Good Hornbeam material?

[Scrogdor]

BTW I wouldn't cut back further than the shoot at the top of said branch, use that shoot to form part of the canopy. It also looks like there's some dormant buds that might stimulate after a cut back around mid June to July. You could treat it like a subtrunk and just have a canopy on top of it if nothing pops.

Yeah definitely some buds further down the branch. Hard to get a complete gage right now because of the nursery pot it's in and all the leaves. I'll update when leaf drop happens

 

[Scrogdor]

Here’s a couple more pictures of this beast. Not the greatest angles, but not willing to cut the rim off the pot yet, would be difficult to lift. I’ll be taking a look at the roots this spring and trying to get this into a large training pot. Also not so sure this is an American hornbeam, might be European. The tag says Caroliniana, but the leaves turned yellow only.

Owner said he may have mixed up some of the American and European’s as well when I was there last weekend.

 

[BobbyLane]

Great taper on this one
Reminds me of one I sold.
Might give you some ideas

 

[Dabbler]

The pot is great!, but is slightly too small for my taste but still a great tree!

 

[rockm]

Here’s a couple more pictures of this beast. Not the greatest angles, but not willing to cut the rim off the pot yet, would be difficult to lift. I’ll be taking a look at the roots this spring and trying to get this into a large training pot. Also not so sure this is an American hornbeam, might be European. The tag says Caroliniana, but the leaves turned yellow only.

Owner said he may have mixed up some of the American and European’s as well when I was there last weekend.

Doesn't really look like Caroliniana to me. The budding is too close and the leaves are too small for the most part. My money would be on Korean Hornbeam. Leaves on hornbeam tend to be yellow in the fall. It takes a frost or two to alter that sometimes.

 

[Scrogdor]

Looks pretty good from all the sides. The one side is a little rugged, need to carve that one area possibly. Very happy though.

 

[BobbyLane]

Looks pretty good from all the sides. The one side is a little rugged, need to carve that one area possibly. Very happy though.

Nice, I wouldnt go past the live area though, I would only hollow the dead heartwood and leave the remaining lines of the live areas on the edges. as in it will look more natural if you leave the edges that have begun to callus.

 

[Scrogdor]

Nice, I wouldnt go past the live area though, I would only hollow the dead heartwood and leave the remaining lines of the live areas on the edges. as in it will look more natural if you leave the edges that have begun to callus.

Thanks, how deep would you hollow here? What you see there is basically what I was able to crumble away with my fingers. It's very brittle.

 

[BobbyLane]

Thanks, how deep would you hollow here? What you see there is basically what I was able to crumble away with my fingers. It's very brittle.

Possibly something like this to begin with
Or just go as far as the wood is rotten for now, and ease up or decrease the diameter as the heartwood turns White. which tbh I cannot judge from your photos, you have to judge that yourself with carving tools, how deep the rotten wood goes.
Heres a video ive shared many times on here where G potter explains the difference between dead and live heartwood and speaks about depths, and callus tissue and live veins, sap flow etc and how you can safely judge the amount of live heartwood to be removed without restricting the flow of sap too much. The area in question looks quite bulky with a cluster of branches so this tends to indicate the flow is strong where you intend to begin hollowing.

 

[Scrogdor]

Doesn't really look like Caroliniana to me. The budding is too close and the leaves are too small for the most part. My money would be on Korean Hornbeam. Leaves on hornbeam tend to be yellow in the fall. It takes a frost or two to alter that sometimes.

This would certainly be a come up if it was a K hornbeam. Any other definitive ways I can tell?

 

[Scrogdor]

Not quite sure what to do with the top of this one. Almost looks like a little inverse taper with some of those big branches/ a little crowded up there.

Other point is that section too long/straight?

 

[Scrogdor]

Do I chop that section shorter for more movement/change of direction? Or is there a way to use that new leader that's growing in at the top.

 

[BobbyLane]

Its not the angle id be looking at the tree from I prefer to do my work from nearer the base looking up. But from this angle the top is too long and out of proportion to the rest of the tree. If it looks out of proportion to you, then it probably is. Look at the proportions of other trees to understand this.
Like this for example

 

[Paradox]

Yea I agree with @BobbyLane
If it were mine, I would probably chop it right above where the branches are coming out at the bottom of that straight section

 

[Scrogdor]

Its not the angle id be looking at the tree from I prefer to do my work from nearer the base looking up. But from this angle the top is too long and out of proportion to the rest of the tree. If it looks out of proportion to you, then it probably is. Look at the proportions of other trees to understand this.
Like this for example

Yea I agree with @BobbyLane
If it were mine, I would probably chop it right above where the branches are coming out at the bottom of that straight section

Some better angles and what I’m thinking if I end up chopping that last part below the inverse taper/ shorten that next section.

Definitely going to transfer into a large/deep training pot and get a better idea what it looks like in a couple months before I make any chopping decisions.

 

[BobbyLane]

Some better angles and what I’m thinking if I end up chopping that last part below the inverse taper/ shorten that next section.

Definitely going to transfer into a large/deep training pot and get a better idea what it looks like in a couple months before I make any chopping decisions.

yes the red line seems like a good point of reduction. You can always do that, then sit back and look at it for a while and see if it feels right.
On a Hornbeam I would have absolutely no problem doing that now, but dont let me rush you
and I would do that, then I would wire the whole thing out, because there's more than enough there to set the future lines and bones. Only doing that will give you a better understanding of what looks right.

Did you see how many times I hacked this back without any mercy, before it just 'felt right' to me

Hornbeam material-The Four Brothers

European Hornbeam from hedging nursery stock, picked up march 2018 reducing at the nursery to make it more manageable 20180320_121723 by Bobby Lane, on Flickr 20180320_122923 by Bobby Lane, on Flickr 20180320_124031 by Bobby Lane, on Flickr A lot going on 20180320_160303 by Bobby Lane, on...

www.bonsainut.com

 

[BobbyLane]

One I reduced at the end of Oct and also repotted then, then changed the angle in November, literally pulled the tree back out the pot and reset it, because I'd decided on a better angle.
The styling helps me to envision its future and how I want it to look.
I used to hate wiring now I love it.
More folks should learn to love wiring. Dont see enough of it on here. The winter image of deciduous trees doesnt seem to be appreciated much by many folks. People are quick to hide everything away until summer.
Only really see Mach and a small few really focusing on this.

 

[Scrogdor]

One I reduced at the end of Oct and also repotted then, then changed the angle in November, literally pulled the tree back out the pot and reset it, because I'd decided on a better angle.
The styling helps me to envision its future and how I want it to look.
I used to hate wiring now I love it.
More folks should learn to love wiring. Dont see enough of it on here. The winter image of deciduous trees doesnt seem to be appreciated much by many folks. People are quick to hide everything away until summer.
Only really see Mach and a small few really focusing on this.

I Just bought some wire actually for this one, going to sit down this week and have a go at it. My favorite time of year is fall and winter for my trees . Partially because my deck doesn't look like a jungle, and my trees don't bother one another haha.

 

[Scrogdor]

Anyone got some good tips on getting trees out of big pots? UNFORTUNATELY, I injured my wrist pretty badly deadlifting on Friday. My plan was to lay it down, prop my feet on the rim and try to pull it out. I don't have any power tools, just a bunch of hand saws. Buds are starting to swell so my time is short. I'd love to get it out of that huge pot and into a 13.5 by 6 training pot.

P.S, I've tried just gripping it and trying to wiggle it out (Pre wrist injury), no chance it's coming out like that.

 

[Gabler]

Anyone got some good tips on getting trees out of big pots? UNFORTUNATELY, I injured my wrist pretty badly deadlifting on Friday. My plan was to lay it down, prop my feet on the rim and try to pull it out. I don't have any power tools, just a bunch of hand saws. Buds are starting to swell so my time is short. I'd love to get it out of that huge pot and into a 13.5 by 6 training pot.

P.S, I've tried just gripping it and trying to wiggle it out (Pre wrist injury), no chance it's coming out like that.

Put the plastic pot on its side and roll it back and forth while pressing down on the sides to deform the pot. You can use your feet for that. Then the pot should slide right off. Alternatively, it's just a plastic pot, so cut it off.