Working with Nursery Stock

[Mellos]

I have a couple of azaleas that were nursery stock and I’d like to start training them. They are a little overgrown and growing in 3 gallon pots.

Where should I start working on these plants? Is it best to work on branches first, then roots after recovery or a little bit of both?

Is there anything I can start working on immediately or should I wait until spring (Zone 8b)?

 

[0soyoung]

I prefer to repot them in Aug/Sep (IOW sometime after the summer solstice, but by the fall equinox). Azalea roots are a mat of fine 'hairs'. One can cut them down to make a nice root pad. One can trim the perimeter. If need be, one can cut a few wedges of them out, but don't start ripping them away with a root hook.

All varieties of azalea will bloom sometime before the summer solstice. The prime time to prune and shape an azalea is as the flowers fade. Unless you don't want flowers, I suggest that you don't prune at any other time, at least in the beginning of your adventure with them. Flower buds are set sometime after the summer solstice. Flowers buds begin life as just another vegetative bud that through the magic of mother nature metamorphose into flower buds - fatter buds at the branch tips. You should watch your azlea(s) closely and note when this happens (extension growth stops and the tip buds start to fatten). Of course, if you absolutely do not want flowers, this is a good time for a second pruning.

There are lots of variations on this basic methodology. They are much easier to understand, IMHO, after a bit of experience. Personally, I think they are an ideal bonsai starting plant - clip and grow. Right after flowering, they can be pruned extremely hard (aka 'chopped'). They can be shaped with wiring, even though the stems are a bit fragile. They readily root by layering and from cuttings if you're into propagation.

Enjoy.

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Go to You Tube, search for John Geanangel, he has a number of great videos on azalea. A picture is worth a thousand words, his vids are good visuals of what can be done with azalea.

When you repot is in part a matter of where you live. 0soyoung is in the Pacific Northwest where weather is pretty mild year round, not hot, not cold. I'm in the midwest, where winter is frigid and 4 months long, with relatively moderate summers. I usually have less than 10 days where the high's are over 90 F. John @Mellow Mullet is in Alabama, an area with mild winters, and hot humid summers. So when to repot changes from growing area to growing area.

Where are you at? WHat climate, more so than actual address. Are your azaleas indoors? or in cold storage? or outdoors right now? The answers to place and where they are will give others what we need to give you better advice.

My azaleas are in a cool, or rather cold well house, where the temperature hovers between 30 F and 40 F. Cold enough they are fully dormant even though they have their evergreen leaves on them. There is no light in my wellhouse. Because they are fully dormant, they get by without the light. I won't do anything with them until it is safe to put them outside, about May 1.

Hope this helps. There are many posts on this forum about azalea, in the Flowering sub forum. You might have to go back a few pages, use the search function, search "azalea" and "Satsuki".

 

[Mellos]

@0soyoung Thank you for the info!
@Leo in N E Illinois Thank you too and yes all that does help! I’m located in Spanish Fort on the Gulf Coast, climate is pretty mild and variable here. Azaleas are outside, but I may bring them in one night this weekend, could get down around 29 for a few hours.

 

[Dav4]

@0soyoung Thank you for the info!
@Leo in N E Illinois Thank you too and yes all that does help! I’m located in Spanish Fort on the Gulf Coast, climate is pretty mild and variable here. Azaleas are outside, but I may bring them in one night this weekend, could get down around 29 for a few hours.

Most azaleas are cold hardy and shouldn't need protection from that bit of cold... if similar azaleas are grown in the landscape where you live, you should be fine leaving them outside.

 

[JoeH]

they'll be fine at 29 degrees.

 

[Mellos]

Right on, thanks!

 

[KiwiPlantGuy]

Hi Mellos,
I am trying a few Azaleas also, only 2 years into this.

This one flowered this Spring

Not much to get excited about re Bonsai, but you gotta start somewhere.
And don’t be afraid of chopping them down to bare stumps. You tube videos are great too.
Also great colour in your house for a month or so. Indicas flower first, then Kurumes, then Satsukis last. I think I had nearly 3 months of colour this Spring.
Charles

 

[Cable]

I prefer to repot them in Aug/Sep (IOW sometime after the summer solstice, but by the fall equinox). Azalea roots are a mat of fine 'hairs'. One can cut them down to make a nice root pad. One can trim the perimeter. If need be, one can cut a few wedges of them out, but don't start ripping them away with a root hook.

0so, would you mind expanding on that? What are the downsides of spring repotting (after flowering) and why are root hooks bad for them?

 

[0soyoung]

What are the downsides of spring repotting (after flowering)

Pretty much across the board, it is very risky to repot a plant when it is extending new growth. Azaleas and rhododendrons push new growth right after flowering, so the timing window is very narrow. Extensive growth requires a lot of water. This is affected by water inflating cells. The new leaves and new stems also lose water because the epidermis ('bark' layer) is very thin. Also, relatively little auxin is being transported to the roots to stimulate new growth during these times. If you want to repot in spring, it is much better to do it before flowering, IMHO. Aside from 'it works' and 'it is convenient for me', the list of my reasons includes

• little to no extensive growth happening in Aug/Sep,
• the plant has lots of new, hardened foliage to power root regrowth (lots of auxin production and carbohydrates available in the plant).
• the waxy leaves easily limit water loss by closing their stomata
• there is ample time to recover before temperatures drop below 40F/5C or so.

Lastly, as I indicated. I like to prune azaleas rather severely right after flowering. My plants stay more vigorous if I do not repot at the same time, but that depends upon degree, of course. One just needs a bit of experience to become attuned to just how much can be done at one time. One simply needs to risk one or more plants to see what happens. Then don't do what doesn't work.

why are root hooks bad for them?

All in all, azaleas are very tough plants, but maybe the best way to kill one is to rip away all the hairy mat of roots. I've seen pix of satsukis where this has been done in preparation to plant them in a tube of coarse media to create exposed roots. For my azaleas, this treatment = death. Azaleas, though, do have a tight association of roots and stems - killing one area of the root mass will only kill a specific branch or corresponding set of branches. So, one doesn't need to risk killing the entire plant to learn about this. Conversely, if one sees a branch or set of branches apparently dying, there is a high likelihood that there is a problem with the roots immediately below.

At any rate I said, "but don't start ripping them away with a root hook." to save all readers from the pain I have inflicted with all the meandering verbiage of this post. The issue isn't the root hook per se, but what I typically do with one that presume others are prone to do as well.

 

[Cable]

Thank you. I didn't know any of that but it all makes sense.

 

[Mellos]

Go to You Tube, search for John Geanangel, he has a number of great videos on azalea. A picture is worth a thousand words, his vids are good visuals of what can be done with azalea.

When you repot is in part a matter of where you live. 0soyoung is in the Pacific Northwest where weather is pretty mild year round, not hot, not cold. I'm in the midwest, where winter is frigid and 4 months long, with relatively moderate summers. I usually have less than 10 days where the high's are over 90 F. John @Mellow Mullet is in Alabama, an area with mild winters, and hot humid summers. So when to repot changes from growing area to growing area.

Where are you at? WHat climate, more so than actual address. Are your azaleas indoors? or in cold storage? or outdoors right now? The answers to place and where they are will give others what we need to give you better advice.

My azaleas are in a cool, or rather cold well house, where the temperature hovers between 30 F and 40 F. Cold enough they are fully dormant even though they have their evergreen leaves on them. There is no light in my wellhouse. Because they are fully dormant, they get by without the light. I won't do anything with them until it is safe to put them outside, about May 1.

Hope this helps. There are many posts on this forum about azalea, in the Flowering sub forum. You might have to go back a few pages, use the search function, search "azalea" and "Satsuki".

I watched one of John Geanangel’s videos where he cut some 3 gallon azaleas back to basically nothing, then he sawed half of the rootball off all at the same time. I thought you weren’t supposed to cut roots and trunk/ branches at the same time?

 

[Dav4]

I watched one of John Geanangel’s videos where he cut some 3 gallon azaleas back to basically nothing, then he sawed half of the rootball off all at the same time. I thought you weren’t supposed to cut roots and trunk/ branches at the same time?

With a healthy tree, this is easily done. Fwiw, I've done this with azaleas and maples, and they all respond just fine when healthy.

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

I watched one of John Geanangel’s videos where he cut some 3 gallon azaleas back to basically nothing, then he sawed half of the rootball off all at the same time. I thought you weren’t supposed to cut roots and trunk/ branches at the same time?

The ''rule'' is about cutting roots and branches at the same time is not a rule, it is a cautionary note for those working with certain much more touchy species, particularly conifers, and especially certain pines, not all pines, but certain pines. This ''rule'' is regularly ignored by those who are more experienced and understand proper after care for a bonsai.

In the case of deciduous trees, if the tree is healthy before work begins, normally working the roots and the branches, as drastically as John G does, is perfectly okay. The better your aftercare the better your success. If you are totally insecure about your skills you can drop back to separate years for the roots and branches, but for azalea this is unnecessary. If the tree was not ''too expensive'', I would suggest performing the exercise exactly as John G does it in the video will be a great learning experience and teach you confidence.

Many a spruce and many a Japanese white pine have been killed by too much to quickly. Almost never is an azalea or an elm killed by to much at once.

 

[Mellos]

Than

The ''rule'' is about cutting roots and branches at the same time is not a rule, it is a cautionary note for those working with certain much more touchy species, particularly conifers, and especially certain pines, not all pines, but certain pines. This ''rule'' is regularly ignored by those who are more experienced and understand proper after care for a bonsai.

In the case of deciduous trees, if the tree is healthy before work begins, normally working the roots and the branches, as drastically as John G does, is perfectly okay. The better your aftercare the better your success. If you are totally insecure about your skills you can drop back to separate years for the roots and branches, but for azalea this is unnecessary. If the tree was not ''too expensive'', I would suggest performing the exercise exactly as John G does it in the video will be a great learning experience and teach you confidence.

Many a spruce and many a Japanese white pine have been killed by too much to quickly. Almost never is an azalea or an elm killed by to much at once.

Thank you for clearing that up!

 

[Mellos]

With a healthy tree, this is easily done. Fwiw, I've done this with azaleas and maples, and they all respond just fine when healthy.

Thanks!

 

[eryk2kartman]

Good tread,
Thanks for directing to John Geanangel - very informative.
Seems like he is re-potting in early spring and cuts a lot of roots and branches, he is a bit more careful with re-potting in summer.

I have 1 Azalea that i might try to use his technique, plant is due to be re-potted, so why not to try, no harm, will do it in March i guess