Will Chinese Junipers Back-bud?

[Cypress]

I was just scoping out a really great local nursery today and saw this great chinese juniper. it's probably only 4 or 5 feet tall but has a a great trunk thickness between 4 and 5 inches.

I just need to know if this species will backbud so I can chop it *above it's lowest branch and use it as a new leader and develop taper over time.*

Thanks!

 

[october]

You cannot chop junipers like you would a maple. You can do some chops, like removing one of 2 trunks or cutting off a top if there is a lot of foliage left. Foliage is very important to junipers. It is a major part of their life system. If you post some pics and designate where and what you want to do. We can probably give you some better answers.

Rob

 

[Cypress]

You cannot chop junipers like you would a maple. You can do some chops, like removing one of 2 trunks or cutting off a top if there is a lot of foliage left. Foliage is very important to junipers. It is a major part of their life system. If you post some pics and designate where and what you want to do. We can probably give you some better answers.

Rob

Yea, that seems to make sense. Unfortunately I didn't snap a photo.... But I would say the one branch closest to the sol line was about... 8 inches up. If I were to chop above that and use that as a leader, I wouldn't be dooming the tree would I? I envision having that leader grow out into a slanting style then maybe curve upwards to an informal upright type of style. Maybe add some deadwood work to the opposite side of the sump... Obviously getting way ahead of myself.

BUT, my basic question is if I chop the trunk above the single lowest branch, would the tree survive it?

And I am a little confused because I've read elsewhere that chinese junipers will backbud to some degree

Thanks
-Mike

 

[Beng]

BUT, my basic question is if I chop the trunk above the single lowest branch, would the tree survive it?

And I am a little confused because I've read elsewhere that chinese junipers will backbud to some degree

Thanks
-Mike

No, it's not a good idea to chop the trunk this time of year to the very lowest small branch. You risk a chance of loosing your tree. Junipers strength comes from the foliage as Rob said.

 

[Eric Group]

Yea, that seems to make sense. Unfortunately I didn't snap a photo.... But I would say the one branch closest to the sol line was about... 8 inches up. If I were to chop above that and use that as a leader, I wouldn't be dooming the tree would I? I envision having that leader grow out into a slanting style then maybe curve upwards to an informal upright type of style. Maybe add some deadwood work to the opposite side of the sump... Obviously getting way ahead of myself.

BUT, my basic question is if I chop the trunk above the single lowest branch, would the tree survive it?

And I am a little confused because I've read elsewhere that chinese junipers will backbud to some degree

Thanks
-Mike

As they said, definitely NOT a good idea to do this! Removing too much foliage at one time from a juniper WILL certainly kill it. So, how much is too much? Depends on the tree- both the exact species and the health of the particular tree- it also depends on the time of year you do it.

Severe work is probably best done on a junk in early Spring/ late winter. That can vary drastically as well depending on your environment of course.

Will a Chinese Juniper back bud, yeah... Sure it will. You can cut a branch on a juniper anywhere along the woody stem- as long as you leave SOME green growth on the branch, and it will probably back bud somewhere for you. If you chop the trunk and remove 80% of the foliage of the tree... It is probably just going to die.

With long spindly branches, you can progressively chase the growth back towards the trunk over the course of years... If the tree you are describing has most of it's foliage in the top half of a very tall tree- which seems to be what you are describing- then.. Well... You probably need to find a different tree. The scar you would leave from a chop like that would probably never heal right either... Unless you were going to progressively kill off that portion of the tree and Jin it out, you will probably wind up with something very unnatural.. Or just a dead tree. As was said before... Kind of hard to advise you without seeing the tree, but don't expect great results from sudden drastic changes with most Junipers. Some are tougher than others, but there are a couple types of "Chinese Juniper" out there, so it is hard to tell what you are working with...

 

[october]

If there were pictures, much better assessments could be made. However, as far as what you want to do, as others said, it will be a gamble. The tree would most likely not survive. However, there may be a way to pull it off. It will need to be done in stages. You could chop part of the top off. Meanwhile, let the new leader branch grow untouched. Now, keep the growth regulated on the part of the chop that was left. In time, you might be able to strengthen the new leader to the point where you can remove the remained of the area you want to chop. This is a process that would need to span over about 4 years. Also, it will need the experience of someone who is very knowledgeable in the pruning of junipers.

Rob

 

[Cypress]

Great thanks guys! I haven't purchased the tree yet, so I may now very well pass on it. But yea If i did snag it, i wouldn't chop it this time of year. And if I did attempt to work with this tree the *very* gradual trunk choppin method is probably what I would have gone for.

It was just the astounding thickness of the trunk that caught my eye!


Thanks for the info all, probably saved me a big headache!

 

[Cypress]

I went ahead and bought it anyway! Bahahaha!

I haggled them down to a great price though, since some of the foliage was yellowing (it had just been under watered for a while I believe. Tree is perfectly healthy.)

I'm up for a challenge! Especially for this tree, if it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out. As a beginner I think it's good to experiment.

I'll post some pictures soon and await the constructive criticism!

 

[Vance Wood]

From the description you have given it seems to me your best alternative would be to start applying grafts lower down on the trunk until you manage to create some strong and vigorous growth that can handle support of the tree if you were to eliminate the top as you have described. In general Chinese Junipers back bud fairly well but not all of them. Understanding that this is not going to be a short term project you might just as well experiment with the base of this tree getting Shimpaku Juniper cuttings to take hold in the hopes when all is said and done you will have the tree you are now looking for.

 

[Cypress]

From the description you have given it seems to me your best alternative would be to start applying grafts lower down on the trunk until you manage to create some strong and vigorous growth that can handle support of the tree if you were to eliminate the top as you have described. In general Chinese Junipers back bud fairly well but not all of them. Understanding that this is not going to be a short term project you might just as well experiment with the base of this tree getting Shimpaku Juniper cuttings to take hold in the hopes when all is said and done you will have the tree you are now looking for.

Hmmm, some interesting ideas. But I've already acquired saplings and smaller nursery stock like box wood and some dwarf spruces. So Those are my babies. I honestly wanted to find a big long term project since i already have a number of little to medium sized guys growing.

For this juniper I plan on it being a tall bonsai... approaching 3 feet perhaps. And now that I have it right here next to my porch let me tell you what the lower branching looks like... lowest branch is is very long, thick, healthy and very foliated AND it is only 7 inches above the soil line (on a 5 inch trunk woohoo). The next 3 inches up from this branch are 4 more branches, not as quite as thick but very healthy as well!!!!!

I will Post pictures tomorrow!
I'm exhausted.
-Mike

 

[Vance Wood]

Hmmm, some interesting ideas. But I've already acquired saplings and smaller nursery stock like box wood and some dwarf spruces. So Those are my babies. I honestly wanted to find a big long term project since i already have a number of little to medium sized guys growing.

For this juniper I plan on it being a tall bonsai... approaching 3 feet perhaps. And now that I have it right here next to my porch let me tell you what the lower branching looks like... lowest branch is is very long, thick, healthy and very foliated AND it is only 7 inches above the soil line (on a 5 inch trunk woohoo). The next 3 inches up from this branch are 4 more branches, not as quite as thick but very healthy as well!!!!!

I will Post pictures tomorrow!
I'm exhausted.
-Mike

I don't know how you equate my suggestion to graft down low some branches you said you wanted with having smaller things to fool around with? I was pointing out a technique an advanced bonsai grower would use to make use of the trunk you described.

Your original post ended with this: I just need to know if this species will backbud so I can chop it maybe lower than it's lowest branch and grow a new leader and develop taper over time. It was in response to this question that prompted my reply. Maybe you ought to read my response once more you may not have understood what I said.

 

[Cypress]

If there were pictures, much better assessments could be made. However, as far as what you want to do, as others said, it will be a gamble. The tree would most likely not survive. However, there may be a way to pull it off. It will need to be done in stages. You could chop part of the top off. Meanwhile, let the new leader branch grow untouched. Now, keep the growth regulated on the part of the chop that was left. In time, you might be able to strengthen the new leader to the point where you can remove the remained of the area you want to chop. This is a process that would need to span over about 4 years. Also, it will need the experience of someone who is very knowledgeable in the pruning of junipers.

Rob

Rob thanks SO MUCH... this was a method I feel like I had briefly heard of before, and I really do think this would be the best way to approach my tree. I don't care if it's a 10 year project... what else have I got going on!

 

[Cypress]

WOAH Calm down Vance Wood!!!!!!!

From the description you have given it seems to me your best alternative would be to start applying grafts lower down on the trunk until you manage to create some strong and vigorous growth that can handle support of the tree if you were to eliminate the top as you have described. In general Chinese Junipers back bud fairly well but not all of them. Understanding that this is not going to be a short term project you might just as well experiment with the base of this tree getting Shimpaku Juniper cuttings to take hold in the hopes when all is said and done you will have the tree you are now looking for.

I don't know how you equate my suggestion to graft down low some branches you said you wanted with having smaller things to fool around with? I was pointing out a technique an advanced bonsai grower would use to make use of the trunk you described.

Your original post ended with this: I just need to know if this species will backbud so I can chop it maybe lower than it's lowest branch and grow a new leader and develop taper over time. It was in response to this question that prompted my reply. Maybe you ought to read my response once more you may not have understood what I said.

Vance Wood let me start out by saying that I made a quite critical typo on the the first post on this thread:

I had typed: I just need to know if this species will backbud so I can chop it maybe lower than it's lowest branch and grow a new leader and develop taper over time.

I had really meant to type: ***I just need to know if this species will backbud so I can chop it *above it's lowest branch and use it as a new leader and develop taper over time.***

So Vance Wood... I think we can both agree that this was a BIG ole' misunderstanding on both of our parts, which started with ME wrongly phrasing what I meant to say.

So this explains why your first post didn't make any sense to me, my responses didn't make any sense to you... and all the rest. I feel that your latest response was quite condescending though, and I didn't at all appreciate it.

Vance please keep in mind that I am a beginner and so may not always understand certain terms or the intricacies of grafts

BUT Vance, I do really want to thank you for offering me some very knowledgable advice on how to approach my tree.

All the best!
-Mike

 

[Vance Wood]

Vance Wood let me start out by saying that I made a quite critical typo on the the first post on this thread:

I had typed: I just need to know if this species will backbud so I can chop it maybe lower than it's lowest branch and grow a new leader and develop taper over time.

I had really meant to type: ***I just need to know if this species will backbud so I can chop it *above it's lowest branch and use it as a new leader and develop taper over time.***

So Vance Wood... I think we can both agree that this was a BIG ole' misunderstanding on both of our parts, which started with ME wrongly phrasing what I meant to say.

So this explains why your first post didn't make any sense to me, my responses didn't make any sense to you... and all the rest. I feel that your latest response was quite condescending though, and I didn't at all appreciate it.

Vance please keep in mind that I am a beginner and so may not always understand certain terms or the intricacies of grafts

BUT Vance, I do really want to thank you for offering me some very knowledgable advice on how to approach my tree.

All the best!
-Mike

My name is either Vance or if you prefer Mr. Wood but not both please.

I went back and re-read every thing I wrote and I stand by it; every word even, if you are a beginner I said nothing condescending and my comment about you not understanding what I wrote is absolutely correct; you did not understand what I wrote. If what I wrote was in response to your typo whose fault is that? It's sure not mine.

You have to remember one thing. I am under no obligation to respond to anything you post and you are not entitled to have a response from anyone just because you post a question. If your skin is so thin that what I said has forced you to come back at me the way you have you are going to have a difficult time getting a straight answer from anyone.

 

[Cypress]

My name is either Vance or if you prefer Mr. Wood but not both please.

I went back and re-read every thing I wrote and I stand by it; every word even, if you are a beginner I said nothing condescending and my comment about you not understanding what I wrote is absolutely correct; you did not understand what I wrote. If what I wrote was in response to your typo whose fault is that? It's sure not mine.

You have to remember one thing. I am under no obligation to respond to anything you post and you are not entitled to have a response from anyone just because you post a question. If your skin is so thin that what I said has forced you to come back at me the way you have you are going to have a difficult time getting a straight answer from anyone.

Vance, I sincerely apologize. And I thank you amillion for your guidance. I know it was my typo that created this misunderstanding and for that I apologize. You were completely right with the advice you offered me, I was just confused because I didn't know I had made the typo.

I wish to continue a positive relation with you on the forum and I wish you all the best Vance

Sincerely,
Mike

 

[jkd2572]

The problem with forums is you can't hug it out.

 

[Cypress]

Hahaha,yes 'tis quite true! Maybe some forum hugging technology should be developed!