Thinking about unnatural bonsai

[Dhalgren]

I have dabbled over the years with bonsai, but due to my different living situations, I could not establish long-term bonsai trees. Then I realized that creating tortured plants shaped like sculptures never interested me. I believe in the natural growth of trees. Size can be controlled with diligent pruning, but not torture. I now focus on large planters that contain bonsai forests. Most of the trees are very young and will have an opportunity to bond with the other trees with fungal connections. Trident Maples, Alberta Spruce, junipers, boxwoods, Colorado Blue Spruce, Norway Spruce, Douglas Fir, and Chinese Elm all grow with each other. They will be pruned to imitate what the trees look like in a true forest.

Is anyone else doing this?

 

[pandacular]

[double post, removed]

 

[pandacular]

Define torture.

Is anyone else doing this?

Someone is always doing any given thing, especially when the idea is pretty simple

 

[Cadillactaste]

Tortured...

Even outside our hobby... grafting for nursery purposes and propagation is a thing.

You wish to do clip and grow...one could say...is Tortured. Removing parts off a tree.

I happen to have trees I have heavily put my hand on with style...and, I also have naturalistic trees along with them on my bench.

But end of the day...as long as one finds joy in the process they choose. That is the key.

 

[Gabler]

Trees aren't conscious. They don't feel pain. Ergo, they cannot be tortured. If you've been alive for more than a week, you know this. OP is a troll, and we should not feed it.

 

[Cadillactaste]

Trees aren't conscious. They don't feel pain. Ergo, they cannot be tortured. If you've been alive for more than a week, you know this. OP is a troll, and we should not feed it.

... I'm bored... ... But I hear ya.

Speaking of tortured. I love the pain from getting my eyebrows waxed. Ha! I can't say more...this is a family friendly forum. giggling.

 

[Paradox]

Yea....despite my signature, I never understood why some people think doing bonsai is torture to the trees

 

[Orion_metalhead]

If the torture results in a more robust specimen, how is it any different than humans going to the gym?

Anyway, everyone has a forest or two. You are not as "beyond the curve" as you want to imagine you are.

 

[BrightsideB]

It’s more like strategic horticulture than harm.

 

[just.wing.it]

I don't know about you guys, but I like to tie my trees up with wire, sometimes every limb. Then I bend them to my will and force them to do what want. I only feed them sparingly and I keep them fully exposed to the elements. I also bind them to the small containers in which they live, and I strap the containers to the ground so they can not move.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

an opportunity to bond with the other trees

Yeah, that's not what happens my friend. It's a biochemical warfare of competition to the death, with each one trying to starve the other out of resources and sunlight.
It's like cage fighting dogs: you put them in the same enclosure and only one comes out alive in the end.
That's not just torture, it's blood sport.

 

[rockm]

The troll misunderstands just about everything about bonsai. Bonsai techniques are simply taking advantage of the natural abilities/adaptations trees evolved to handle what nature does them on a daily basis. If you think bonsai is torture think about what nature does to trees ever single day all over the planet. From hurricanes to tornadoes to bitter cold to extreme heat and drought. Trees are torn from the ground broken into pieces and sometimes eaten until they die.

It’s been that way for more than a billion years Trees adapted to survive all that. We simply understand the responses and channel them. We keep our trees healthier and stronger than they would be in the wild to generate enough strength to respond robustly to bonsai culture

There is a theory that trees die because they simply can’t over come the physics of aging. Their roots become overextended. Long thick roots have feeders at their end so the longer the root the more pressure is needed to transfer nutrients to the branching and tips of branches. top growth gets too tall or sprawling to carry nutrient s effectively and efficiently.

By reducing the root length and forcing more fibrous and efficient root pads that pack more feeder roots into a smaller space we maximize the trees capabilities. We do this regularly. Technically with such efficiency a tree can well outlive its relatives in the wild. The Yamaki pine at the National arboretum began bonsai cultivation in 1620 or so…. It’s celebrates it 400 th bonsai birthday next year

 

[Paradox]

The troll misunderstands just about everything about bonsai. Bonsai techniques are simply taking advantage of the natural abilities/adaptations trees evolved to handle what nature does them on a daily basis. If you think bonsai is torture think about what nature does to trees ever single day all over the planet. From hurricanes to tornadoes to bitter cold to extreme heat and drought. Trees are torn from the ground broken into pieces and sometimes eaten until they die.

It’s been that way for more than a billion years Trees adapted to survive all that. We simply understand the responses and channel them. We keep our trees healthier and stronger than they would be in the wild to generate enough strength to respond robustly to bonsai culture

There is a theory that trees die because they simply can’t over come the physics of aging. Their roots become overextended. Long thick roots have feeders at their end so the longer the root the more pressure is needed to transfer nutrients to the branching and tips of branches. top growth gets too tall or sprawling to carry nutrient s effectively and efficiently.

By reducing the root length and forcing more fibrous and efficient root pads that pack more feeder roots into a smaller space we maximize the trees capabilities. We do this regularly. Technically with such efficiency a tree can well outlive its relatives in the wild. The Yamaki pine at the National arboretum began bonsai cultivation in 1620 or so…. It’s celebrates it 400 th bonsai birthday next year

And the Yamaki pine survived the Hiroshima blast, albeit behind a wall but still...it survived

 

[rockm]

And the Yamaki pine survived the Hiroshima blast, albeit behind a wall but still...it survived

It was 325 years old when the bomb fell.

 

[yashu]

Thanks for this thread. I needed a good chuckle this morning!

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I never understood why some people think doing bonsai is torture to the trees

Imagine what they would think if they saw me taking cuttings And yet, I end up with many many more trees than I start with.

Bottom line, bonsai is all about horticulture and healthy trees. The tree is supposed to "suggest" age and character that is seen in old trees in nature. However bonsai (if you are doing it right) are as healthy, if not healthier, than a tree in nature.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

They will be pruned to imitate what the trees look like in a true forest.

Is anyone else doing this?

Have people done it? Yes. Have people been successful doing it? It is extremely difficult. Usually they end up with a mish-mash of trees in a pot that doesn't look like much of anything. Even the masters struggle to blend numerous species in a single display - because the different tree species tend to fight - instead of compliment - each other (at least visually / artistically). I have occasionally seen a grove of one species with a single accent tree that is there to create interest and conflict in the design. But numbers of different species together is very hard (artistically). I have attached a photo of the best one I believe I have ever seen - by a master in forest design (Saburo Kato).

If you are talking about just growing a bunch of tree species together in a single pot (without being concerned about how they look as a bonsai), that is extremely simple.

 

[rockm]

“They will be pruned to imitate what the trees look like in a true forest.

Is anyone else doing this?”

No you’re the only person who has thought of this in the roughly 1000 years bonsai been around. You’re a genius!

 

[yashu]

OP needs to educate themselves on forest succession. One species is always trying to kill off the previous while some grasp and cling to carve out their own little space. I’d go as far as saying trying to keep a forest in a state of stasis is perhaps a form of torture under OPs very vague definition.

 

[dbonsaiw]

I believe in the natural growth of trees.

I believe bonsai practitioners do as well - we try to use the natural growth of trees to develop something that is aesthetically pleasing. Nature is violent and unforgiving. We try to keep our trees in a more controlled setting. In fact, bonsai trees can live for very long precisely because of the work that is done.