Parrottia persica

[penumbra]

Good day. Has anyone had experience with this plant? I have one I planted about 30 years ago in the ground. I was assessing my tree for layering this spring when I noticed the other day that it has a couple small trees that have sprouted from the roots. Obviously I am going to give it a try late winter to early spring but I was just wondering if there are others here who have trained this awesome tree for bonsai.

 

[WNC Bonsai]

They have one in the arboretum bonsai collection in Asheville here is a link to YouTube video on it:

 

[penumbra]

Thanks. I've actually watched that video but its all I can find. It is a beautiful plant with great character and it seems like it would be a natural for bonsai. I do plan to try to seperate the root sprouts and I plant to layer it as well. Guess no one else knows about this so I will report back in the spring.
Thanks again. I appreciate the reply.

 

[coh]

I don't think I've ever seen one other than the one in Asheville (though I just found a few using a google image search for parrotia persica bonsai). I have a parrotia in my yard and at some point I will probably try layering a branch to experiment with. That's all I've got...

 

[penumbra]

I saw one 30 odd years ago at Winterthur in the Brandywine Valley, DE. Stunning low branched very wide tree that is highly remnescent of a beech, though lower and wider. It is actually a member of the witch hazel group of plants. Also called Persian Ironwood, it is from Iran. I don't remember where I got it but I was in the heyday of my rare plant collecting days.

 

[coh]

I saw one 30 odd years ago at Winterthur in the Brandywine Valley, DE. Stunning low branched very wide tree that is highly remnescent of a beech, though lower and wider. It is actually a member of the witch hazel group of plants. Also called Persian Ironwood, it is from Iran. I don't remember where I got it but I was in the heyday of my rare plant collecting days.

I've seen some beautiful old specimens in parks and arboretums but don't think I've ever seen one is someone's yard. Ours sometimes produces decent fall color though some years the leaves just turn brown and hang on through most of the winter (like a beech). I have no idea how well the leaves might reduce or how twiggy they can get in a bonsai container.

 

[0soyoung]

Ahhh ...
The excitement of going where no bonsai enthusiast has gone before. Beam my up!!!

I've never played with one, but with some other species I've found that root suckers (what many gardener's call the little trees coming off the roots) root easily. If you don't want them on your tree, just cut them off, stick the cutting in a rooting medium - you may be able to open a commercial nursery .

It ought to layer pretty easily, I think, but maybe not. Some mature species loose competence to root. Choosing branches low on the trunk have better odds of success in these cases.

When one wants a masterpiece on display, one should just buy it. Then get on with the really fun stuff you're about to do (maybe - I see that isn't certain yet).

 

[penumbra]

Mine looks literally like a massive bonsai in need of pruning. It is branched nearly to the ground and is about 12 to 15 feet tall and 15 to 18 feet wide. It turns gold and orange in the fall and has some but very few leaves hanging on through the winter. I would be anxious to propagate this tree even if not for bonsai because the last few years the area has remained pretty wet even though it was fine for at least 20 years. It never dried out at all this year. (Climate change.) I must admit I find it to be a very exciting project to take on.

 

[WNC Bonsai]

I bet you miss the old viscose plant out there. I used to have a research site in the Fort Valley and during the 1980’s made the trip sometimes 3-5 days each week from Reston. Could always smell that plant about 10 miles east of Front Royal.

 

[penumbra]

I bet you miss the old viscose plant out there. I used to have a research site in the Fort Valley and during the 1980’s made the trip sometimes 3-5 days each week from Reston. Could always smell that plant about 10 miles east of Front Royal.

I remember that years ago. It was really awful.

 

[Shibui]

Have you checked that the smaller ones are really growing from the roots? Over here Parrotia self seed quite readily under the trees so these might just be seedlings.
I have seen a few as bonsai. Mostly Med - Larger size due to the leaf size. Also seems to be a little difficult to get really dense ramification on them.
Otherwise I have had no problems. Tolerates root pruning without any problem. Responds well to pruning. I haven't tried cutting right back to bare trunk but I have a feeling it would sprout well.
There is a form that has lovely dark edges to the spring leaves.

 

[penumbra]

Have you checked that the smaller ones are really growing from the roots? Over here Parrotia self seed quite readily under the trees so these might just be seedlings.
I have seen a few as bonsai. Mostly Med - Larger size due to the leaf size. Also seems to be a little difficult to get really dense ramification on them.
Otherwise I have had no problems. Tolerates root pruning without any problem. Responds well to pruning. I haven't tried cutting right back to bare trunk but I have a feeling it would sprout well.
There is a form that has lovely dark edges to the spring leaves.

Thank you for your reply. These are root sprouts. In fact, the parrottia apparently does not produce seed here as far as anyone noted has observed. Our #1 plant Guru in the states, Michael Dirr, writes that he has never seen a viable seed but that it is relatively easy to propagate from summer cuttings, which is where we get them here. The ones I have seen here all have dark edges on new leaves and the leaves are about the size of beech trees. These attributes make them so charming. When spring is here I plan to attempt layers of branches about 3 inches thick that are nearly on the ground.

 

[Mike Hennigan]

Something to add to this old thread. I’ve been working on a Parrotia persica for the last two years. This tree was repotted from a nursery can into an Anderson flat in spring of 2019. It was root pruned quite heavily and didn’t seem to mind. It is still very much in development. I have a long sacrifice leader growing to increase the trunk size. And a smaller leader I wired up this year that will serve as the next section of trunk line Once I cut off the large leader. For most of this summer I have been pruning the lower branches to begin to develop initial branch ramification, while pulling leaves off the leader every so often to keep the energy somewhat balanced and keep the lower branches strong. Basically let shoots grow four or 5 internodes, cut back to one or two.

I have found that it is very easy to get very small internodes and many of the new leaves I got on the lower branches where dramatically reduced in size. And this is without the help of a small bonsai pot and while still having strong sacrifice leaders growing. I imagine. That once this tree is in full refinement mode I could get even smaller leaves.

First two pictures are a before and after if it’s fall prune today, one of the last of my trees to still have mostly green leaves:


Next is leaf size comparison, and picture of small internodes. First pic is a large leaf from the strong leader to compare:

 

[penumbra]

A follow up on two Parrotia that I took from root sprouts. I had a third in a wood box but it didn't make it. I am going to do half a dozen air layers tomorrow and hope for some success. Dirr recommends summer cuttings, so I will be trying that too but cuttings will be much smaller than layers.

This one is kind of a raft. It is about 14-16 inches tall.

This tree is a little taller and I see a lot more potential right out of the gate.

 

[bluone23]

can we see the autumn colors?

 

[penumbra]

can we see the autumn colors?

Hasn't even started yet. Nothing has.

 

[Shibui]

Here are the 2 I'm working with down here.
This one has just gone into a bonsai pot this spring. Hoping to get some better ramification in the branching now.


Spring leaf color is impressive with Red margins round each leaf. The red will fade to plain green leaves for summer.


The other one is still developing in a plastic pot.

 

[bluone23]

This post has inspired me to order a few saplings of parrotia. Will try to ground grow them a few years.

I also searched for the tree that Anthony Joura was working on.

I can’t seem to find any recent pictures of that tree

 

[scarriedoc]

My two parrotias from air layers this year.

 

[Mats Hagström]

Hi there,

I picked up one of these at our annual sale. It’s been cut back a few times and I think it’s almost ready for ramification. It had vigorous outburst early in the spring. I’m in San Francisco. Spring and fall are our warm season with June-August being mostly windy, cold and foggy. I cut the tips of the new shoots at 4-8 nodes and did a partial defoliation based on the intense early vigor. The tree is now loosing the red periphery on the leaves. One thing that struck me about the tree when I bought in in February was the chalk light grey color of the bark. It’s almost bright grey. With the least bit of moisture the color of the bark gets much darker to a grey/brown. You can see the transition in the last picture an hr after watering. It’s been about a month since partial defoliation and I have not seen and second flush or new bud growth. I’m relatively new to bonsai so please bear with me during the learning curve. I’m curious about others experience with defoliation and continued bud growth through out summer. At the same time I defoliated the Parrotia I also did the same on some Chinese elm trees(Ulmus Parvifolia). They responded spectacularly well with tons of secondary branch formation within weeks and lots of tiny leaves.
Thank,

Mats H