Soil Confusion!

JasonL

JasonL

Seedling
Messages
10
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9
Location
Moncton. NB - Canada
USDA Zone
5a
My one juniper tree has been in the same pot and is in regular potting soil from the nursery (as nowhere around here seems to carry any of the fancy stuff you guys talk about Acadama etc)

I'm getting ready to do a little cleanup of this tree, and I just purchased another nursery grown juniper (about 3-4 years old) in nursery soil and pot. I haven't repotted, trimmed, or wired this tree yet.

(Pics below)

So my questions are:

Old Nursery Juniper Tree (oldest 5-6 years):

~ What soil can I create that will help this tree thrive with local big box store materials (I'm in Canada, Home Depot, WalMart, Kent, Home Hardware, Rona). I can get perlite, sphagnum, coir.

~ Do I need to put this tree in a different pot, it's been in the same one for like three years now.

~ When should I a) repot/resoil, b) trim/style/wire existing tree?

~ Should I repot/rewire/trim all at the same time?

New Nursery Juniper Tree (3-4 years old):

~ What should I do first, trim/style/wire or repot?

~ Should I repot and leave it in the new pot for the summer and style in fall or even next spring?

~ Should I trim/style/wire and leave in existing pot until fall or spring then repot?

I don't want to damage these trees as one I have been working of for three years now.

HELP!? lol

Jason

Bonsai2025-1.jpg
Bonsai2025-2.jpg

Bonsai2025-3.jpg

New Tree:
Bonsai2025-4.jpg
Bonsai2025-5.jpg
 
I’d recommend ordering bonsai soil online rather than try to make do with hardware store/garden center materials.

Surely there are plenty of online sources that deliver in Canada? Even Amazon has bonsai soil.
 
Yes, get bonsai soil for your repots. It can be found on amazon, or a number of sellers in Canada. Seek a local club if you can, and ask where they get soil, or order online. At this point in your bonsai journey, you dont want to bog yourself down with making your own mix, Which can certainly be done to better or worse effect with Box store purchased substrate, but again, get your feet under yourself with practicing bonsai, then start to play with things like soil and such.

junipers keep energy in their foliage, so repot your tree with as little pruning as possible, then style and prune in the fall
 
Remove tree and tease away soil. Trim root back 50 percent and can be repotted right back in same container.

Don't over think soil nor get caught up in hype about how bonsai soil has to be magical. Soil around a tree is there in nature because it offers an anchorage point for roots so the tree doesn't just become a tumble weed in the storm. No plant on earth requires soil to live. What it does require is water and nutrients. Soil provides those things and becomes a reservoir for those properties. So Just buy a bag of cactus soil, and pure pumice and mix them 50/50 and you have soil that will grow anything. Just as well as all the stupid akadama potions out there. These can be purchased at any plant nursery of box store. If you really want to push the envelope buy a bag of extra fine orchid bark and throw that in there. That really pisses off the elites, yet I been using it for thirty years and I see now that many bonsai sites I go to are starting to use more bark in soil mixes...I guess I was ahead of my time.

I have been collecting ancient Greek and Roman coins for twenty years and the web sites, like bonsai, are just as loaded with hype as bonsai web sites.
 
bwaynef said:
Glad to have you back here for a while.
Click to expand...
A lot of things in the world have changed since I was here for decades ago. Not for the good either. Bonsai has become one of those hobbies that could be done on a scale that was possible twenty years ago for hardly any money at all. Since covid and inflation, bonsai has become a hobby for the rich if you want nice pots, superior plants and mud ball soil. When I see a guy asking really hard questions and reading between the lines, "like what do I "have" to have, I feel that sometimes one has to step out of the shadows and just let someone know, yes, you can do this on the cheap and your plants will never know the difference. The cool thing is they have no mechanism to complain. Unless you dose them with lethal chicken poop.
 
Lots to think about...I appreciate all of your answers, very much.

Thank you as well "Smoke"...I'm trying to do this as easily and cheaply as possible...nothing fancy.
 
And. FWIW. get these outside. You don’t say if you’re keeping them outside but indoors all the time, they will decline and died regardless of the soil you’re using (although the mud they’re now in will make this process quicker than with regular bonsai soil. Sunlight on the windowsill isn’t enough junipers and conifer are high light plants. Indoors even in full sunlight (which isn’t all day) is less than half what it is outdoors. Inside humidity is about the same level as a desert and there is t adequate air circulation (as in wind or breezes) which spawns inset infestations like mites and other stuff
 
Some accessible, affordable substrates. Note that I have used none of these, but see them talked about quite a bit

* Diatomaceous earth (sold as oil dry or cat litter)
* Decomposed granit
* Bark—around here, white fir and douglas fir are the choice for those using bark for bonsai, likely locally dependent
* Perlite, usually #3 or more (chunky!)
* Coir
* Steer manure

For those of us who live along the Pacific ring of fire, volcanic substrates are the obvious choice due to their longevity in a bonsai pot and accessibility, but the Atlantic lacks the materials to do this affordably at scale.
 
Smoke said:
A lot of things in the world have changed since I was here for decades ago. Not for the good either. Bonsai has become one of those hobbies that could be done on a scale that was possible twenty years ago for hardly any money at all. Since covid and inflation, bonsai has become a hobby for the rich if you want nice pots, superior plants and mud ball soil. When I see a guy asking really hard questions and reading between the lines, "like what do I "have" to have, I feel that sometimes one has to step out of the shadows and just let someone know, yes, you can do this on the cheap and your plants will never know the difference. The cool thing is they have no mechanism to complain. Unless you dose them with lethal chicken poop.
Click to expand...

Thank you for saying it. I'd swear everyone has amnesia about how much cheaper everything used to be. I'm not even that old. I just turned thirty last week. Smartphones must have destroyed our attention spans.
 
pandacular said:
Some accessible, affordable substrates. Note that I have used none of these, but see them talked about quite a bit

* Diatomaceous earth (sold as oil dry or cat litter)
* Decomposed granit
* Bark—around here, white fir and douglas fir are the choice for those using bark for bonsai, likely locally dependent
* Perlite, usually #3 or more (chunky!)
* Coir
* Steer manure

For those of us who live along the Pacific ring of fire, volcanic substrates are the obvious choice due to their longevity in a bonsai pot and accessibility, but the Atlantic lacks the materials to do this affordably at scale.
Click to expand...

Have to be very careful of cat litter here in the U.S. (not sure about Canada).
It tends to be heavily perfumed and gets very soft so could clog up a pot pretty quickly.

I think the Orchid bark fines would be better for holding moisture than cat litter
A mix of bark and pumice would probably work.

Smoke said:
A lot of things in the world have changed since I was here for decades ago. Not for the good either. Bonsai has become one of those hobbies that could be done on a scale that was possible twenty years ago for hardly any money at all. Since covid and inflation, bonsai has become a hobby for the rich if you want nice pots, superior plants and mud ball soil. When I see a guy asking really hard questions and reading between the lines, "like what do I "have" to have, I feel that sometimes one has to step out of the shadows and just let someone know, yes, you can do this on the cheap and your plants will never know the difference.
Click to expand...
Lately eating (or at least eating healthy) has become a thing for the rich it seems looking at the prices of just about everything.
I agree with the prices of pots...holy crap those have gotten expensive. So much so I have contemplated getting my own kiln and learning how to make them. Wouldnt take too many pots to make up for the price of a decent used kiln. Maybe when I retire and have more time to tinker with stuff. The prices of trees have also gone up considerably even for decent pre-bonsai.

Smoke said:
The cool thing is they have no mechanism to complain.
Click to expand...
The thing is they do. If they start declining in health, then you know you are doing something wrong.
The problem for a newer person and sometimes even for experienced folks is figuring out what
 
Desert O'Piñon said:
What about homemade concrete pots? I've been considering this myself.
Click to expand...
Might work ok for you since you are in NM if you dont get freezing in the winter.
Im not sure how a concrete pot would hold up to NE winters.

On the other hand, could just stick with plastic bonsai training pots or mica pots which are pretty tough.
I dont really show my trees so its not a big deal to have a ceramic pot, they just look nicer
 
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