedge a juniper like so many americans across the US do to their bushes but you'll leave brown tips everywhere... Doesn't seem smart for selling visually good looking trees, or for viewing them on your benches in the near future. I guess if your hiding them away for a few years then why not.

I will put this question back to you, why do we need to spend hours working a tree
that as we have already established is no where near being shown or displayed ???
This just seems to be counterproductive.

 

[Nybonsai12]

why do we need to spend hours working a tree
that as we have already established is no where near being shown or displayed ???

Because I like to? I like working on trees. It's not a chore, it's enjoyable.

 

[Poink88]

I enjoy spending time with my trees...this is a hobby for me after all.

If I can make it more presentable, even during development stage...I will invest that time. I do not see the time spent as waste.

Again, it boils down to the goal and each of us have different ones...which is

 

[GrimLore]

I will put this question back to you, why do we need to spend hours working a tree
that as we have already established is no where near being shown or displayed ???
This just seems to be counterproductive.

I see and understand what you mean. At my Wifes Granmothers there is a row of VERY old English boxwood that she states "are well over 100 years". She has promised those and several specimens to us to collect someday. For now as in the past the caretaker trims them as he feels is correct. I "could be" working on them in the ground but not knowing when or even if I will live long enough to see them be anything I see no need to work them. I have several large potted fruit trees potted that I am only trimming nodes on for ramification for the next 2 to 3 years before I air layer them for future use as Bonsai. Do not think for a moment I bother to take out Bonsai tools for that - standard shears do well. For those and even a few other plants anything goes so to speak. No need to fuss over what may never happen. None of us know what tomorrow brings anyways.

Grimmy

 

[Eric Schrader]

I will put this question back to you, why do we need to spend hours working a tree
that as we have already established is no where near being shown or displayed ???
This just seems to be counterproductive.

Tip pinching would be the last thing you should be doing on a juniper on development. Whether you did it with your fingers or a hedge cutter makes no difference. The strength and vigor of a juniper is in the fresh young growing tips.

To develop a juniper correctly you need to allow the runners to grow out, thin weak growth on the sides and bottom and then wire the runners. Once they reach the length that you want you cut back by 1/3 to promote side branching and repeat for the secondary branches. Only then, with secondary branching in place would you start a technique that is meant to contain the size of the pad.

And - to contain the size of the pad, particularly on shimpaku, you should still not be pinching. Let the tips grow to maintain the health of the plant. Pinch only the strong runners. To contain size, use pruning, not pinching. With a properly developed branch you will always have a pad behind the leading edge that you can cut back to to reduce the size.

Anytime you pinch or hedge cut a juniper you are either throwing away an opportunity to develop the tree further, or worse, weakening the tree. Think about the fine branch structure that you want to use to create a pad - it shouldn't be all willy-nilly full of random sized branches that go off at whatever angle. Each small branch should flow like a little trickle of water into a larger stream as it flows back to the main branch and then the trunk.

 

[Beng]

I will put this question back to you, why do we need to spend hours working a tree
that as we have already established is no where near being shown or displayed ???
This just seems to be counterproductive.

Bonsai isn't about rushing a task. Although I can understand this logic if you're trying to mass produce trees like bonsaiboy or someone similar. Each of my trees has a history and a story from the youngest to the oldest. Bonsai is in many ways a combination of timing, strategy, horticulture, and art based on the needs of each plant. Hacking away at the part of a juniper that gives it strength is probably the worst thing you can do. Junipers gather strength from their needles. When you prune a juniper you selectively prune, by butchering all the growing tips you are weakening the tree as Eric Schrader said.

 

[jkd2572]

I visited a large commercial grower of nana junipers. They used electric trimmers to hedge the trees into shape. Sort of like the ones in the pic below

 

[A Random User]

Because I like to? I like working on trees. It's not a chore, it's enjoyable.

This is what I love here at B-Nut, another trip off the deep end !!!
Like normal... some one always reads to much into something that
Is not there, and the cheerleaders are right there to raise their pom-poms,
In thanks and gratitude !!!
Go Team !!!