If you need one to use lever like in the first picture, it means a lot of force is needed so better to use decent wire to hold the bend you made, like copper and not the thinest one, and not alum as this will likely get longer due to the forces.Thanks for the input guys, the guy wires look alot cleaner, neat trick with the hole in the tubing (maybe i will try to guy-string it or use some other non-expensive wire). I will forgo the contraptions for now untill i meet someone who has a good bending device wich can be shown to me how it works
Branch bender contraptions.
- Thread starter Cypress187
- Start date
Alain,
Your drawing does show how guy wires are often used. The problem with using guy wires is that it is often hard to make the bend exactly where you want it.
Generally speaking, with conifers, we want the branches hanging at a downward angle right where they are attached to the trunk. Instead of half way out as depicted in your drawing.
Using rebar to support the branch and focus the bend and provide leverage can be used to achieve this.
Take a look at this:
Figured 16 and 17 show a piece of rebar wired to the bottom of the branch, to be used as leverage, and place the downward bend right at the junction of branch and trunk. When you place the rebar as in Figure 17, be sure to leave about. 1/2 inch gap between the rebar and the trunk. If you don't, as you pull down, the end of the rebar will gouge into the trunk.
Figure 16 shows how to hold the bend in place when keeping the rebar on for an extended time. The guy wire holding it down is attached to the rebar, not the branch. Note also that rubber pads and/or raffia are used to protect the branch from the wire holding the branch to the rebar.
Fig 18 shows how you can tighten the guy wire using a turnbuckle. You can only tighten so much with this, twist too far and the guy wire might break. Fig 18 is actually pulling the bottom branch UP, not pulling the top branch down.
Also, generally, you use the guy wire to hold the bent branch in position. Bend the branch, then tighten the guy wire to hold it. Don't try to use the turnbuckle technique to provide the leverage required to pull the branch down. You can use the turn buckle a little, but it's really an aesthetic thing. Twisted guy wires sometimes look "neater" than two parallel wires.
Thanks for all these explanations but my little drawing was just an attempt to understand how the tools from the 1st picture could work.
I don't really have the intention to use that or do something like my drawing
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
How bout a visual! You're right!
I'm in a stage of waiting for stuff to grow out before I can wire this again.....like that new bud circled in red! Aha!
Cant let it get away though.
It's really easy to tie guy wires off in these baskets.
I labeled the contact points.
It's easier to tie the bare wire on stuff I ain't keeping, or old nubs.
Keeping spots need to remain scarless so they get padded.
And that skinny root on the back is getting a little attention. A few more growing tips should help keep the trunk from losing taper as @Anthony was talking about.
Sorce
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
That's a pretty good representation of how this thing gets light blasted too.
The 2 4ft fluorescents in front.....and the extra cfl in a reading lamp....in your eye!
Sorce
The 2 4ft fluorescents in front.....and the extra cfl in a reading lamp....in your eye!
Sorce
Sorce, I've found that screen window spline works great as padding for guy wires. They come in different gauges, the smaller ones have a very small hole in the center. Good for 18 or 20 gauge copper or steel, but no larger. The larger gauge spline has a larger hole.
I like the spline better than the clear airline tubing. It's black, so you don't see it. Airline tubing, even though it's clear, tends to catch your eye. At least it does mine. It's shiny and reflective, and if water gets in, they look white. And it's usually a larger gauge.
I try to use very thin guy wires, so the spline works great for me. Thin guy wires are less noticeable. And I usually don't twist them. To my eye, a twisted guy wire is more noticeable than two very thin wires.
I like the spline better than the clear airline tubing. It's black, so you don't see it. Airline tubing, even though it's clear, tends to catch your eye. At least it does mine. It's shiny and reflective, and if water gets in, they look white. And it's usually a larger gauge.
I try to use very thin guy wires, so the spline works great for me. Thin guy wires are less noticeable. And I usually don't twist them. To my eye, a twisted guy wire is more noticeable than two very thin wires.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
Ok....which one is it! Lol.
I'll give it to you for the "sometimes"!
Nah seriously....
Yes...airline tubing can get pretty algae white ugly notably nasty.
I check all the spline at work I can "procure" and none of it is holed!
I love Colin Lewis' "we do pretty" mentality....but I can only apply it to showtime!
Sorce
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
Here's one featured in the @Dorian Fourie thread.
Another for the hell of it tree....and visual.
And a Fucking horseshoe!
Told you I was country!
Sorce
Another for the hell of it tree....and visual.
And a Fucking horseshoe!
Told you I was country!
Sorce
Sorce, if the guy wire is a heavy gauge, you're going to see it, regardless. In that case, twisting it reduces two noticeable wires to one.
If you use very thin guy wires, maybe 18, 20, or 22 gauge, you hardly see them. But, if you twist them, it's a larger wire, and it becomes noticeable.
Like most things in bonsai, "it depends" on the situation.
That guy wire running up/down in the picture is about to break. If you look near the bottom, it's twisted so much it's beginning to double up. That's a weak point.
Screws will tend to stay in the wire. You might be able to unscrew them to remove them. Using nails, or little pieces of bamboo chopsticks are easier to remove.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
This is something I haven't even thought of yet! Being all my stuff is rather small, that has needed this work yet anyway!
I see!
Sorce
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
I broke one there!
Good eye!
This is when that "knowledge of copper" comes into play!
Don't I feel like a dumbass!
Good thing it's on my PRACTICE MATERIAL! (poke Godzilla!)
I got some stuff I need to not f up this summer!
That's why I always advocate digging anything and killing shit that sucks on purpose.
Knowledge is power!
Sorce
P.S. this seems like another post that might make someone feel I'm some sort of think I mastered this here thing....
Lol. Far from it!
Adair, I appreciate our exchanges!
Yeah, that looks like you were using the turnbuckle to torque the wire. Way too much. Try not to do that. Bend it manually, and use guy wire to hold it in place. Doing that way you can use thin wire.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
I do This when I can....
You know what.....
I don't anneal my guy wires....
I think they would be easier to manage if annealled yes?
Sorce
Not really. They use very thin stainless steel wire in Japan. Definately not annealed.
Ok, if you wanted to do the one that broke over, here's how I'd do it: loop thru the copper wire spiral just like you did. Bring one end back, and tuck under the heavy copper spiral below. Start a twist there by hand to get started.
So now, you have a loop of wire and a couple of twists. Grab the twists with a pair of pliers. Using your other hand, bend the branch. This creates slack in the loop, yes? Ok, here's the tricky part: how to properly take up the slack. Pull back slightly with the pliers until the slack is gone. No more than that. Begin twisting the wire with the pliers. As you do that, allow the pliers to move forward. Almost like you're pushing back. Until the open space between the twist and the anchor wire is gone. There's no point in continuing to twist.
Now, release the pressure your "other" hand was putting on the branch you're bending. Is it where you want it? Yes: you're done. No: do it again. Grab the twist with the pliers, bend branch with "other" hand, pull back with pliers to take up slack, twist and push back with pliers until the twist is snug.
Repeat as necessary.
Eventually, the "twist" gets pretty long. You can shorten it. Leave it about 1/2 inch long. DON'T bend it flat! That really weakens it.
Give me a minute... I'll go take a picture of one I've done.
Ok, here's the picture. I'm using window spline as padding. I ran some wire thru the spline and looped under the raised root. I then took a piece of spline, bent it isn't a U shape and cut across the bottom of the U, making a hole on one side. Then I threaded the wire into each end of the spline and the wire emerged out of the hole I cut on the spline.
You kinda have to jockey the spline down into place so that as you tighten, the rubber stays between the wire and branch. Take your time, there's no rush.
You kinda have to jockey the spline down into place so that as you tighten, the rubber stays between the wire and branch. Take your time, there's no rush.
sorce
Nonsense Rascal
This is where I get shaky....
I think for the same reason I can't play guitar. I can't easily make my hands do different things.....
I met a guy once...who's hands mirrored each other all the time. Like if he was an author. He could write the dyslexic version at the same time with the other hand!
I have like 5% of that problem.
Kills me here.
Sorce
Ironbeaver
Chumono
Has anyone tried using hose clamps to pull stuff together? They're cheap, fairly strong, and easy to tighten.
I once tried to use hose clamps to prevent a zelkova broom style from swelling where the chop was made. I was too late. The swelling was already there. After two years, I gave up. Instead, I air layered off the top, using the swollen base as the starting place for the new roots.Has anyone tried using hose clamps to pull stuff together? They're cheap, fairly strong, and easy to tighten.
I'll repot it this coming spring and do the Ebihara Technique.
I think if I had started the hose clamp right when the original chop was done it might have worked.
0soyoung
Imperial Masterpiece
Just need to have your corpus callosum trimmed. Sever it entirely and the left hand truly doesn't know what the right is up to.
