My Nellie's participation in the JBP Contest

[my nellie]

Well, @Anthony has managed to persuade me to participate in the contest
He has very kindly sent the seeds from Trinidad as a gift!

Seeds were sent on 28/02/2018 and received on 16/03/2018 safe and sound
They had been already stratified so I just soaked them in lukewarm water for 48hrs. starting on 18/03/2018. After 48hrs. no seed was floating.
Then they were planted into individual small pots using substrate appropriate for seed sowing mixed with some fine pumice and lava sand. Substrate had been watered prior to sowing the seeds.
Two trays of individual pots (4 x 5 = 20) were planted with two seeds per pot. Total seeds sown 20 x 2 x 2 = 80
The trays have been covered with clear plastic sheet in order to reduce loss of moisture and are resting at the balcony receiving sun and light.
However, during the night I move them inside because the weather has changed to more cold the last few days.



That's all for now...

 

[CWTurner]

Japanese pine, from Trinidad to Greece. Talk about globalism.
Good luck!
CW

 

[Anthony]

24 hr soak or 48 hr soak ?
Anthony

* you are not seeing the set up here, no madam
It's just old trays on the concrete.

 

[my nellie]

@CWTurner thank you very much!
Globalism, exactly! But in its beneficial aspect!

@Anthony 48hrs soak and sown on 20/03/2018
These trays are cheap stuff and very lightweight. In fact these are composed of two pieces, one tray with the individual pots and a second tray (similar form) which is kind of a base for the first one.
In order to make them a bit more sturdy, I glued them on two pieces of plywood along the two longest sides.
Drilled some holes on the plywood, fastened two pieces of thick wire, wrapped the plastic around and Voilà!!!

 

[Anthony]

Sharing Alexandra -

Hah, I cut one seedling tray in half yesterday, easier to move and tidy out
early weeds.

Be warned, the Bonsai Today Article shows the gentleman, removing small seeds,
reserving the medium sized and using the big ones.

If I did that with seeds we have, you would end up with about 20 to 30 big seeds out
of 100.

This generic seed is also not as dependable as the one from Japan. So far 7 dead.
Never had any dead from the Japanese seed.
Probably why the sellers were so generous with the seed.

This competition seed will not be mixed in any way with out stock for propogation
by hardwood cuttings.
So after the competition, if 10 or 20 were chosen, they will be given away.
Unless they have 1" [ 2.5 cm ] needles naturally.

Planning to plant some of the good stock up at Toco, heavy layers of silica based
gravel [ but in brown - not white ] Get our own trees for seed.
No more need to import.

How about at the farm ?
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Anthony]

Alexandra,

with regards to the cutting of the seedling early in it's life.
From the article Bonsai 12 - page 26

Here is an image of the root placement.
It's a surface root arrangement. Notice how it is spread and imagine as it ages
how it will fatten and continue to spread out.



This how the soft wooded trees do it down here.

Not the upside down v's so often seen.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[my nellie]

... ...Hah, I cut one seedling tray in half yesterday, easier to move and tidy out early weeds.

How big was it before? ​

Mine are 5 x 4 as I said above. ​

Be warned, the Bonsai Today Article shows the gentleman, removing small seeds,
reserving the medium sized and using the big ones.

It's understandable. This is the normal way to separate the seeds in order to get the best possible results (germination) but there is always tret... ​

How about at the farm ?

Which farm? Mine? You must be joking!​

The place is full of Pinus halepensis, a forest of Aleppo pines that is! ​

​

 

[my nellie]

... ...Here is an image of the root placement.
It's a surface root arrangement. Notice how it is spread and imagine as it ages
how it will fatten and continue to spread out.

So, this is a tree propagated by a seed and its tap root has never been removed?
I noticed you have already said elsewhere that at your place soft wood trees have this characteristic of developing surface roots. It's interesting.

 

[Anthony]

No, no, Alexandra, [ said softly ]

that image is what you are working towards, when you cut the seedling's roots.

The trays were almost 61 cm and about 30 cm wide and floppy.
Anthony

 

[my nellie]

Understood!
Thank you!

 

[AlainK]

Good luck with these, Αλεξάνδρα

I can't compte, all those I have are 3-year-old seedlings, so I'll support you

 

[my nellie]

Thank you @AlainK !
I am sure it will be exciting growing the seeds and I do hope I have some luck with them.
My previous attempts with seeds was a failure...

I was surprised to read you are growing pines from seed!
Have you used any of these techniques (tap root removing or seedling cutting) on your seedlings?

 

[AlainK]

Have you used any of these techniques (tap root removing or seedling cutting) on your seedlings?

No, never, but I've read many accounts from people who do it and apparently it works well.

 

[my nellie]

Hello everyone

This is an update of my seeds which were sown on 20/03/2018.
They are moving veeeery slowly.... and I am kind of disappointed...
Positive fact is I have had no fungus mold as of today. I hope this will continue to be the situation.

The very first one germinated on April 11th and it is still having its "cap" on
I wonder, should I give it some help to take off its "hat"? I'd rather not!


Two more seeds germinated both on April 15th


@Anthony what do you think of the "success" rate up to now?

 

[Anthony]

Dearest Αλεξάνδρα,

@my nellie ,

I am hoping you get 20 to 30.
And at the end of the year, 15 to 10.

Then next year I will send you another batch of seeds.

This is is the only way to learn ----- do -------- take written notes - do - ........................ repeat

Plus after all of this, all you really want is 3 to 5 ---------- remember year six
the pot is 30 to 40 cm and 15 cm deep.
Needs full sun and plenty space.

And I will also teach you after year 3 to take hardwood cuttings and get
yet more plants ----- use as bargaining for other plant types.

Plus don't you have more seeds to plant ?
Best of Growing.
Anthony

* If really unsure ask a nursery or government pine planting section for
help in your climate.

 

[AlainK]

They are moving veeeery slowly.... and I am kind of disappointed...

Bonsoir Alexandra,

How many of them do you have? It could be interesting to make "seedling cuttings" with some of them, don't you think?...

I don't know exactly what the weather is like where you live at the moment, but I think misting saplings twice or three times a day could help until they establish roots.

 

[my nellie]

@Anthony and @AlainK thank you for your response

80 seeds sown on March 20th.

After 24 days (as of today) only three seeds have germinated.

Seed trays are fine-misted once or twice a day and watered (by a hose nozzle-misting) on demand.

Mean temperatures
Monthly min = 9,6 C
Monthly max = 20,2 C
Humidity = 61,7 %
During current month : max 27,6 C and min 17,2 C

I tend to believe that I do not have the "charisma" (this is not my first attempt with seeds...)

 

[Anthony]

And did you check the soil's temperature ?

Air temperature here for April - 32 deg.C max for less than 30 minutes..
Night - 22 deg.C - and that is the lowest
We are also dry and breezy. Humidity around 60 % and can go to 40%.
No rain.

Seeds planted in 30 % commercial peat moss / perlite blend
Sifted to remove large perlite particles.
70 % 5 mm silica based gravel.
Or 3 shovels to 7 shovels / 3 parts to 7 parts.

Soaked for 24 hrs in tap water ------- note above night temperature
Germination 7 to 10 to 20 days.

Tray watered once a day in the early morning.

You are allowed to sow into the clay pots Image and size, is left on my J.B.pine entry.
That way you avoid the transplanting saga.

Then all you do is water and fertilise , until next year.

Some one reported that J.B.pines might germinate better in sunlight, on this
list.
Hang in there, I have already lined up a supplier for you from Germany, via
Amazon UK.
So if you need to push the panic button.

Best of growing and ----------------- relaaaaaaaaax, okay

Remember - 15 cm and below training starts next year,30 cm starts year three,
So you have many years to grow ----------
Anthony

K sent this -

 

[my nellie]

@Anthony thank you for your reply.

My regards and thanks to K

 

[my nellie]

On May 7th one more seed sprouted. It looks really more vigorous than the previous.

All three previous seedlings wilted and died.

So all have now is this new one and only

This is really fun!