JBP Any help appreciated!

[sm314]

Hi ppl!

Reaching out on hope of a little help (and hope).

I've grown this JBP now for about 1 year.

It had been growing steadily and was repotted after about 6 months and continued with no issues. It is planted in bonsai soil with a lava rock layer at the bottom and is fertilised every other week. It is kept on a window ledge indoors in the UK.

Suddenly as you can see from the images a new large bud sprouted early December and hasn't opened up yet and over the last week the plant has started to yellow and brown near the top going downwards and seems to be getting worse sadly.

After reading other posts it seems I'm likely just going to get advice that the tree has bit the dust and nothing can be done.

I'm basically wondering whether it is worth fully repotting on a larger pot, trimming needles and roots etc in the hope of reviving ... Or is it too far gone at this point?

Appreciate any help and advice. Thx

 

[Paradox]

Hi ppl!

Reaching out on hope of a little help (and hope).

I've grown this JBP now for about 1 year.

It had been growing steadily and was repotted after about 6 months and continued with no issues. It is planted in bonsai soil with a lava rock layer at the bottom and is fertilised every other week. It is kept on a window ledge indoors in the UK.

Suddenly as you can see from the images a new large bud sprouted early December and hasn't opened up yet and over the last week the plant has started to yellow and brown near the top going downwards and seems to be getting worse sadly.

After reading other posts it seems I'm likely just going to get advice that the tree has bit the dust and nothing can be done.

I'm basically wondering whether it is worth fully repotting on a larger pot, trimming needles and roots etc in the hope of reviving ... Or is it too far gone at this point?

Appreciate any help and advice. Thx

I dont think it is too far gone....yet, but its not far from it.
A repot will not solve the problem or help the tree at this point though.

The bud you mention looks fine, it shouldn't be opening yet.
Buds form in the fall and just sit all winter and open in the spring so its probably too early for that right now.

First some questions for you.
Where are you located? Please put your location on your profile so we dont have to repeatedly ask.
How often are you watering it?
Does it drain when you water?

EDIT: I missed a couple of details from reading too fast...
As mentioned below, inside is a death sentence for a pine. They can not live inside, they need a dormancy period which is an extended period (months) below 40 degrees F.
Unfortunately, if it hasnt had a chance to get ready for dormancy in the fall from cooler temperatures and shorter days because its been inside, just throwing it outside now probably wont work unless its above 40 degrees F at least.

 

[cmu268]

My guess is it's probably a goner - you mentioned it lives on a window sill indoors, which doesn't work for most trees...they really need to be outside. You could try putting it outside for the rest of winter and see if it rebounds enough that you can bring it back to health in the spring. I don't think repotting now is going to do much for you.

 

[RoadManDenDron]

Welcome to the forum!

Sadly it looks to me like a fungal issue as I believe I can see bands around the green needles aswell but not sure if this is from a growlight?

Jbp are fully hardy in the UK and being inside on a window ledge has not done it any favours, lack of airflow helps fungus to thrive

Its a shame because it has good growth for a year old seedling in the UK, if you have any others I would get this in the bin before it spreads! But if its your only one I would remove dead needles and treat with fungicide.

The candle will open later in spring and you want to treat it at this time to try stop fungus spreading to the new needles.

 

[sm314]

I dont think it is too far gone....yet, but its not far from it.
A repot will not solve the problem or help the tree at this point though.

The bud you mention looks fine, it shouldn't be opening yet.
Buds form in the fall and just sit all winter and open in the spring so its probably too early for that right now.

First some questions for you.
Where are you located? Please put your location on your profile so we dont have to repeatedly ask.
How often are you watering it?
Does it drain when you water?

EDIT: I missed a couple of details from reading too fast...
As mentioned below, inside is a death sentence for a pine. They can not live inside, they need a dormancy period which is an extended period (months) below 40 degrees F.
Unfortunately, if it hasnt had a chance to get ready for dormancy in the fall from cooler temperatures and shorter days because its been inside, just throwing it outside now probably wont work unless its above 40 degrees F at least

Thanks for the speedy reply. I will update profile shortly.

No problem

I water it once a week thoroughly every other with fertiliser until the water drains out through the bottom of the pot there are multiple holes and meshing at the bottom.

Putting it outside was my thought but weather is unpredictable here it can go from 51 f to 28 f such as this morning . I do have a sort of zip up plastic greenhouse frame I can leave it in which could help I guess? Or wait until it has a couple of days of milder weather to let it acclimatise somewhat.

 

[sm314]

My guess is it's probably a goner - you mentioned it lives on a window sill indoors, which doesn't work for most trees...they really need to be outside. You could try putting it outside for the rest of winter and see if it rebounds enough that you can bring it back to health in the spring. I don't think repotting now is going to do much for you.

Yes I sadly am inclined to agree with the speed of it's colour change unfortunately but I'd like to try either way. Green fingers I do not have but seeing it grow has given me enjoyment in a hobby v dissimilar to my other interests.. thx for the response

 

[sm314]

Welcome to the forum!

Sadly it looks to me like a fungal issue as I believe I can see bands around the green needles aswell but not sure if this is from a growlight?

Jbp are fully hardy in the UK and being inside on a window ledge has not done it any favours, lack of airflow helps fungus to thrive

Its a shame because it has good growth for a year old seedling in the UK, if you have any others I would get this in the bin before it spreads! But if its your only one I would remove dead needles and treat with fungicide.

The candle will open later in spring and you want to treat it at this time to try stop fungus spreading to the new needles.

There is a band on one of the needles but the rest with darker tips I believe are from pruning when v young before I was aware not to cut needles for aesthetics

I have noticed some of the needles appear to be curling around of themselves if this maybe lends itself to the fungal issue you mention.

Another point I added some mychorzial and watered through after repotting which I believe is the white that shows on the top soil.

Thanks for your response.

 

[cmu268]

Yes I sadly am inclined to agree with the speed of it's colour change unfortunately but I'd like to try either way. Green fingers I do not have but seeing it grow has given me enjoyment in a hobby v dissimilar to my other interests.. thx for the response

I definitely hear ya - I get a lot of enjoyment from bonsai too. I have a few small JBPs that I'm working on developing into shohin-sized trees and love seeing them at this stage.

Doesn't sound like there's many great options at the immediate moment. @Paradox makes a good point that putting it outside now may do more harm than good. It might not make it no matter what you do, so fingers crossed it will limp through winter enough so you can get it outside and nurse it back to good health. Good luck!

 

[JeffS73]

Put it in the greenhouse you mentioned. Close it at night. Open the greenhouse in the daytime for airflow. You won't need to water it very often when outside, let the soil dry out between waterings. If you mess with the roots or soil at this point it'll be toast.

It's nice to hear you've enjoyed growing something from seed, very satisfying isn't it? Maybe plant some more seeds outside now as a backstop.

 

[sm314]

Ok I will try this ... The weather for the next.week is a little.milder aswell 8 to 12 degrees so hopefully it wont be too much of a shock and it will soldier through.

Should I be altering watering habits do you think?

Yes just watching it grow especially at the start is fascinating to see each day.

I've got a batch of Chinese elms I believe which have been out all winter which I'm hoping will come good but I think I will put another couple of trays out now too I'd like to get another one growing if this one does not survive.

A little offtopic but can any of you suggest others you have tried growing indoors at all?

 

[Shibui]

Ficus species do well indoors. Even they like some time outside when the weather is good but can cope with permanent indoor life.
Other tropical species can also cope with indoor conditions far better than any temperate species. Schefflera is another good candidate for indoor culture.
Some growers find Chinese elm cope indoors but it appears you'll need pretty good hort skills. We get loads of similar posts with indoor Chinese elms dying indoors too.

 

[sm314]

Ficus species do well indoors. Even they like some time outside when the weather is good but can cope with permanent indoor life.
Other tropical species can also cope with indoor conditions far better than any temperate species. Schefflera is another good candidate for indoor culture.
Some growers find Chinese elm cope indoors but it appears you'll need pretty good hort skills. We get loads of similar posts with indoor Chinese elms dying indoors too.

Ok I shall look into those thanks!

 

[sm314]

Hey again guys

Just wondering ... As winter here in the UK is pretty unpredictable and goes up and down constantly and will likely do so for another 2 months going below the 4 degrees as mentioned above.

I'm wondering if the tree hasn't gone dormant already would I be better just keeping it under a grow light indoors rather than outside if it is likely to die for certain in those temperatures or be shocked by such temp changes? or is putting it outside in the cold to make it dormant the goal to try hold on until spring ?

Please excuse my ignorance. Thx for the help

 

[Kevin1968]

You are not Ignorant, Just learning we have all been there and killed our fair share of trees. Just keep asking questions and try different methods, as far as the JBP, I am starting some seeds for the first time this spring so I would not be much help there yet.

I hope you can get it going again.

 

[sm314]

You are not Ignorant, Just learning we have all been there and killed our fair share of trees. Just keep asking questions and try different methods, as far as the JBP, I am starting some seeds for the first time this spring so I would not be much help there yet.

I hope you can get it going again.

Thx Kevin ... Appreciate you,

 

[Shibui]

Just wondering ... As winter here in the UK is pretty unpredictable and goes up and down constantly and will likely do so for another 2 months going below the 4 degrees as mentioned above.

4C is probably quite balmy for a JBP. They can survive much lower temps than you will ever see in the UK. I would still put it outside if possible. There's a far bigger risk keeping it indoors than you'll have, even moving it outside now IMHO

 

[sm314]

4C is probably quite balmy for a JBP. They can survive much lower temps than you will ever see in the UK. I would still put it outside if possible. There's a far bigger risk keeping it indoors than you'll have, even moving it outside now IMHO

Understood. Thankyou kinky sir. I'll take the leap today.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Guarantee: Indoors will kill the tree!
Not likely: being outdoors will harm tree

Put where will get good Sun and natural rain so does not dry out.

 

[sm314]

Hey guys little update

No been outside for a week now and there doesn't seem to have been too much change I think some of the needles that were browning have slowly continued but what was still green has mostly stayed that way from what I can tell .

Should I be doing anything with the browning needles ... There are some that are a lighter colour and some that have gone dark brown. Should I be removing these or just let it do it's thing?

In one of my poor quality photos lol I'm wondering is this the start of a new branch growing dead in the centre of the photo?


Thx for the help!

 

[Shibui]

The brown needles are dead and they cannot return to green. Dead parts will gradually fall off by themselves but if you want to intervene you can carefully cut brown needles. At this stage I would leave the centre stems as they may still be alive alive.
I can't make out the start of a new branch you mention but it should gradually become clearer in time if it is.