Cracked Trunk while Wiring

[Shibui]

Little cuts like this one do not need sealing. The tree can manage by itself. They've been doing that for millions of years before we started pruning.

You haven't showed us the whole tree. If it is anything like most procumbens it will be way too long anyway so breaking it is probably the best thing that happened.
You have the choice to make a skinny stick in a pot 'bonsai' so that you can tell people you have a bonsai or you can follow River's Edge advice and grow it until it has a decent trunk then make a real bonsai. That could take quite a few years. The choice is up to you.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

I made a couple like these. If it's a procumbens and if the upper part doesn't die, then you're in for some serious swelling due to scar tissue.

 

[Tieball]

Alright thanks! Do you know the type of cut past I could use and also if it’s too late to use it or not? Also, how would I clean the cut because I like your idea of cleaning it and pasting it haha

I think it’s to late to use a cut paste. The damage is done. However, if you wished to try and salvage the top I’d use a raffia or nylon type tape wrap tightly wound around. Cut paste...no.
If I was cleaning an area to join together, like you have, I would use air drying...blow drying...but not hot air like from a blow dryer...the cold air setting would be better. a soft brush, like a soft paint brush, can help also. You’re trying to not damage fibers further.

What does the whole tree look like? The break could be a good thing.

 

[River's Edge]

No paste for conifers!

Nonsense! please do not substitute your opinion for fact! Just because you can choose not to use it, does not mean it is the best choice for the tree!

I accept that the tree can heal itself, and that other products can be used, but the use of the grey putty style cut paste does improve the result and the speed the healing when used with conifers. When working with show quality trees the result and the speed of healing is very important. Callus forms evenly over smooth surfaces, paste prevents the surface from drying too fast and cracking! The paste also provides protection from insects and mold on the surface. The cut paste longevity can be extended with the use of foil cover if desired. This means it does not have to be replaced so often!
I have studied with many top professionals in North America and they all use cut paste on conifers! And they all teach the use of cut paste on conifers as a way to improve the results and minimize the problems with cuts.
If one works primarily with young, immature stock than I can see less of a need for the product. However, most larger Bonsai involve sacrifice cuts of 1/12 to 3 inch diameter across, sometimes larger. Adapting techniques for faster resolution include center pegs, bridge grafts, and the use of cut paste. Larger cuts can take years to close properly eve with all the proper care.
Start now with some conifers, make larger cuts and treat them with and without cut paste! ten years from now compare the results! With the use of cut paste the wounds will heal smoother and faster every time. I work primarily with the following conifers, JBP , JRP, Hemlock, Sub Alpine Fir and Spruce. Collected and nursery developed. I do agree with your use of sealant on deciduous, with the caveat that other types of sealant have value with deciduous species. For example the liquid green sealant is more useful in wetter climates, stronger latex surface to withstand more moisture while still protecting the wound.

 

[Llamabro4]

Little cuts like this one do not need sealing. The tree can manage by itself. They've been doing that for millions of years before we started pruning.

You haven't showed us the whole tree. If it is anything like most procumbens it will be way too long anyway so breaking it is probably the best thing that happened.
You have the choice to make a skinny stick in a pot 'bonsai' so that you can tell people you have a bonsai or you can follow River's Edge advice and grow it until it has a decent trunk then make a real bonsai. That could take quite a few years. The choice is up to you.

here’s the whole thing, remember it’s my first tree so it’s looking kind of rough.The break is where I wound the black electrical tape. So, if I were to follow Rivers Edges advice, would I try to allow it to heal itself for a year or so so that it can become much taller?

 

[River's Edge]

View attachment 292492
here’s the whole thing, remember it’s my first tree so it’s looking kind of rough.The break is where I wound the black electrical tape. So, if I were to follow Rivers Edges advice, would I try to allow it to heal itself for a year or so so that it can become much taller?

g
Nope, you misunderstood my advice for someone else. I advised removing the broken top, making a clean cut ( using cut paste to seal the cut) and developing a new apical leader for taper!
Now that I see the whole tree, my advice remains the same. Actually the break is a great place to shorten the tree and change direction, as well as add taper!
You can always fo that in a few months when the top dies, as I predict it will given the break.

 

[Llamabro4]

g
Nope, you misunderstood my advice for someone else. I advised removing the broken top, making a clean cut ( using cut paste to seal the cut) and developing a new apical leader for taper!
Now that I see the whole tree, my advice remains the same. Actually the break is a great place to shorten the tree and change direction, as well as add taper!
You can always fo that in a few months when the top dies, as I predict it will given the break.

Sorry I’m still really new to a lot of the bonsai wording I guess. What do you mean by taper and what is an apical leader? Also do you know what type of paste would be good for this tree and if it’s too late or not? Thanks for the help!

 

[River's Edge]

Taper is when the tree shows a change of diameter, usually produced by cutting the trunk to allow a small branch to extend up and become the new trunk. This is referred to as an apical leader.
Cut paste usually refers to the grey putty like substance sold by Bonsai dealers for that purpose. Other products can be useful, particularly for smaller cuts. I consider your break to be a smaller cut.
You can simply remove the top, carve a flat diagonal surface away from the little branch near the break! You will get better results if you use a sharp knife and a smooth surface. Leave a bit of a stub so it is not to close to the base of the branch. ( you do not want to kill the small branch that will become the new top. If you have some wood glue then that will work for cut paste on a cut this size. Just cover the surface with wood glue and wipe off leaving a thin film.
You should be good to go at this point.
Good. Luck

 

[bonsaichile]

Sorry I’m still really new to a lot of the bonsai wording I guess. What do you mean by taper and what is an apical leader? Also do you know what type of paste would be good for this tree and if it’s too late or not? Thanks for the help!

"Taper" means that the thickness of the trunk decreases as it goes up, so the widest part is at the base and the narrowest at the top. "Apical leader" means a new leader, the upmost shoot that becomes the new section of the trunk.

 

[Llamabro4]

Taper is when the tree shows a change of diameter, usually produced by cutting the trunk to allow a small branch to extend up and become the new trunk. This is referred to as an apical leader.
Cut paste usually refers to the grey putty like substance sold by Bonsai dealers for that purpose. Other products can be useful, particularly for smaller cuts. I consider your break to be a smaller cut.
You can simply remove the top, carve a flat diagonal surface away from the little branch near the break! You will get better results if you use a sharp knife and a smooth surface. Leave a bit of a stub so it is not to close to the base of the branch. ( you do not want to kill the small branch that will become the new top. If you have some wood glue then that will work for cut paste on a cut this size. Just cover the surface with wood glue and wipe off leaving a thin film.
You should be good to go at this point.
Good. Luck

Sorry if I’m being stupid, but I take the broken part off, cut it diagonally facing down, leave a tiny nub in the middle of the cut, and cover all the remaining showing inner part of the cut top with wood glue?

 

[River's Edge]

Sorry if I’m being stupid, but I take the broken part off, cut it diagonally facing down, leave a tiny nub in the middle of the cut, and cover all the remaining showing inner part of the cut top with wood glue?

Perhaps this illustration will help. Note the line represents the cut I am describing. The top is removed . A smaller branch remains just below the cut and it grows out to become the new top. ( This is a pine but the concept is the same for shortening a tree, beginning a change of direction and introducing taper.

 

[Llamabro4]

Oohhh ok I get it now. Thanks a lot for the help and support with this y’all! I’ll try to let y’all know how the cut goes!

 

[Potawatomi13]

Welcome to sometimes crazy hobby. Please add location to profile. Do you have a nearby Bonsai Club where in person help is available?

 

[SeanS]

Could we maybe offer the OP some feedback on the rest of the wiring, apart from that around the cracked trunk?

 

[River's Edge]

Could we maybe offer the OP some feedback on the rest of the wiring, apart from that around the cracked trunk?

I am not sure that it would be helpful at this point. The individual is trying and it is best to work with the positive steps one at a time. Plenty of time to work with improving application of technique, use of correct materials, Form and effectiveness of wiring. Wiring is best taught with guided practice and repetition in my opinion. Local club member or instructor to guide the efforts.
Just my opinion from experience.

 

[Llamabro4]

Yeah my wiring is not a pretty sight haha. I was struggling a lot and I probably need some hand on help. I live in Arkansas in the United States by the way. I have no idea if there are any bonsai clubs nearby.

 

[Orion_metalhead]

I would start watching some youtube videos to learn basics about bonsai at this point. Mirai has good videos on youtube, Eisei-en, Herons Bonsai, Nigel Saunders all are good places to start with to get a good mixture of knowledge.

If this juniper is inside, I would put it outside. There is a high likelihood it will die inside.

Also, look at the trees and threads on the Juniper subforum on this site for species specific info.

I think the reason the branch broke is becausr you were using too thin guage wire. If your wire isnt strong enough to easily hold the bend, then you are not bending the wire, but bending the branch, which puts a lot of pressure on specific points in the tree instead of dispersing the pressure along the entirety of the wire.

Welcome and enjoy! Get some more trees to work on too.

 

[Llamabro4]

I would start watching some youtube videos to learn basics about bonsai at this point. Mirai has good videos on youtube, Eisei-en, Herons Bonsai, Nigel Saunders all are good places to start with to get a good mixture of knowledge.

If this juniper is inside, I would put it outside. There is a high likelihood it will die inside.

Also, look at the trees and threads on the Juniper subforum on this site for species specific info.

I think the reason the branch broke is becausr you were using too thin guage wire. If your wire isnt strong enough to easily hold the bend, then you are not bending the wire, but bending the branch, which puts a lot of pressure on specific points in the tree instead of dispersing the pressure along the entirety of the wire.

Welcome and enjoy! Get some more trees to work on too.

Yeah I have been watching a lot of YouTube videos but this forum has helped me a lot as well. I also attempted using a 9 gauge wire instead of the 14 gauge I used, but the 9 gauge was almost impossible to work with. Any suggestions?

 

[bonsaichile]

Yeah I have been watching a lot of YouTube videos but this forum has helped me a lot as well. I also attempted using a 9 gauge wire instead of the 14 gauge I used, but the 9 gauge was almost impossible to work with. Any suggestions?

Get annealed cupper. Whatever you are using is probablt not pliable enough

 

[Forsoothe!]

Yeah my wiring is not a pretty sight haha. I was struggling a lot and I probably need some hand on help. I live in Arkansas in the United States by the way. I have no idea if there are any bonsai clubs nearby.

Seek, and ye shall find.