Big Elm

I keep coming back to the tought of a powerfull broom styled tree

Just a quick sketch of my toughts
Get some buds poppin down low and then make a v shape like cut
It will leave a big wound and will take probably over 10 years but if it where my tree i would consider this an option

downloadfile-5.jpg
 
I like the second set of pictures - side views for a new front.
 
Out of curiosity how much would you guys pay/value this tree?
If you offered to give it to me, I would respectfully pass.
On FB Auctions, someone might throw down $125 for it, if their budget was more developed than their eye.
 
Haha yes i would. I am destructive and enjoy risk taking. That is just one of the options i am weighing up and definitely the most extreme.
Risk taking is one thing - jumping into a major trunk splitting operation on reasonable pre-bonsai material without ever having tested the technique on true throw-away material first just seems kind of reckless.

As is, I'd consider this a pre-bonsai that requires about five years of work to get it moving in the right direction, but I know that in that time it would start to look like a decent tree. Splitting that trunk is likely to turn this into more like a 20 year project, and you'd have to get lucky and not have it rot or die back as @Brian Van Fleet mentioned. I think I'd save the trunk splitting project for some beanpole collected tree that doesn't otherwise have any trunk flair. And if I were serious about it, I'd try it on at least a few different trees so that I could judge the results across multiple instances. After a few years of seeing how it responded, I might consider trying it on something more valuable, but only if the crappy tree turned out OK.

I get wild trees that show up in my yard every year - ash, zelkova, linden, elm. This sounds like the kind of thing I might try on one of those. That way, if it doesn't work out, at least I didn't spend any real money on the experiment.

As for the value of this tree ... well, that's going to be very subjective based on who you ask and what they see in it. For me, I probably wouldn't pay more than $75-100 for this, but that's because I see the most value in the base. I'd let it grow out and try to build a crown out of it, but the fallback plan would probably be to chop above that first or second branch and re-grow from there. But either way, that's a lot of years of work to get it to the state I like my trees in, so I wouldn't pay a premium for that reason.

That said, I could easily see if somebody was really into the pad look, or happened to like the style of the trunk as it is, that this would look much more like a finished tree to them and they might pay more, maybe even significantly more. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see at least a $200 or $300 price tag on this, I just wouldn't personally pay that for it. But I'm also the guy who digs around for hours looking for deals on nursery stock to grow out instead of buying trees at the bonsai shop, so I'm probably a lot fussier than most people would be. All I see is a decent trunk base that's already had the root work done. =) Please take my pricing comments with that in mind.
 
Risk taking is one thing - jumping into a major trunk splitting operation on reasonable pre-bonsai material without ever having tested the technique on true throw-away material first just seems kind of reckless.

As is, I'd consider this a pre-bonsai that requires about five years of work to get it moving in the right direction, but I know that in that time it would start to look like a decent tree. Splitting that trunk is likely to turn this into more like a 20 year project, and you'd have to get lucky and not have it rot or die back as @Brian Van Fleet mentioned. I think I'd save the trunk splitting project for some beanpole collected tree that doesn't otherwise have any trunk flair. And if I were serious about it, I'd try it on at least a few different trees so that I could judge the results across multiple instances. After a few years of seeing how it responded, I might consider trying it on something more valuable, but only if the crappy tree turned out OK.

I get wild trees that show up in my yard every year - ash, zelkova, linden, elm. This sounds like the kind of thing I might try on one of those. That way, if it doesn't work out, at least I didn't spend any real money on the experiment.

As for the value of this tree ... well, that's going to be very subjective based on who you ask and what they see in it. For me, I probably wouldn't pay more than $75-100 for this, but that's because I see the most value in the base. I'd let it grow out and try to build a crown out of it, but the fallback plan would probably be to chop above that first or second branch and re-grow from there. But either way, that's a lot of years of work to get it to the state I like my trees in, so I wouldn't pay a premium for that reason.

That said, I could easily see if somebody was really into the pad look, or happened to like the style of the trunk as it is, that this would look much more like a finished tree to them and they might pay more, maybe even significantly more. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see at least a $200 or $300 price tag on this, I just wouldn't personally pay that for it. But I'm also the guy who digs around for hours looking for deals on nursery stock to grow out instead of buying trees at the bonsai shop, so I'm probably a lot fussier than most people would be. All I see is a decent trunk base that's already had the root work done. =) Please take my pricing comments with that in mind.


The trunk splitting i mentioned would be my least likely option and if i was going to use it i would more than likely air layer the top. Let the roots develop and then split the air layer whilst leaving the original base and developing two trees.

I have a little bit of experience with this trunk chop technique. I have used it on some figs and a reasonable sized swamp cypress. The swamp cypress has turned out really well with its rapid growth.

I am excited to see where this tree ends up in 5 years time. As the very minimum i will chop the large ugly roots and use the ebihara method to try and create a better nebari.

I have no ego about the tree. I enjoy peoples opinions amd criticisms.
 
Bro bro! I'd send you a wagon full of beans for it!

Lol!

Whatever you paid for it is now the price of that pot!

I cinched an elm this year with a zip tie, threw it in the ground.
20170520_164644.jpg
There is a plastic disk under that DE. So any roots I saw coming out the basket were keepers above the cinch.
Mad roots. Cinch only.

I gotta nother that was put thru a washer, it has issued roots above it, in only about a 1/4 inch of soil/sphagnum.

The flare alone is enough. You don't always need extreme taper.

Hell, I got another that I just "made sure I covered the roots well" on, and it threw a perfect ring of Radial roots at soil level.....

Cuz it's what they do!

Ebihara a cheeseburger!

Sorce
 
Air layer that thing and get a couple nice trees with good bark. I like the top part as one tree and the base cut and start a new tree with all the new growth you should be able to a number of things with it.

I am a noob but I like the idea of air layering. Instead of chopping and tossing what could be a perfectly good tree if you take the time.
 
Air layer that thing and get a couple nice trees with good bark. I like the top part as one tree and the base cut and start a new tree with all the new growth you should be able to a number of things with it.

I am a noob but I like the idea of air layering. Instead of chopping and tossing what could be a perfectly good tree if you take the time.
More time wasted. Elms are everywhere. Unless the upper portion is spectacular I would just hack and toss.
 
I like where defra's thinking for this one. Could make a nice small tree with this. But if it's disposable go for it, will be interesting to see the development.
 
Elms are not everywhere in my area especially not this size. I am definitely in favour of air laying as it generally takes me a month to get good roots going on the air layer so not much wasted time.
 
I would chop it to two inches and regrow as Defra suggested, regrowing the apex no more than another two inches final height. That would give great forced taped and get rid of that long tall uninteresting beanpole of a trunk (which has no real future)...FWIW, this material isn't saleable to anyone who's been doing this for more than ten years. Too many time-consuming issues there.
 
Elms are not everywhere in my area especially not this size. I am definitely in favour of air laying as it generally takes me a month to get good roots going on the air layer so not much wasted time.
Yeah i've had unhealthy Elms root in 4 weeks, not missing out on much IMO.
 
This tree randomly died last year, i didnt do anything to it and looked after it. If i coukd redue this tree id have made a few air layers.
 
This tree randomly died last year, i didnt do anything to it and looked after it. If i coukd redue this tree id have made a few air layers.
Thats a shame dude, was a nice tree. Sorry to hear that. Hopefully you learnt something from its death and more over, from its life.
 
Thats a shame dude, was a nice tree. Sorry to hear that. Hopefully you learnt something from its death and more over, from its life.
Shame yes but i am not too bothered by it. I was more curious as to why it randomly died. Ive never had that happen before
 
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