Ponderosa Pine. Alien?

[John Ruger]

Wanted to share my first Ponderosa Pine purchased from Andy Smith at Golden Arrow Bonsai. I thought then that it was one of the strangest/ugliest looking pines I'd seen, but was really taken in by the alien-looking quality to it. I've been spending what time I can just now looking it over and trying to visualize the direction. Obviously, it wants to be a cascade, but any real "plan" is simply not there yet.

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Any thoughts, ideas, criticisms are always welcome.

 

[John Ruger]

one last pic.

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[Attila Soos]

That's an exquisite tree.

The best part will come, when those roots develop mature bark. You are young enough to see it, in about 15-20 years.

 

[John Ruger]

The tree was listed at about 35yrs or there abouts. So, I guess I'll be 50-ish. I'm really looking forward to seeing this one develop.

 

[Attila Soos]

The tree was listed at about 35yrs or there abouts. So, I guess I'll be 50-ish. I'm really looking forward to seeing this one develop.

Yeah, the tree itself is already old enough, and I can see the bark maturing, but the bark on the root is very young.

 

[JudyB]

This will be a challenging tree, but an amazing looking project. You should plan on embracing the ugly/alien quality, as that is what makes it so interesting. Could you possibly mimic what the top (roots) are doing with the cascade portion? Sort of giving it big upward elbows before the fall part? I think that may be one direction....

 

[John Ruger]

This will be a challenging tree, but an amazing looking project. You should plan on embracing the ugly/alien quality, as that is what makes it so interesting. Could you possibly mimic what the top (roots) are doing with the cascade portion? Sort of giving it big upward elbows before the fall part? I think that may be one direction....

I like that idea a lot and yet the difficulty is thinking years ahead and visualizing those roots. As Atilla stated they are immature as compared to the rest of the tree. I'm wondering how well they will catch up (to what degree if at all) with the remainder.

 

[tom tynan]

John: To make this work you need to develop the roots and actually encourage more. The best exposed root style trees have a volume of roots of different size and thickness. Yes - it will take years to get the bark texture to match. You may want to put a screen around the base of the exposed roots and increase the soil volume, esp. to protect the thin roots that are exposed. At some point - wire on the exposed roots may help for shaping and direction. This tree really requires a turntable for viewing to determine the best view of the roots working with the cascade branch. It is tree that will require alot of study. Put it in a spot where you will see it often and keep tunring it until you see a view that works. Good luck. Tom

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Interesting tree and definitely will take creativity to get the best out of it. I would just let it grow for at least a year, the whole time you should be considering the different possibilities for the tree. Check Andy's tags, somewhere it usually says what year he collected the tree. Give the tree several years to adapt to living in captivity. This is really important with the 100+ year olds, but even the 30+ year old trees need a little time, maybe 2 or 3 years from time collected, to develop enough roots and vigor to be able to tolerate styling. Don't do anything until you are getting vigorous buds in fall and lots of growth in spring. Its not established until you get bushy foxtails of foliage forming. Then you can start working it and it will tolerate the bending, twisting and pruning.

I think changing the angle of the tree in the pot would help. But not seeing it in person, I have no clue which way to lean it. Take your time, sketch out some possibilities. Consider exposing more of the exposed roots, consider hiding more of the exposed roots. I'm sure an interesting bonsai is in that tree.

Good find, don't rush into styling it. Take time to consider.

 

[John Ruger]

John: To make this work you need to develop the roots and actually encourage more. The best exposed root style trees have a volume of roots of different size and thickness. Yes - it will take years to get the bark texture to match. You may want to put a screen around the base of the exposed roots and increase the soil volume, esp. to protect the thin roots that are exposed. At some point - wire on the exposed roots may help for shaping and direction. This tree really requires a turntable for viewing to determine the best view of the roots working with the cascade branch. It is tree that will require alot of study. Put it in a spot where you will see it often and keep tunring it until you see a view that works. Good luck.
Tom

I'm a little more than half embarrassed to say that I still don't have a turntable and that I generally sit these things either on a small table or my lap

I worked on exposed roots before, but only on a crabapple

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I'm assuming this is the direction??

 

[John Ruger]

Interesting tree and definitely will take creativity to get the best out of it. I would just let it grow for at least a year, the whole time you should be considering the different possibilities for the tree. Check Andy's tags, somewhere it usually says what year he collected the tree. Give the tree several years to adapt to living in captivity. This is really important with the 100+ year olds, but even the 30+ year old trees need a little time, maybe 2 or 3 years from time collected, to develop enough roots and vigor to be able to tolerate styling. Don't do anything until you are getting vigorous buds in fall and lots of growth in spring. Its not established until you get bushy foxtails of foliage forming. Then you can start working it and it will tolerate the bending, twisting and pruning.

I think changing the angle of the tree in the pot would help. But not seeing it in person, I have no clue which way to lean it. Take your time, sketch out some possibilities. Consider exposing more of the exposed roots, consider hiding more of the exposed roots. I'm sure an interesting bonsai is in that tree.

Good find, don't rush into styling it. Take time to consider.

Thanks Leo, I got the tag in the house somewhere, just not readily on hand. Usually, when I purchase this type of material I leave it alone for like you said a year or two and just see how it responds. I'm still educating myself on the ways of the pine species which seems to require a whole different degree of education

 

[fore]

John: To make this work you need to develop the roots and actually encourage more. The best exposed root style trees have a volume of roots of different size and thickness. Yes - it will take years to get the bark texture to match. You may want to put a screen around the base of the exposed roots and increase the soil volume, esp. to protect the thin roots that are exposed. At some point - wire on the exposed roots may help for shaping and direction. This tree really requires a turntable for viewing to determine the best view of the roots working with the cascade branch. It is tree that will require alot of study. Put it in a spot where you will see it often and keep tunring it until you see a view that works. Good luck. Tom

Great potential John! I love it. And I agree with Tom here: wire some movement in the roots while it's easier and 'pot' the lower part of the exposed root, kinda like an air layer, and develop more roots to accentuate the exposed root style. And also, is it possible to add some movement in the beginning of the cascade?

 

[John Ruger]

Great potential John! I love it. And I agree with Tom here: wire some movement in the roots while it's easier and 'pot' the lower part of the exposed root, kinda like an air layer, and develop more roots to accentuate the exposed root style. And also, is it possible to add some movement in the beginning of the cascade?

Thanks Chris, I have to learn the rooting characteristics of pines. I simply don't yet know how well as a species they throw roots. As far as adding movement into the cascade, I have to wait on that. Even when I have a definite plan in mind I always take it slow until I'm comfortable with its health and that can take a year or more.

 

[Lee Brindley]

For me the exposed roots don't really add anything to the design. If they were not allready exposed, I dont think you would think of exsposing them. I would be intesested to see if there is a possible literati hiding in that trunk.
Regards, Lee.

 

[John Ruger]

For me the exposed roots don't really add anything to the design. If they were not allready exposed, I dont think you would think of exsposing them. I would be intesested to see if there is a possible literate hiding in that trunk.
Regards, Lee.

Thanks Lee.
Those exposed roots as seen were as Andy Smith harvested from the wilds. I'm trying to take it all in and see how much to leave as is and simply work on accentuating what has already been created by nature.

 

[ghues]

Hi John,
I like the unusual and this pondy has that....as we all agree its hard to give any real suggestions without working with it live and in person but for me it reminds us of a tree along an exposed creek/river bank/talus skree/slope where the roots get exposed from the erosion of the soil. I've seen thousands and I recall some of them where I said....how is that tree even alive with such skinny roots dangling down the enbankment
Getting age on roots takes exposure to sunlight but maybe these need to fatten up a little...as suggested you could cover them with soil for a few years.
Have you used angled blocks under the pot to give you some ideas?
Keep us posted and good luck.
Cheers Graham

 

[bonsai barry]

I think that it has potential to be a great tree! Start shopping now for the perfect pot.

 

[John Ruger]

I think that it has potential to be a great tree! Start shopping now for the perfect pot.

Graham and Barry Thanks Loads for the encouragement and advise. And Graham, I know the style you mean; not so much like the crabapple I posted with this tree. I don't think I've ever seen that particular style you refer to except in old photos from Japan.

Barry, did you really have to mention pot? Now you just opened a whole new can of worms.

 

[Dan W.]

I hear they have plenty in Colorado...

 

[Dan W.]

I'm looking forward to watching this tree develop.