White Pine - how do I make her happy?

[Japonicus]

Those temps dont equate to 5a USDA which would be like... Maine... those temps look closer to 6a or 7a.

Exactly. Had me scratching my head.
I need to see what search engine
my desktop pc uses.
My phone uses Google showing 9a . Much better for the op to update profile

 

[River's Edge]

Dear white piners,

What do you think about this white pine, and how do you think I can make her happy?


View attachment 512757

Positive and negative feedback are welcome.

Mabuhi!

THERE IS NO RUSH TO DO ANYTHING!
Take the time to determine the following.
1. clean the soil surface of weeds and moss, determine the nature of the soil composition and describe that so those helping you will know the situation.
2. Check the drainage, allow the soil to dry out a bit between watering.
3. prepare to repot in the spring, that will give you a chance to improve the root structure and set the tree up for improved health.
4. I would not wire or prune at this stage. There is plenty of time for that. Your hand gives plenty of size reference to know that wiring or bending is not a high priority!
5. If you can find out from the vendor what the rootstock is and if it is a particular variety that would be helpful planning forward.

For watering simply check with a wooden chopstick. If you can stick it in the soil 2 or 3 cm and it comes out dry, then it is time to water. For the pot make sure it sits on a surface that allows the water to drain freely out the bottom hole. For those terra cotta pots it is advisable to cut slots in the rim. The tree appears healthy so maintain it well until early spring for repot. Picture enclosed of how I modify terra cotta pots for long term use. Not suggesting you do this at this time though. Note extra holes for tie down and drainage as well as slots to allow water to escape under the outside bottom rim.

 

[Orion_metalhead]

Exactly. Had me scratching my head.
I need to see what search engine
my desktop pc uses.
My phone uses Google showing 9a . Much better for the op to update profile

Yeah... 9.. wow. Thats like... Virginia or North Carolina right?

 

[pandacular]

I see - thank you. I have so much too learn! I don't even know where to begin.

Bonsai Guides - Bonsai Tonight

Identifying Suitable Material for Bonsai - 5 posts showing what you can and can't learn from trees at different stages of development.

bonsaitonight.com

This is as good a place as you’ll find to start. In addition to these guides, Jonas has a ton of great material on his blog, especially about pines.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Full Sun. Is this located on a covered porch setting? If so it's not going to work.

If you wire to bend the trunk
avoid bending the graft it can snap easier than the rest.
Best to wire when roots are needing water/thirsty.

STRONGLY seconded. Do not bend graft or right next to graft line and much Sun energy is needed. If having local Bonsai club is excellent idea to attach self to same.

 

[gapoy]

Bonsai Guides - Bonsai Tonight

Identifying Suitable Material for Bonsai - 5 posts showing what you can and can't learn from trees at different stages of development.

bonsaitonight.com

This is as good a place as you’ll find to start. In addition to these guides, Jonas has a ton of great material on his blog, especially about pines.

Thank you so much - I'll definitely check him out.

STRONGLY seconded. Do not bend graft or right next to graft line and much Sun energy is needed. If having local Bonsai club is excellent idea to attach self to same.

I will look at maximising its sun exposure while I am here at a second floor apartment balcony. Do you think they still need full sun still even when it's October going to winter? If they do, I might get one of those balcony hanger planters, it could help get more exposure.

 

[gapoy]

Yeah... 9.. wow. Thats like... Virginia or North Carolina right?

I googled the hardiness zone of my area and it says Zone 10a, and the surround areas are 9a. What does it mean for bonsai care?

 

[gapoy]

THERE IS NO RUSH TO DO ANYTHING!
Take the time to determine the following.
1. clean the soil surface of weeds and moss, determine the nature of the soil composition and describe that so those helping you will know the situation.
2. Check the drainage, allow the soil to dry out a bit between watering.
3. prepare to repot in the spring, that will give you a chance to improve the root structure and set the tree up for improved health.
4. I would not wire or prune at this stage. There is plenty of time for that. Your hand gives plenty of size reference to know that wiring or bending is not a high priority!
5. If you can find out from the vendor what the rootstock is and if it is a particular variety that would be helpful planning forward.

For watering simply check with a wooden chopstick. If you can stick it in the soil 2 or 3 cm and it comes out dry, then it is time to water. For the pot make sure it sits on a surface that allows the water to drain freely out the bottom hole. For those terra cotta pots it is advisable to cut slots in the rim. The tree appears healthy so maintain it well until early spring for repot. Picture enclosed of how I modify terra cotta pots for long term use. Not suggesting you do this at this time though. Note extra holes for tie down and drainage as well as slots to allow water to escape under the outside bottom rim.

1. I will do this in the weekend and I promise to keep you guys updated. I am very thankful for everyone's willingness to help.
2. I will definitely assess that.
3. In my low bonsai skill and low bonsai level, and the kind of bonsai I have - which pots do you suggest are easiest and could increase the growth / health of my plants?
4. I will try to keep them alive first!
5. Yes - I will do that.

 

[Orion_metalhead]

I googled the hardiness zone of my area and it says Zone 10a, and the surround areas are 9a. What does it mean for bonsai care?

It means a lot... its the temperature range for your area. How you care for a tree in 10a is way different than 6a... 10a unlikely to get below freezing... 6a certainly getting below freezing. It hints at growth periods, dormancy, a lot of things.

 

[River's Edge]

which pots do you suggest are easiest and could increase the growth / health of my plants?

Almost any type of pot that is good for your climate and has adequate drainage holes can be used. Size and shape are factors to consider. Keep in mind that you will be working to develop a proper rootball for life in a bonsai pot. So similar shape with room to grow. The current pot appears to be roughly 15-20 cm in diameter. I would select one approximately 25 to 30 cm for a maintenance grow out pot. It can be a round or rectangular at this stage. For depth of pot at this stage I would suggest no more than 10 to 15 cm.
One could also use wooden grow box, plastic or ceramic.
Based on the appearance of the root stock you may find a fairly well developed root ball in place this spring. Difficult to know without repotting.

If possible find a local Bonsai club or experienced enthusiast to help you begin the journey. Best wishes!

 

[gapoy]

It would be helpful to put your USDA grow zone info into your profile details so we
can see that at a glance. I did a quick dig and found zone 5a???and this chart
View attachment 512822
In Winter full Sun is not so important, and lack of can actually benefit you as the soil will remain a more even temperature.
However, being on the balcony, in zone 5a, still I do not think this is going to work.
I believe that the roots are going to need the protection of the ground and be insulated from old man Winter.
Do you have a friend or relative where you could heel the pot into the ground and mulch around it?
That would insulate the roots best and no worries about snow. Snow is even better insulator against
wind desiccation. I don't know if zone 5a is accurate or not, but please update your profile to include
an accurate grow zone.

I checked it again and the majority of London is 9, while there is a small patch of 10 where I am currently located. (https://www.plantmaps.com/interactive-united-kingdom-plant-hardiness-zone-map-celsius.php)

Given that it is Zone 9-10 (we rarely get snow, but when we do, maybe just for a day) would a bubble wrap enough to insulate it later on?

I will update my Zone on my profile.

Thank you so much again for your insights.

 

[gapoy]

1. clean the soil surface of weeds and moss, determine the nature of the soil composition and describe that so those helping you will know the situation.

I have started cleaning the surface as advised, but it seems like the moss has carpeted the soil surface and I feel like if I continue cleaning it, it will expose the roots? is that alright?

Also, it seems like the soil it is on is high drainage, I can see course grains of rock? mixed with something. I am just wondering why it has not dried up since it got rained on last night? Could it be possible that it just looks wet on the surface because of the moss? but actually the root needs watering?

 

[River's Edge]

I have started cleaning the surface as advised, but it seems like the moss has carpeted the soil surface and I feel like if I continue cleaning it, it will expose the roots? is that alright?

Also, it seems like the soil it is on is high drainage, I can see course grains of rock? mixed with something. I am just wondering why it has not dried up since it got rained on last night? Could it be possible that it just looks wet on the surface because of the moss? but actually the root needs watering?

I would remove the moss, carefully keeping the substrate and covering the exposed roots if any. The moss will interfere with determining the time to water. If you do not have any extra soil to add then wait until you do!
With moss the surface will always remain damper and it is possible that deeper down the soil is drier. Often rain does not penetrate very deep in Bonsai pots. You can use a wooden chopstick to check the soil moisture. Stick the chopstick in about 2 to 3 cm. Leave for a minute or two. If the chopstick comes out dry then it is time to water.

 

[gapoy]

I would remove the moss, carefully keeping the substrate and covering the exposed roots if any. The moss will interfere with determining the time to water. If you do not have any extra soil to add then wait until you do!
With moss the surface will always remain damper and it is possible that deeper down the soil is drier. Often rain does not penetrate very deep in Bonsai pots. You can use a wooden chopstick to check the soil moisture. Stick the chopstick in about 2 to 3 cm. Leave for a minute or two. If the chopstick comes out dry then it is time to water.

I just did the chopstick method, it seems like the soil is slightly tight, but I was able to stick it in and it seems like it's wet. It's been wet for 2 night now. Should I be worried? How long can the roots be wet without rotting? This bonsai business is making me paranoid.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Thank you so much - I'll definitely check him out.



I will look at maximising its sun exposure while I am here at a second floor apartment balcony. Do you think they still need full sun still even when it's October going to winter? If they do, I might get one of those balcony hanger planters, it could help get more exposure.

Not so important during dormancy.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Given that it is Zone 9-10 (we rarely get snow, but when we do, maybe just for a day) would a bubble wrap enough to insulate it later on?

That is subtropical......like south Florida. No protection needed at all as tree hardy to much colder zones.

 

[gapoy]

Not so important during dormancy.

When does dormancy start with white pines? How is it so difficult to find answers with just google

 

[gapoy]

This is my balcony, and I am planning to hang it on the corner which I believe receives the most sunlight.

 

[MaciekA]

At least in climates like London's (or here in Oregon), dormancy is less of an on/off switch, and more of a very gradual gentle onset. The interesting part isn't the full dormancy itself, the interesting part is the part is the part between late summer and early winter, the time before things fully slow down.

During that time, sugar production from foliage is directed towards storing surplus sugars in the wood as starch. Partially to be retrieved later for the spring flush and partially as a long-term reserve. The tree also does something called retranslocation which is where nutrients are relcaimed from leaves before they're shed. This period is the re-charging of the battery, and spring will be the discharge period. Sugars are moving all around the tree and being redistributed during this time as well. In autumn, I fertilize with a low dose of inorganic liquid fertilizer to help stash some nitrogen for the future spring and load the tree up.

In climates like zone 8 to 10, a lot of pine species are not fully dormant during the trough of winter, especially not in the roots. You can see that expressed as fresh root growth during those times, and it's why at my teacher's garden we might be busy repotting in January and seeing lots of new white tips when we pop trees out of the pots. Depends on how the winter goes, but if it's a mild winter or you're in an urban heat island, there is functional growth going on -- thickening, root growth, bud development, and so on.

Your balcony corner looks like a fine place to pack away some starch. Make sure it's really well secured there.

 

[gapoy]

At least in climates like London's (or here in Oregon), dormancy is less of an on/off switch, and more of a very gradual gentle onset. The interesting part isn't the full dormancy itself, the interesting part is the part is the part between late summer and early winter, the time before things fully slow down.

During that time, sugar production from foliage is directed towards storing surplus sugars in the wood as starch. Partially to be retrieved later for the spring flush and partially as a long-term reserve. The tree also does something called retranslocation which is where nutrients are relcaimed from leaves before they're shed. This period is the re-charging of the battery, and spring will be the discharge period. Sugars are moving all around the tree and being redistributed during this time as well. In autumn, I fertilize with a low dose of inorganic liquid fertilizer to help stash some nitrogen for the future spring and load the tree up.

In climates like zone 8 to 10, a lot of pine species are not fully dormant during the trough of winter, especially not in the roots. You can see that expressed as fresh root growth during those times, and it's why at my teacher's garden we might be busy repotting in January and seeing lots of new white tips when we pop trees out of the pots. Depends on how the winter goes, but if it's a mild winter or you're in an urban heat island, there is functional growth going on -- thickening, root growth, bud development, and so on.

Your balcony corner looks like a fine place to pack away some starch. Make sure it's really well secured there.

Wow that's full of information thank you!