trident maple problem: Black shriveled up leaves

J

Jason_mazzy

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attached are photos. Partial defoliated to get light into interior portion of tree.

I got back budding and lots of new growth except it is all turning black and the older leaves are brown tipped.

I checked sun placement and the soil is draining fast and well. Watering is done properly and proper use of organic fertiliuzer.

I bought this tree from a well known member here and I did not repot it.

I have used a treatment spray weeks (bayer) ago for insects and disease when i noticed the first leaves messed up.




 
One of my books sais' that if temps are over 81 degrees they will benefit from partial shade or the leaves will scorch.
 
The tree has been moved to less sun after the grooming and these new leaves are turning black. I don't know what is going on.
 
I had a similar looking problem with a trident about a month ago. Pulling it from the pot I realized it had outgrown its pot even though I repotted it in very early spring. The media I used was too large so the roots grew too quickly and ran out of room. I defoliated it, cut back the roots and put it in a finer mix. New leaves are just now coming out as we had a week of solid rain with almost no sun since i defoliated, I hope the leaf problem doesn't return... No signs of it returning so far, so for now I believe it to be due to the roots outgrowing the pot and stressing the tree.

This could also be due to potato leaf hoppers. http://www.ca.uky.edu/entomology/entfacts/ef115.asp
 
I was thought about that but was hesitant to pull it out of the pot this late in the season.


Any advice on rootwork this late in the season? Is it even a decent idea?
 
Jason_mazzy said:
I was thought about that but was hesitant to pull it out of the pot this late in the season.


Any advice on rootwork this late in the season? Is it even a decent idea?
Click to expand...

I don't know if it's the best idea... But from my experience trident maple can be repotted in the heat of summer if it's healthy. For a number of years i've defoliated and repotted a shohin trident every other year twice. Once in the spring, and once in early summer. The off years I still defoliate once and repot each spring. But I don't know your tree so use caution as you already defoliated it once and it's still having a leaf problem.

If the root ball is solid i don't think it would hurt to pop it from it's pot and take a look. If all looks good just put it back. Grounding wires should be removed after a tree has filled its pot anyway as they can scar large roots. If all doesn't looks good when you pop it from it's pot and your concerned with the trees overall health have a larger pot ready to slip pot it into. If your not familiar with slip potting evergreengardenworks has an article on it i believe. Tridents are crazy vigorous, don't worry to much it will most likely pull through. Even if the browning/fungus gets all the leaves it should throw out another flush unless something's seriously wrong with it.
 
I too have had the problem of unexpected root bound.I had two year old pines that looked dehydrated so I lifted them and found very fine roots nearly 3' long from just an 8" bonsai pot.I forgot all about that cause' I have abandoned pine growing for easier overwintering.
 
Jason,

Bring it, a slightly bigger and deeper (like an inch all around) pot and some soil to the next BSOC Meeting and we will take a look at it! I think the leaf margins on some of the leaves are drying out. It could be root bound and drying out too fast between watering.

Regards,
Martin
 
I actually got a old shohin chojubai about a month ago that was not doing well. Picked it up from a very respectable nursery last month. It's been dropping leaves daily since I got it. I pushed on all the roots this past weekend and noticed 2 were mushy. Removed it from the pot and about 1/3 of the root ball had gone rotten. The rot looks like it started after a large tap root was cut back. One of the larger roots had to be cut it off. The other side of the root ball had roots growing in a 6 inch pot 3-4 feet long!!! I removed the rotted root and cut the rest back to the feeder roots 10-12 inches. Put it back in the small pot cause I had nothing larger thet was suitable at the time and its starting to feel like summer here so I can't prune it like it is spring. Hope it makes it... I need to call the nursery and let them know about the problem. I don't live close to them or i'd bring it by. All that can be done has been though so I'll just cross my fingers, was able to retain 2/3 of the good whote feeder roots so it may be ok. Shade till it starts growing.
 
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I am not a maple guy, but it looks fungal. In addition to the brown and black, notice the yellow patches and spots on most of the leaves. I think member rockm might be able to give you a diagnosis about this. Maybe he will reply or you could pm him.

Rob
 
I waited a few days and it's clear the affected leaves have decided to leave this mortal coil - it's effectively done a self partial defoliation. I'll PM Rock and see if he has an idea - thanks.
 
Stop all fertilizer.

Soak the potted tree in a large tub for two hours.

Place tree in shade for four weeks.

Defoliate one branch

Elevate pot on risers (3/4 to 1 inch) being carefull to not inhibit drainage.

Spray entire tree with Sevin ( a nerve agent)

Repeat in two weeks.

Water as usual not spraying foliage at all.

Check back next month after the new buds pop on defoliated branch. See if that cures your problem. This tree looks strong and should do fine. I have a suspicion and what I have indicated should correct it. I wish to see if this is your problem before I tell you what it is.

This preperation will not kill your tree.
 
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Jason,
Did you perform the steps Smoke suggested? If so, would you update us on the outcome?

Thanks

PS Smoke - are you gonna divulge your diagnosis?

Frank
 
My guess is smoke is referring to fungus gnats or some kind of nematode?
 
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