Oak Cascade or not

[rockm]

My thought is the same. A cascading oak is possible but is fraught with challenges.

I never said it wasn't possible. It's not easy, particularly if you don't understand the material you're working with or the mechanics of bonsai.

FWIW, if the "oak image" is what someone is after, other species can fill in for the species and do it perhaps better. Boxwood in particular. The two bonsai below are boxwood. The tall one is a Japanese box (collected from an old hedge in Arlington, Va.) made in the image of the tall mountain oaks I knew when I was a kid in the Blue Ridge. Those trees are battered by ice and wind at relatively higher elevations (like 3,000 ft.). The second is a Kingsville box made in the image of a Southern Live Oak. Both took a lot less time to develop than the 'real' oak.

 

[Weta]

I mentioned that Cascade bonsai imply alpine habitat, as another reason the style may not completely suite an oak. There are no strict natural or man-made rules that say they don't grow that way occasionally. The cascade style implies an alpine habitat, simple as that, nothing more nothing less. There is a drawing in a bonsai book somewhere that has line drawings of the bonsai styles arranged according to elevation, starting with formal upright, informal upright, semi-cascade to cascade moving from level ground to mountainside.

Lol this pic is my phones wall paper

 

[leatherback]

This thread has made me sad. Bonsainut used to be pretty much the only site where there were no discussions on "beginner attitudes" stating that one should not care what other people say what should not be done. Sad that that type of discussion now has arrived here too.

 

[Wulfskaar]

Due to the oaks in my area, I have a vision of how I want at least a couple of mine to look in 30 years. I love the huge, low branches that spread out and hope to be able to achieve that one day.

I wonder... are oaks suitable to use in clumps? It might be way easier to achieve this look with a clump.

Go HERE to see my largest oak with similar characteristics.

 

[czaczaja]

I wonder... are oaks suitable to use in clumps? It might be way easier to achieve this look with a clump.

Are you trying to move the argument from cascade to clump now Just when things have settled

 

[BrianBay9]

Pr

Due to the oaks in my area, I have a vision of how I want at least a couple of mine to look in 30 years. I love the huge, low branches that spread out and hope to be able to achieve that one day.

I wonder... are oaks suitable to use in clumps? It might be way easier to achieve this look with a clump.

Go HERE to see my largest oak with similar characteristics.

Probably 50% of the coast live oaks in the old Ft Ord area (Monterey) are in clumps - from 3 to as many as nine trunks. I'm guessing most of those arise from squirrels' acorn stashes.

 

[rockm]

Oaks grow in clumps. They're called 'motts.' The motts are communities of live oak (Texas live oak does this, as does Virginiana live oak in the south) that are formed from the roots of older trees. Clumps are appropriate for live oaks at least. It's not hard to do if you have live oak. I have to fight off the root suckering every summer with my oak.

 

[Wulfskaar]

Oaks grow in clumps. They're called 'motts.' The motts are communities of live oak (Texas live oak does this, as does Virginiana live oak in the south) that are formed from the roots of older trees. Clumps are appropriate for live oaks at least. It's not hard to do if you have live oak. I have to fight off the root suckering every summer with my oak.

This is great news and it never dawned on me to try an oak clump until reading through this thread.

I have many 1-3 year old coast live oaks. Is there a cutoff as far as age goes to try clumping 5 or so together? I am very nervous to repot the young ones because pretty much all of them die within a few months of me doing so.

Are you trying to move the argument from cascade to clump now Just when things have settled

No arguing here! This thread just sparked a thought about using clumps of oaks to get trees with large, wide branching like I showed in the pictures.

 

[bonsai-novice]

Do English oak fuse together well? I have probably the best part of a dozen oak trees which are probably 3-5 years old?
I've never tried fusing trees together so not sure whether that would be something to consider or not?

 

[Paradox]

None of my Oak seedlings are formal upright but I'm no professional , thinking I'm might even cascade this one on its first repot.
Im thinking weights rather than wire. View attachment 523802

Due to how this tree has grown it makes much more sense as a cascade than an already ram rod straight trunk that is already lignified to to point where it can't be bent into a realistic shape for cascade/semi cascade.

Not sure if it grew that way naturally or was wired into that shape when younger and more bendable, but this is my point.

 

[bonsai-novice]

Also, my tree is still very flexible even at the base of the trunk. I just wasn't able to bend it and take the picture at the same time, so it looks more rigid than it actually is

 

[bonsai-novice]

Also, my tree is actually very flexible still right down to the base of the trunk. I just wasn't able to bend it there and take the photo at the same time.

 

[rockm]

Do English oak fuse together well? I have probably the best part of a dozen oak trees which are probably 3-5 years old?
I've never tried fusing trees together so not sure whether that would be something to consider or not?

There are no real short cuts to a decent trunk. If you have seedlings to do it, no reason not to. However, it can take just as long as growing out a single sapling with mostly inferior results. Some species fuse more easily. You're unlikely to get the same results with oak as with thin barked species like trident maple. The thick bark on your oaks could be 'mismatched' as they mature.

Also a note--repeated drastic bending and flexing of a trunk or branch can damage the function of the tissues in them. It crushes cells that then die off. Do that too many times and you wind up with severe die back.

 

[BrianBay9]

There are no real short cuts to a decent trunk. If you have seedlings to do it, no reason not to. However, it can take just as long as growing out a single sapling with mostly inferior results. Some species fuse more easily. You're unlikely to get the same results with oak as with thin barked species like trident maple. The thick bark on your oaks could be 'mismatched' as they mature.

Also a note--repeated drastic bending and flexing of a trunk or branch can damage the function of the tissues in them. It crushes cells that then die off. Do that too many times and you wind up with severe die back.

I've been growing coast live oak seedlings tied tightly together for four years now. No real fusion on these guys yet. I'm guessing it's not going to happen. Still they make nice looking clumps / tight group plantings.

 

[czaczaja]

I've been growing coast live oak seedlings tied tightly together for four years now. No real fusion on these guys yet. I'm guessing it's not going to happen. Still they make nice looking clumps / tight group plantings.

Have you any pics of those in one of your threads?

 

[milehigh_7]

I saw a statement somewhere in here saying we, in essence, impose our will on our trees. I think this is backwards and will lead to results that don’t look natural. My philosophy is to allow the tree to speak and to guide it into what it wants to become. This entails not only how it looks at the start of the process but knowing and planning for the natural tendencies of the tree.

Can you make your oaks cascade? Sure. As a rule will they look natural or convincing? Will it thrive? Maybe not. However, there is really no better teacher than just trying it and learning from the experience.