Let's try to style a juniper

[bonsaibp]

Now you have the gears spinning. I'll have to go out and look with a new perspective now.

 

[tmmason10]

Starting to look a little like my tattoo! Hmmm something to consider.

If you're wondering yes it is a Naka drawing that was in BT. When I asked if I could use it he said I was crazy but go ahead- at least the tree would live as long as me I did. He was a funny guy.

That's great, you ask us for advice on styling when you have the blueprint on yourself! I say why not try to style this tree like the tattoo sketch.

 

[bonsaibp]

I am always in awe of people who can do good virts- and a little jealous of even the simple ones. Don't know how and am not willing to make time to learn. Having said that here is a very, very rough virt of what I originally had in mind. This should at least give a basic idea.
Now I've got to look at it better after class tonight.

Remember this is only a vague suggestion of the original idea.

pretty basic a roundish crown and a dropping branch.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I've heard about spider mites, but this is ridiculous! (or) Free the bonsai, free the bonsai! (or) Bonsaiman, bonsaiman, does whatever a bonsai can...

 

[Bonsai Nut]

All joking aside, reminds me of the ABS logo

 

[bonsaibp]

Said it was rough!!!
Actually I was think several layers of foliage creating a round crown branch and the dropping
formed into several layers of foliage as well. Something similar to this but fuller.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Said it was rough!!!

You know I was just messing with you It really DOES remind me of the ABS logo.

 

[drew33998]

I accept the challenge!!! Here's a different design based on the descending primary branch.

All hail to the bonsai nut admin. I am not worthy.

 

[A Random User]

For what it is worth...
The designs that are currently being thrown around
in my opinion do not interact enough with the trunk...

There is too much space between the foliage pads and
the trunk, which gives a feeling of the foliage being
an after thought.... which in a way, I guess it kinda is ???

Personal opinion... it needs to really be brought back in
tighter against the trunk, and more compact. The branch
that was removed and now a jin, is competing with your
lower right branch, it is on the same plane, too perfectly
parallel... and in essence more than likely now should just
be removed all together if you are going to place your
bottom branch in the same location.

You have a very curvy trunk, with all proposed
straight branches...

Lastly... the easiest way to make a tall tree seem smaller is by
breaking up the trunk with foliage. What this does is it prevents
the viewers eye from traveling and following the trunk all the
way up the tree.

 

[Si Nguyen]

Cool tree Bob. It has to be a bunjin right? I don't know what front is best. Can't tell from these flat pictures. Here's a few thumbnail sketches based on your last post. Basically the silhouette of the foliage (the green mass ) needs to be smaller and closer to the trunk, IMHO. You will do it justice I am sure.

 

[bonsaibp]

For what it is worth...
The designs that are currently being thrown around
in my opinion do not interact enough with the trunk...

There is too much space between the foliage pads and
the trunk, which gives a feeling of the foliage being
an after thought.... which in a way, I guess it kinda is ???

Personal opinion... it needs to really be brought back in
tighter against the trunk, and more compact. The branch
that was removed and now a jin, is competing with your
lower right branch, it is on the same plane, too perfectly
parallel... and in essence more than likely now should just
be removed all together if you are going to place your
bottom branch in the same location.

You have a very curvy trunk, with all proposed
straight branches...

Lastly... the easiest way to make a tall tree seem smaller is by
breaking up the trunk with foliage. What this does is it prevents
the viewers eye from traveling and following the trunk all the
way up the tree.

I don't think anyone is proposing straight branches- it has been mentioned a number of times by makers of the virts that there needs to be more movement. It is going to take a couple of years to bring the foliage as tight as it should be because there is not a lot of inner foliage. I haven't decided yet if I want the tree to look shorter -which was my original idea , and to bring all the foliage down or to highlight the trunk movement and length by keeping the foliage away from the lower part.

 

[bonsaibp]

Great sketches- 3 is kind of like what I had in mind except for a rounder crown and more foliage. I think the trunk is a little too thick for a true bunjin.

 

[nathanbs]

Great sketches- 3 is kind of like what I had in mind except for a rounder crown and more foliage. I think the trunk is a little too thick for a true bunjin.

Too skinny and lacks taper to be anything but a bunjin in my opinion

 

[Si Nguyen]

Too skinny and lacks taper to be anything but a bunjin in my opinion

Yep! It looks like a bunjin to me too. I don't know what Old Bob is talking about. He must be smoking some of that weed from his nursery.

 

[bonsaibp]

It doesn't really have the quietness of character- I know that doesn't explain but that's the best way I can think of putting it now, to be a good bunjin. Sure I could style it to look like a bunjin but it wouldn't feel right , to me anyhow. It may even end up looking like one but I don't ever see me thinking it was one.
It's not the best material in the world but there's a decent tree in there- just not a bunjin.
I think most would agree that a really good bunjin is a rare thing- especially in the US. Don't mean to rattle any cages or start a war here this is just my personal opinion.
Starting this post has been interesting. I had a pretty good idea where I was going take the tree but I thought it could be fun to see what the rest of you thought. It has made me think of several alternatives to my original idea which doesn't happen often. Now I'm going through some different possibilities and may very well do something different. I won't try to duplicate the tattoo though!
I'm going to make some decisions and I'll post some pics of the process.

 

[nathanbs]

It doesn't really have the quietness of character- I know that doesn't explain but that's the best way I can think of putting it now, to be a good bunjin. Sure I could style it to look like a bunjin but it wouldn't feel right , to me anyhow. It may even end up looking like one but I don't ever see me thinking it was one.
It's not the best material in the world but there's a decent tree in there- just not a bunjin.
I think most would agree that a really good bunjin is a rare thing- especially in the US. Don't mean to rattle any cages or start a war here this is just my personal opinion.
Starting this post has been interesting. I had a pretty good idea where I was going take the tree but I thought it could be fun to see what the rest of you thought. It has made me think of several alternatives to my original idea which doesn't happen often. Now I'm going through some different possibilities and may very well do something different. I won't try to duplicate the tattoo though!
I'm going to make some decisions and I'll post some pics of the process.

i agree that it doesn't have that "feeling" either. But does it ever in the pre-bonsai form? It is still very raw and has soo much going on. Until its simplified I dont think you will witness its "quietness of character"

 

[bonsaibp]

i agree that it doesn't have that "feeling" either. But does it ever in the pre-bonsai form? It is still very raw and has soo much going on. Until its simplified I dont think you will witness its "quietness of character"

For me I usually know right away when I see a tree that I would consider a true bunjin. Even as raw stock. Not that I don't make and sell trees in the bunjin style. The style and the essence of the style are two different things. You made this comment earlier- Too skinny and lacks taper to be anything but a bunjin in my opinion
Yes those are two characteristics of bunjin trees but they don't make a tree a bunjin. The standard solution for tall thin trees is to try to make them look like a literati styled trees. I think thats a mistake. Tall thin trees can be styled in any style that suits that particular tree not just a couple of tufts of foliage and a curvy trunk. For me true literati trees invoke a deep but subtle feeling of peace , quietness wonder of nature and have a simple elegance. They also should have no signs of mans intervention even though there surely was. I've made literally hundreds of bunjin style trees and maybe 2-3 true bunjins. Again this is just my opinion- it work for me but may not for anyone else and thats ok.

 

[nathanbs]

For me I usually know right away when I see a tree that I would consider a true bunjin. Even as raw stock. Not that I don't make and sell trees in the bunjin style. The style and the essence of the style are two different things. You made this comment earlier- Too skinny and lacks taper to be anything but a bunjin in my opinion
Yes those are two characteristics of bunjin trees but they don't make a tree a bunjin. The standard solution for tall thin trees is to try to make them look like a literati styled trees. I think thats a mistake. Tall thin trees can be styled in any style that suits that particular tree not just a couple of tufts of foliage and a curvy trunk. For me true literati trees invoke a deep but subtle feeling of peace , quietness wonder of nature and have a simple elegance. They also should have no signs of mans intervention even though there surely was. I've made literally hundreds of bunjin style trees and maybe 2-3 true bunjins. Again this is just my opinion- it work for me but may not for anyone else and thats ok.

So just for the sake of argument you feel that a better miyogi can be made out of this material than a bunjin? I never said this will make a great bunjin I simply said that given the characteristics that it has that is your BEST option, not your ONLY option. I would rather make a decent bunjin than a mediocre slant, informal upright, cascade, or whatever other style you can think of. Just my opinion as well.

 

[bonsaibp]

Hopefully it won't end up a mediocre anything.
I started putting on raffia and wiring this afternoon. Still not 100% about where it is going to end up but its on its way. The was one of the most difficult raffia jobs I've done in a long time. There are a ton of branches that needed it right next to each other. On top of that te phone rang every 5 minutes and I keep scratching my self on the branches. I got lazy and didn't raffia everything and every one I didn't that I've wired I cracked- nothing too bad but a break in every one with no raffia. This is an old tree with really stiff branches. I'll rafffia the rest before any more wiring.
Anyhow here is where we're at now. Not to far for almost 2 1/2 hours work.

 

[bonsaibp]

So just for the sake of argument you feel that a better miyogi can be made out of this material than a bunjin? I never said this will make a great bunjin I simply said that given the characteristics that it has that is your BEST option, not your ONLY option. I would rather make a decent bunjin than a mediocre slant, informal upright, cascade, or whatever other style you can think of. Just my opinion as well.

To tell the truth I still don't know if another style will be better. Thats pretty much subjective anyhow, what I may like you may not and what you may like someone may hate. I just want to do something creative that I can feel good about with this tree.
In any case if I don't like where it ends up I'll just put it out for sale- I can't keep everything to play with anyhow.