Fukien tree is losing all its leaves..any suggestions?

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three4rd

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Hi,

Got mine as a gift in July. When it was shipped to me, it had lost well over 200 leaves during transit (all the dead leaves were mixed in with the packaging). I figured it wouldn't even make it. Then, over the next 4-5 months it did amazingly well. Lots of new growth and some long shoots out the sides. Very green and healthy looking all summer through fall. Occasional flowers but not much. Then, starting last month I noticed a few of the oldest leaves beginning to yellow. Had to give it to a family member to take care of while we were on a vacation the past few weeks. The leaf dropping continued for her while we were away. I have it back now, but it continues to drop.

It has been living indoors in a sunroom that is full of many plants so there is abundant humidity. Large windows on all sides except north, so light is not a problem. My watering 'schedule' has basically been to water the top of the ground pretty much every day or so just with a sprayer, then without the sprayer nozzle on I add water to the pot until it starts to drip through the bottom of the pot every 3-4 days, and mist the entire plant every 5-6 days. This is approximate as I've read that you don't want to treat bonsai the same way as a houseplant with a strict routine.

The pot is also in a tray that is filled with various sized stones that I keep water in at all times. But, I make sure that the water level in the tray is below the pot drainage holes. So far I've not done any fertilizing but have begun to read up on what is recommended. From my years of experience with all sorts of plants, I deem it likely that now is not a good time to fertilize when the plant is not doing well, but if I'm wrong about this let me know. I use miracle-gro for all my houseplants but was reading that a more balanced fertilizer is appropriate for bonsai, so I was considering picking up some 10-10-10 or similar liquid food.

What to do? Is this possibly a cycle that the plant is going through? I really think it is on the way to dropping all its leaves the way it looks. Hate to lose it since it was such a nice gift from a family member. Being that I only have it since July, I've also never had it out of the pot to do anything with the roots. There is thick wire that extends out along the bottom of the pot from the drainage holes, and of course wire around the trunk underneath the surface, so quite frankly I have no idea how to even proceed once any transplanting or root trimming is needed.

This is my first bonsai so I'm a total novice. I was thrilled to see all the new growth after I got it and so figured I was doing everything right but now am not so sure how to proceed. '

Thanks and hope someone can help.


Regards,
Keith

IMG_7244.jpg
 
Can you share your location with us? Does your sunroom get cool/cold?

It is not unusual for tropicals to drop leaves during the winter / dormant months. I have ficus in my landscaping, for example, and even with the rain we've been getting in California, they have probably dropped 50% of their leaves. Just depends if we have a cold storm with a lot of wind. Same species in a sheltered area in my yard won't drop any leaves.

When I look at your tree, I don't see an immediate cause for panic, though your tree is showing leggy growth and long internodes. Fukien tea is a little touchy about its roots, and is sensitive to cold (not freezing) temps. Make sure the soil is good and that the roots never sit in standing water. If you have your tree in a sunroom with decent humidity, there is no need for a humidity tray. You don't want to create a friendly environment for mold or mildew.

You are correct you do not want to fertilize a dormant tree. You definitely don't want to fertilize a tree that is root bound or may be having root problems. Can you take a closer photo of the soil surface? The soil looks pretty good from your photo but a closer picture will give us more info.
 
Wow...that was an amazingly quick reply! Thanks! I am in zone 6 PA. Sunroom is heated. During the cooler months I have the thermostat set so it goes no lower than 58 at night. I've just always done that since we aren't out there in the evenings anyway. Not sure what you mean by "long internodes" but there is even more leggy shoots than the picture shows. After the plant revived from whatever happened in shipping that induced so much leaf drop, during the autumn months it put out these long side shoots and very little growth up from the center.

Here are two more pics. Should I expect the plant to lose all the leaves? And if it does, I assume it will put out new growth as spring approaches. .Let me know anymore suggestions you might have.

IMG_7245.jpg IMG_7246.jpg
 
Welcome Three4rd,

Even down here [ tropics ] they do rest. It is a zone 9 shrub and probably zone 10 in a pot.
They like full sun and are at times prone to aphids.

I would suggest watching the watering and no fertiliser.
Late spring. maybe an examination of the root section and find a club,
Ours are just starting to wake up. Been asleep since Christmas.
Best of growing.
Good Day
Anthony

* I suggest you take cuttings when it's healthy. Easier to learn from a group and don't experiment
on the mother.
 
Close-up looks much better! Whoever got you this tree got it from a bonsai nursery. Soil is good. Tree looks good, but leggy.

You should not expect the tree to drop all its leaves, but even if it does, it is not necessarily a cause for panic as long as the underlying conditions are good. "Long internodes" means the distance from one bud/leaf to the next. You will generally see long internodes on a tree that (1) is growing like crazy (like when you plant it in an oversized pot to get it to "bulk up" and don't trim it) (2) not getting enough light, (3) getting too much water, (4) getting too much fertilizer.

As soon as spring arrives and you start seeing the beginnings of new growth, you will want to trim back the ends of your branches so the tree shifts its energy from extending its branches to back-budding and filling out internally.
 
By the way you probably already know this but the little blue/green balls on your soil are time-release fertilizer, so your tree is already being fertilized.
 
Had no idea about the blue/green balls being fertilizer. (Now you KNOW I'm a true novice!) Would you suggest less watering now or more in its present condition? Also what about misting it with a sprayer? I've always done that every 4-5 days since I got it, but another bonsai forum told me that misting is not necessary and can actually be bad. So getting back to fertilizer...is the time-release solid type better than applying some sort of balanced liquid food? Sorry for so many questions..but I know so little. I've grown houseplants for decades with great success, but never had bonsai before. Another quick question...a guy on this other forum told me that I should stop thinking of bonsai as being an actual species, but rather that it moreso is a style of growing (?) Didn't make much sense to me.

Anthony...interesting about examining a root section. How is this done? Are you saying that I'd need to take the whole plant out of the soil? The whole thing is wired in. A wire extends around the top of the trunk, and then two wires come out the bottom of the drainage holes. I've been told I'll need to cut those. Does it all need to be re-wired back in again once taken out?

Also, I think the tree is indeed from a nursery but I know it was ordered online and then sent to me - was not picked out personally at an actual nursery. I was thinking that I probably should have cut back those long lateral shoots, but was hesitant to do anything to it, figuring that any growth is probably good growth (but then you're talking to a guy who hardly ever did any pruning on his dwarf fruit trees either). I have never had a heavy enough hand with the cutter when it comes to indoor or outdoor gardening.

So if the Fukien is a zone 9 - which appears to include central CA, the heat that I get out in the sunroom on really warm days should not be an issue. During the summer it can run up into the low 90s out there (rare but it happens at times).
 
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Since you are an experienced gardener, you will understand me when I say "let your tree be your guide" as far as watering needs go. If your tree is dormant, in a humid environment, its watering needs will be minimal - you might find you only water once per week. If it is growing during the summer, and the air is dry, you might find yourself watering daily, if not twice per day (especially if your tree is outside). Misting is not needed, but is only really bad if it contributes to overall wet conditions that contribute to excessive moss growth, or mold or mildew. I have my trees outside under an automatic sprinkling system and they get watered twice a day in the summer and don't miss a beat - and each watering their foliage gets drenched. The key is your soil. If you have good soil that is porous so that water can flow in the top and out the bottom of your pot, you can water frequently with no downside.

People have different opinions about fertilizers, and what works for some people in some situations, may not work for all. Time release fertilizer pellets can be a nice "fire and forget" method, as long as you don't over-fertilize and as long as you have open soil so any excess salts can wash out the bottom of your pot. Many people who keep bonsai prefer organic fertilizers because they are weaker and slower-acting than chemical fertilizers. It is easy to kill a bonsai by burning the roots by applying too much fertilizer too quickly. Too little is definitely much better than too much.

A Fukien Tea tree will not die from heat, but it can die from cold or from dryness. Probably not an issue in PA, but if you lived in New Mexico you wouldn't want to keep it outside during the summer without wind protection. It loves heat and humidity though. I have attached a picture of a mature Fukien Tea bonsai showing how you want to trim your tree so you eventually develop neat foliage pads. That is a subject for another day :)

8ad43e6434da710918f3d975c9fba8bc.jpg
 
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Hi Keith,

Also a true novice, but heres what i`ve got.. I would say snip that wire, pop him out and see what you`ve got going on under there. You dont have to do any work but you`ll have a better idea, or be able to show the knlolageabe guys on here.

Why i say this is, I was given a fukien tea about six weeks ago.. He was not looking happy, sort of wilting, the soil was what looked like black dirt.. So slid him out for a peep and under the soil was a fairly smelly, very compacted roots, some rotting. Immediately got him in the sink, bare rooted and trimmed.

Next couple of weeks he yellowed and dropped some leaves and pouted, as they do, but now really perking up, leaves standing to attention with new flower and leaf buds.

(Someone please point out if this is wrong:) Unless your growing something specific, Id cut the over growing new growth back to a leaf node to encourage better and more balanced growth else where on the tree.

And about fertilizing, from the other thread, well that depends on a lot of things.. depends on whats in that pot, and more :p More reading... He`ll be fine for now with the bit of slow release that's on there now.

Here he is today, looking perky:
IMG_20170223_161558.jpg
 
Victorim,

Oooh....I don't know if I'm brave enough to take this thing out of the pot! If I do, must it be rewired in? My problem is not dropping "some" leaves...rather a majority of them and apparently no end in sight. Something just doesn't seem right. The edges of the leaves are all hard - they didn't feel like that before. Guess I could do as you say but I'm afraid I might do more damage than good. I have no idea how to go about pruning roots although if it's as easy as cutting back roots from any other plant then I'm not worried about it. I've taken a knife to the roots of many a plant that has overgrown its pot! The idea of submitting a picture of what things look like on the bottom sounds like a good idea though....
 
The wire that is there was put there to hold him in place after a repot. Sounds like a while ago so he should be able to stand in his pot with out it. Thats a good sign though so he shouldn't be in mud:) don't cut anything(edit: roots) if your not comfortable, but pics would be good.
 
Is it possible to bend the wires up that are underneath the pot, and then pull them through from the top? Probably not but I'm just thinking that was it's possible, I suppose, that they could even be re-used. It looks like the wire goes around the trunk and then down through and out the bottom of the pot. What I don't want to do is mess around too much with the wires and wind up breaking the pot.
 
Sure they if they are tied underneath the wire would come out from above easy... im betting once the wire is off the roots and all the soil will be one mass, so will go back in the pot as easy as it came..
 
That would be nice...otherwise I envision the whole thing falling apart like sometimes happens when you work with houseplants...all the ground falls away and then you have this plant with bare roots. Disturbing the root system is not always the best thing, at least for the plants I'm used to working with.

I see that you are in Wales...We visited your country twice..loved it. First time we got to stay in Portmeirion..really neat especially since my wife and I have always liked the show, "The Prisoner". 2nd time we stayed at Sygun Fawr near Beddgelert in the Snowdonia area (loved all the wild rhododendrons!) and also at Llandudno. Beautiful country. I'd gladly go back again sometime!

Thanks for continued bonsai advice. I need it...
 
three4rd said:
That would be nice...otherwise I envision the whole thing falling apart like sometimes happens when you work with houseplants...all the ground falls away and then you have this plant with bare roots. Disturbing the root system is not always the best thing, at least for the plants I'm used to working with.

I see that you are in Wales...We visited your country twice..loved it. First time we got to stay in Portmeirion..really neat especially since my wife and I have always liked the show, "The Prisoner". 2nd time we stayed at Sygun Fawr near Beddgelert in the Snowdonia area (loved all the wild rhododendrons!) and also at Llandudno. Beautiful country. I'd gladly go back again sometime!

Thanks for continued bonsai advice. I need it...
Click to expand...

Kind words, and thank you. As I say, am a novice too so.. but if you free that wire and gently pull him out I think you`ll be surprised.
 
Pleasantly so I hope...lol :) Would hate to see what looks like a mass of dead roots. What do the roots of these things look like? I'm used to seeing the typical white colored roots of most houseplants.
 
Welcome to Crazy!

Sorce
 
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