When should inexperienced bonsai growers shut up and let the experts talk?

Who would you rather have post here? Greerhw or Walter Pall?
I might of missed some, while that user you mentioned had some cool collected conifers, I didnt see much in the way of progressive threads that folk could gain value from.
The other user you mentioned Klytus, I just had a look there too, I didnt find much tree imagry or great bonsai content, maybe I missed something.
 
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I would love another thread that compiled a list of some of these folks, particularly if people had some info about what made these "lost members" of the forum special. There's a few well known ones, and I've done searches specifically for posts specifically by those three guys you mentioned above and dug up great stuff, usually about things that I know they're good at. I'm building a list of others.

I recently read an epic old thread that was a bit of a beef between two old timers, and that was fun and revealing as well.
This chap had some cool content: https://www.bonsainut.com/members/grouper52.219/
 
Getting back to the OPs question, I think there is something of an evolution that goes on with BonsaiNut users. We get into bonsai and have a ton of questions. We start to scratch the surface of bonsai and believe we know more than we actually do, and so we end up posting a whole bunch of comments. After a few years, we begin to realize how little we know and the messages slow down a bit. It becomes less about "this is the right thing to do" and more about "here's my personal experience on the issue".
 
Getting back to the OPs question, I think there is something of an evolution that goes on with BonsaiNut users. We get into bonsai and have a ton of questions. We start to scratch the surface of bonsai and believe we know more than we actually do, and so we end up posting a whole bunch of comments. After a few years, we begin to realize how little we know and the messages slow down a bit. It becomes less about "this is the right thing to do" and more about "here's my personal experience on the issue".

That's an insightful reaponse.
 
hmmm...I have been active (no longer) on Bonsai discussion forums since typing on keyboards was done in DOS. The same arguments, and the same rhetoric has been discussed ad nauseum. I check in here from time to time, maybe two or three times a month. Last week, my name was spoken in vain several times. To that end, I have always been active in discussion forums that serve a useful purpose, much like a hands on workshop. the internet could be used for that purpose. I feel that it should be imperative that forums hold people accountable for the rhetoric the espouse. If you go into a bar and shoot your mouth off, you better be prepared to take care of yourself. I find a place like this much the same.

For instance, meaning no disrespect, in just the last several paragraphs A chap from the Netherlands seems to have a lot of disparaging comments about Americans weight, their colleges, not being woke enough and many other things. So what to do, I clicked on his name. Looked at every post made on the forum, skimmed a lot, so may have missed a tree in there, but from what I could see, there is not a bonsai in the bunch. All I saw was a couple flats of azalea's in 4 inch; sorry 10 cm cups. So....from my point of view, and decades on a forum specifically for bonsai, not politics, I read a lot of politics and nothing useful to do with bonsai?

Leatherback felt it would be a pissing match to post up your five best trees. I agree. If done in a pissing match setting, you would be correct. So I implore everyone here to add some content behind their name and start your own media, your own photo gallery. Words mean things. When there is nothing to back them up, your words mean nothing. You want to be on a BONSAI discussion forum, then be proud of your work, post up your own gallery and explain why you think its worthy. Discussion about when to shut up will solve itself when we can go to your page and see what your worth when it comes to working with your hands and manipulating Nature. Its not easy, nor is it cheap. I think most people can look at a tree and tell how long they been working on it. Hell post a before and after of your three best and explain how long you been working on it. I hope something positive can come from this, because all of my friends are no longer here, and I left way before they did so it wasn't me that drove them off. Somehow, I feel that my departure here should have made things better, but currently not much bonsai is discussed here*.


* What do I mean by "bonsai", the taking of material and transforming it over a number of years with photo documentation of the journey. Real tree work, not asking stupid questions that could be answered with a few keystrokes on wikipedia. There are always going to be stupid questions as long as humans are involved, but a place like this should be 80 percent useful bonsai work and 20 percent stupid shit. I have about twenty boxes of magazines in my garage, the whole collection of Bonsai Today, the whole collection of Bonsai Europe/Focus and most of International Bonsai.** They were the crowning jewel of bonsai learning as Rock illuded to 40+ years ago. Magazines are all but gone today due to the internet. Much like the porn industry and newspapers in general. You young people are the future of bonsai and what will set the mood for the future. Not old guys like me and Adair. You guys you should be talking about how many branches you cut today rather than have to explain what the meaning of "WOKE" is. Wake up!!!!


** I'll take two hundred for all the magazines, shipping on you.
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This is exactly why you should post your trees. Talk is cheap! Remove all doubt.
What is DOS
 
What is DOS
Disc Operating System. Before windows 95, before a mouse and before simple. You had a big ole disk (5") in your computer and similar to todays hard drive but more primitive and much slower. Hell todays cell phones have more computing power than my first Packard Bell.
 
Disc Operating System. Before windows 95, before a mouse and before simple. You had a big ole disk (5") in your computer and similar to todays hard drive but more primitive and much slower. Hell todays cell phones have more computing power than my first Packard Bell.
Interesting, sounds like a Phillip K Dick fantasy novel.
 
What is DOS
IMG_2215.jpeg
The operating system that came after CP/M and before Windows 3.1. This was back when 640 KB was considered a plentiful amount of RAM and people used screechy noise making 2400 baud modems to connect to Bulletin Board Systems (the Internet didn’t exist yet, at least not outside of academia and the military anyway).

Software was read into memory from an iron oxide coated plastic disk like this which rotated and was read via an electromagnetic device.
IMG_2216.jpeg
 
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I remember the List Server on Garden Web and how long the pyramid shaped threads would be. Bout 92 to 94.
 
Interesting, sounds like a Phillip K Dick fantasy novel.
Very off topic, but I suppose we are well beyond that point. Even the most fantastical stories of Philip K Dick, such as 'The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch' contain themes and messages that are very easily transmutable to ongoing societal trends. The more down to earth ones, such as 'A Scanner Darkly' have long been realized.
 
Ahh Garden Web... 😁.
I remember you there with Vance Wood and Vance Hannah. Vance Hannah now lives in Modesto, about an hour and half north of me.
 
Back to the original OP question.

I guess times I sit back back and listen, or go off site and research on my own, is when a new area of bonsai or technique, style or type of tree is being discussed that I’m not proficient in.

Sometimes this happens frequently, other times not that often…

As far as how to know someone possesses ‘expert’ knowledge… for me it’s when that person is more proficient in an area I am not… and there are many. After all bonsai has a wide footprint of trees, techniques, styles and displays to name a few.

Tree quality doesn’t cut it with me unless I know a specific person has developed that specific tree. To be very frank, I’ve first hand knowledge of a number of folks that bought a nicely designed tree from an auction. or a professional’s lot and not have the knowledge, skills and abilities to properly maintain that tree. (Not saying the professionals don’t deserve credit )

(Or on the other hand buy a tree and have a pro style a tree for a number of years. and win awards over folks that do their own work.)

I do have a whole lot of respect for folks that always strive to give even balanced information to others on this site to those less knowledgeable. These folks are taking time to develop others with hopes someday the recipients of this knowledge will pay these efforts forward to others, Thanks folks!

Now I’m off to fix a fence in the north forty 😎

Cheers
DSD sends
The fence in the South 20 needs some attention.
 
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