Material I have

[owenislush]

all valid points and I've found a nursery specializing in bonsai, trees and shrubs so i will visit that and see what sort of prices things are... and from that article ( i only quickly scanned it) its looking like i can just use plain cat litter ? when i say funds are limited, i meant i dont want to be forkin out like 100+ quid for one tree just for it to die! so after the replies to this thread i think i'll be buyin a few tree's then posting again with what i can do with some better/further on material! Thanks, owen.

 

[Attila Soos]

...and I've found a nursery specializing in bonsai, trees and shrubs so i will visit that and see what sort of prices things are...

That's the spirit. When visiting a decent bonsai nursery, and talking to somebody who really wants to help, you'll be surprised that getting a decent beginner tree is not as expensive as you feared. Plus, you will get some first-hand advice on how to keep it healthy. You don't need to spend years, trying to re-invent the wheel.

(and, of course, you need to watch out for those unscrupulous ones, trying to sell you expensive junk)

 

[alonsou]

Just trying to support what Attila mentioned previously, this is what $45 will get you here in Los Angeles @ the local bonsai nursery



As you can see still a pre-bonsai but it has a lot more future, this one, was just barely rough styled just to define the main shape of it, from this point on, it will be resting and preparing for its first wiring in the coming months.

$45 dollars will give me the satisfaction and will keep me busy for a little while.

I will strongly suggest you to join a local bonsai club, you will get invaluable help from it, at my local club they even offer raffles and workshops where I can take any tree and they will provide me with help to a successful bonsai, maybe not a masterpiece, but a nice decent bonsai.

As far as the cat litter, there is a lot of talk going on about it, never used it so I can't help with that. My personal preference its the following, Diatomaceous earth (75~80%) pine bark (10%) red lava rock (10~15%) and a couple of handfuls of pumice, my trees love this mix, and less than $20 dollars will get me some 35 lbs of it, enough for a couple of dozen trees.

 

[DannyBonsai]

that juniper is just begging for some jins/shari and maybe some work on the nebari. all the local nurseries around here have are little juniper/ficus/schefflera cuttings in a bonsai pot and sold for $30 when the same plant is for sale next to it as "just a regular plant" for half that. thats why I save my time there. for me, lowes/home depot has fair prices and good potential trees, and there is always yamadori if you know some people with land... I live on 75 acres of pine forest, so i may try a few yellow pine if I knew where to begin with pines!

 

[catfish chapstick]

i guess everyone has a different take than me.. i wish i hadn't wasted any money on so-called prebonsai when i started out. if i could go back in time i would tell myself to start collecting plants initially and buy stock later on when i have a better eye for stock. yes there is a learning curve and it takes more time but that is, in part, what makes it so much more rewarding.

 

[Dav4]

i guess everyone has a different take than me.. i wish i hadn't wasted any money on so-called prebonsai when i started out. if i could go back in time i would tell myself to start collecting plants initially and buy stock later on when i have a better eye for stock. yes there is a learning curve and it takes more time but that is, in part, what makes it so much more rewarding.

How can you collect trees with GOOD POTENTIAL if you don't yet have a good eye for stock? To me, it sounds like you have things backwards. Until you actually know what is worth collecting, you are more often then not wasting your time digging mediocre to useless material out of the ground...kinda like going to a big box store or regular nursery for your pre-bonsai stock. Your eye for "good" stock will only improve by consistent exposure to good bonsai...

 

[Attila Soos]

Just trying to support what Attila mentioned previously, this is what $45 will get you here in Los Angeles @ the local bonsai nursery

That's what I'm talking about. Nothing spectacular, just a decent beginner bonsai material. And if you keep it in full sun and good draining soil, very easy to keep it healthy.

 

[Attila Soos]

How can you collect trees with GOOD POTENTIAL if you don't yet have a good eye for stock? To me, it sounds like you have things backwards. Until you actually know what is worth collecting, you are more often then not wasting your time digging mediocre to useless material out of the ground...kinda like going to a big box store or regular nursery for your pre-bonsai stock.

That's right.
Until one develops a good eye for bonsai potential, this is the time when one should use the advise of experienced club members, or a mentor/teacher.

 

[catfish chapstick]

How can you collect trees with GOOD POTENTIAL if you don't yet have a good eye for stock? To me, it sounds like you have things backwards. Until you actually know what is worth collecting, you are more often then not wasting your time digging mediocre to useless material out of the ground...kinda like going to a big box store or regular nursery for your pre-bonsai stock. Your eye for "good" stock will only improve by consistent exposure to good bonsai...

its the act of, or the experience that is of value, even if the material is ultimately useless. not to mention the hunt. none of it is worth collecting if you don't know how to do so with success.

 

[DannyBonsai]

in my opinion, an eye for bonsai canidates is aquired over time, and makes no difference between whether it is in a pot on a shelf or in the ground. when I started, i bought several trees, and collected several trees, which, for all intents and purposes, could have neen identical to the nursery stock, yet they were all crap. now, I can sort of plan ahead as to what style, size, etc. I am just a novice but I honestly think the only thing about nursery stock is convenience. but think back to ancient times, the literati and bonsai entheusiasts couldn't just go down the street and buy a plant. I think those pre bonsai as mentioned are fine, but it feels sort of like a paint-by-number, rather than actualy designing the work yourself, you are just adding to what has already been done. for me, I get as much enjoyment out of finding trees and waiting to transplant (at least it is something to look foreward to) as i do styling the trees. now, I live in a large stand of trees, in a microclimate very similar to temperate china/Japan. Most traditional trees would grow well here, and many local trees lend themselvesa well to bonsai, although I have not taken advantage of this like I should, but for those in citys/towns or where collecting is illegal or impractical, Nursery stock is a good alternative. but back to my point, I don't think that you have to, or really should, start with nursery stock to get an eye for it. look at natural trees around you, look how the best pieces of that species are styled, and then find one that could be trained similarly. Of course, I also am a fanatic over tropicals, and not just for bonsai, so nurserys do have their place. as someone said above, just get a shovel, some pots, and know the best time of the year (and permission to collect, if neccesary!)

But thats just my opinion. you know what they say, Different strokes for different blokes.

 

[wlambeth]

Since your in the UK google a guy named Harry Harrington, he lives in the UK and is very good bonsai artist.
I know in the UK you guys have plenty of wild growing hawthorns (cretageous monogyna).
If you can find a landowner that would allow you to dig some up then thats a good way to get some bonsai ready stock for little or no cost (sweat equity).
BUT YOU MUST GET PERMISSION FROM THE LANDOWNER.

Do a google search on yamadori and read.

If you choose to hit the garden centres look for plants that have twisting, curving, mishapen trunks.
Let them grow, repot the next fall into a a good draining soil mix. Stay away from any soil that says "moisture control."

Good luck

 

[Attila Soos]

.... but it feels sort of like a paint-by-number, rather than actualy designing the work yourself, you are just adding to what has already been done.

Most of the time, when I buy pre-bonsai, I completely re-design it. Also, bonsai nurseries have lots of raw material with good bonsai qualities, and with plenty of branches left on, so that you have many options to choose from. So, there is infinite room for being creative. You just have to use your imagination.

 

[rockm]

I'd have to agree with Attila, most of the pre-bonsai stock I've bought is pretty far from "paint by number." Mostly You get a trunk and more than a few branches with most quality bonsai material. Some are simply plants are chosen by bonsai nurseries simply for their nebari and have had nothing else done to them. It's largely up to you to "find" the tree in such material. I've also bought japanese maple cuttings that were simply shoved into a pot and left alone for ten years--which resulted in a nice bunch of two and three inch trunks that fused together at the bottom...however, the six feet of top growth on all of those trunks had also been left alone...finding the right things to leave and the things that had to go wasn't what I'd call easy or formulaic.

 

[tanlu]

Owenislush,

I'm too lazy to go through what everyone else already said, however I've been your shoes, an unemployed bonsai beginner surviving off nickels and dimes, and I did it for about a year! Bonsai CAN be done on the cheap, BUT you must be a well informed shopper. Do your homework before you go blowing off money you don't have.

First, educate yourself with accurate information on bonsai cultivation and horticulture. I highly recommend joining a bonsai club, and/or befriend bonsai enthusiasts. Google search these people and read their articles. Brent Waltson (evergreengardenworks.com), Julian Adams (adamsbonsai.com), Walter Pall (http://walter-pall.de), and Harry Harrington (bonsai4me.com), he's also from the UK, so he has a firm understanding of your local climate and how it will effect your bonsai.

Another great website for beginners by Brent Waltson: http://www.bonsaiprimer.com/creating/garden/garden.html

Nurseries are fine places to find great material, but you need to learn what attributes (developed nebari, thick tapered trunk, healthy foliage) to look for, otherwise you'll end up buying things that will never become bonsai. Also certain species are more suitable for bonsai than others. Read those articles, learn about the species that work in your climate.

Looking forward to see what you buy!

 

[rockm]

The best and cheapest source of excellent (sometimes awesome AND cheap) material is a club. A maple that may go for $300-$400 at a nursery can go for as little as $25 or $30 at a club auction. You might also run into club members that will simply GIVE you trees they don't really have room for, or can't find the time to work on...

 

[DannyBonsai]

I'd have to agree with Attila, most of the pre-bonsai stock I've bought is pretty far from "paint by number." Mostly You get a trunk and more than a few branches with most quality bonsai material. Some are simply plants are chosen by bonsai nurseries simply for their nebari and have had nothing else done to them. It's largely up to you to "find" the tree in such material. I've also bought japanese maple cuttings that were simply shoved into a pot and left alone for ten years--which resulted in a nice bunch of two and three inch trunks that fused together at the bottom...however, the six feet of top growth on all of those trunks had also been left alone...finding the right things to leave and the things that had to go wasn't what I'd call easy or formulaic.

I admit most nurseries do have nice trees, but the ones around here that even have anything to do with bonsai are just twigs thrown in a pot. I wish there were more garden centers around here, because most are either way too far to warrant the trip or they charge an arm ald a leg for what could be bought at lowes for $10. the downside to living in the boonies: lots of yamadori but hardly any nursery stock that is any good.

 

[Bill S]

Rockm is right, this past weekend our club had a picnic/workshop/auction, I got a nice crabapple for $20, someone else got a yew I donated for $3.00 (we have a rule you can't bid for your donation, or it would have gone back home with me), there were a bunch more including a larch I got for about $10.00, not to mention the assorted pots, and tools etc. Got a decent pair of small pruners for $6.00, almost new condition, these auctions are worth the cost of dues by themselves. Not saying all club auctions give things away this cheap all the time, but the bargins and knowledge are priceless.

If there is a bonsai nursery around volenteer to help clean up on the weekends , when asked why, so you can absorb what it is all about, show a passion to learn, could lead to all the answers you need, and then some.

 

[rockm]

"Bonsai boonies" is a relative term. I drive a couple of hours through some of the worst traffic the East Coast has to offer to get to my favorite nursery here in Va. I've also occasionally driven four more to get to others several states away.

North Carolina has a vibrant bonsai scene, from the arboretum to clubs and suppliers:
http://www.bonsaicarolina.com/Clubs.html
http://www.bonsailearningcenter.com/
http://www.thegrowinggrounds.com/
http://matsumomiji.com/

 

[DannyBonsai]

thanks, Ill check those out sometime!

 

[Smoke]

Don't forget to check ebay for listings of "bonsai seeds" these are a must for fast awesome bonsai down the road.

Just purshase, plant and water. Within a year or two masterpiece bonsai will be your prize. Using superthrive will cut the growout time in half.

Good luck, Al