Considerations in buying and estimating the value of a Bonsai

[Yaoshi]

Good Day Bonsai-friends,

I am new here therefore I would like to introduce me, hello I am Yaoshi, and express my gratitude for everyone willing to help me.

I am going to buy a specific Bonsai, which I saw in a nursery. Before I am going to do that I was wondering if you could give me some general guidelines what I should ask and consider when buying the tree.

Also I was wondering if you experts would be so kind to estimate the value of the tree.

The tree is a chinese Elm
The soil is mainly "soil" the standard used for flowers, no akadama or anything like that.
The Tree was about 1meter 40inches high.
The pot seemed rather cheap.
The tree itself seemed to have a nice structure (formal upright).
The main cuts seemed to have sealed nicely.


I will post pictures and lot more information soon so that you can estimate the value of the tree.
Thank you very much indeed.

 

[Poink88]

Price or value of a bonsai depends on MANY factors and ultimately it is your taste and pocket (dispensable $$$$) that will decide of it's worth.

Some factors;
- your location (please update your profile w/ this)
- design aesthetics
- proportions
- taper
- branch development
- trunk
- nebari
- bark
- health
- age
- etc.

Based on your initial input...value could be $25.00 to $1,000.00 (or more).

 

[M. Frary]

Hate to answer questions with questions but....
Is this nursery a bonsai nursery? If it is I wouldn't think it would be in regular soil.(Like they use for flowers as you say.)
Will this be your first bonsai? If so good first choice on the elm. If not still good choice. I have close to 20 in different stages of development.
It sounds like it's tall(40" is tall) . Is the trunk in proportion? At that height it should be 5"" to 7" at the base.
Really I'm just typing for the fun till we see the tree.

 

[Adair M]

The location is very important.

An incredible (for us in the USA) Japanese Black Pine may sell for $3000 in the USA. In Japan, that same tree may sell for $300.

The value of anything is what a buyer is willing to pay for it.

 

[Mac In Oak Ridge]

I go by one consideration. Will I ever see this tree again?

That's it, all that is necessary for a decision. If it is good and you are confident in your ability to care for and develop it, go for it. If there are dozens just like it in the area then start looking for a bargain.

 

[Yaoshi]

Pictures

Thank you very much indeed for your considerations.

Here I have pictures that should help in your estimation.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/h7q2xzxin7lz3d4/AACCsolwJg0bkdIbFgxBR9Qya

 

[Yaoshi]

Unfortunately the pictures are not the best but I hope you can get a certain idea of what the Bonsai is and looks.
I believe it is a Ficus and "refined" with chinese elm cuttings.
The sell it for 750 dollars.

Sorry if I did not answer before but I broke my hand and hence couldn't type.

Please let me know how much you think this tree is worth.
Thank you

 

[Poink88]

I believe it is a Ficus and "refined" with chinese elm cuttings.
The sell it for 750 dollars.

No. I think you are confused or misinformed about how grafting works. You cannot graft another family of plant unto another...i.e. elm to ficus.

Again depending on where you are and other factors I listed--the value varies, but I won't pay more than $150 for that Chinese elm.

 

[Zach Smith]

Unfortunately the pictures are not the best but I hope you can get a certain idea of what the Bonsai is and looks.
I believe it is a Ficus and "refined" with chinese elm cuttings.
The sell it for 750 dollars.

Sorry if I did not answer before but I broke my hand and hence couldn't type.

Please let me know how much you think this tree is worth.
Thank you

The tree is a mature Chinese elm, not a ficus. As a bonsai it has been neglected, but appears to have solid potential for someone with the appropriate skills and willing to put in the time to bring it back into good condition. Given the size, age and potential quality, I think the price is fair.

Zach

 

[GrimLore]

At that size, if you know the Species and are willing to spend a LOT of time on it I would offer no more then 600 including shipping... It is probably worth 750 but it needs a lot of TLC.

Grimmy

 

[Sekibonsai]

I agree, there is potential in there and I think the price is not bad but a bit on the high side. That is more like a "finished" price in my opinion.

 

[Yaoshi]

Thank you for your answers.
If I decide to buy it, I will post pictures.

 

[A Random User]

The tree is a mature Chinese elm, not a ficus. As a bonsai it has been neglected, but appears to have solid potential for someone with the appropriate skills and willing to put in the time to bring it back into good condition. Given the size, age and potential quality, I think the price is fair.

Zach

I agree with Zach, and second what he says, price is fair.
It is not a tree worth $150 as some of the others might have suggested,
But if it was it would be a quarter of the size, and would take years
To develop. Cool thing about this being allowed to run wild is that
You will not have to wait as long to get the pom pom look out of
The tree as you would normally. With that said the roots probably are
A mess and will need to be ruduced, when the foliage is reduced.

 

[Poink88]

...I won't pay more than $150 for that Chinese elm.

...It is not a $150 as some of the others might have suggested,...

It is okay, you can say my name as the one who said it, I don't bite (or are you hoping I would?). It plainly is what I am willing to pay for it as Adair M posted.

...The value of anything is what a buyer is willing to pay for it.

Why? Because I do not see the value in it. I have access to free materials that are better (granted not Chinese Elm but Elms none the less). I can also buy from my favorite nursery a better tree (again not Chinese Elm) for much less. The factors are all part of my my first response (post #2).

 

[A Random User]

It is okay, you can say my name as the one who said it, I don't bite (or are you hoping I would?). It plainly is what I am willing to pay for it as Adair M posted.



Why? Because I do not see the value in it. I have access to free materials that are better (granted not Chinese Elm but Elms none the less). I can also buy from my favorite nursery a better tree (again not Chinese Elm) for much less. The factors are all part of my my first response (post #2).

You made me realize that I left out the words "tree worth" in my post...
I will fix it...
thanks

 

[Vance Wood]

I am not known for tip-toeing through the Tulips so here it is straight up room temperature.

At the point in time I looked at the link there were these assorted windows with trunk pictures of assorted trees not similar enough to be the same tree. If you are purchasing this tree on-line or through the mail I would resist the urge to spend that sum of money for two reasons: One are you certain you are going to get what you pay for; and Two: From some of the things you have said specifically the confusion between Chines Elm and Ficus and the grafting issue I am concerned that you do not have the experience or knowledge to keep this tree alive for more than a couple of months----maybe?

All that being said it is your money and you can spend it how you want.

 

[michaelj]

I've seen weaker material offered for sale for more than $150 at bonsai nurseries, but I agree that I wouldn't pay that much for this tree.

 

[Yaoshi]

A few clarification:

1. The Bonsai i from a Nursery near where I live, not from an online store.
2. I don't understand why some of you tell that grafts cannot be done between different species. Aren't white pines grafted on black pine species.
Also I am pretty sure that the "main" part is ficus as here in Italy many nurseries sell these plants: Ficus with elm-branches grafted onto it. Please do enlighten me with your knowledge. Yes I did read many books, but I consider myself as a blood beginner as I have been in this beautiful hobby for only a year. Hence I hope you can excuse my ignorance and teach me.

 

[Poink88]

I believe it is a Ficus and "refined" with chinese elm cuttings.

No. I think you are confused or misinformed about how grafting works. You cannot graft another family of plant unto another...i.e. elm to ficus.

2. I don't understand why some of you tell that grafts cannot be done between different species. Aren't white pines grafted on black pine species.
Also I am pretty sure that the "main" part is ficus as here in Italy many nurseries sell these plants: Ficus with elm-branches grafted onto it. Please do enlighten me with your knowledge. Yes I did read many books, but I consider myself as a blood beginner as I have been in this beautiful hobby for only a year. Hence I hope you can excuse my ignorance and teach me.

Read my response again.

You can graft different species (JBP to JWP) BUT NOT different family (elm to ficus)...you do not believe me, go ahead and try.

It is like breeding lion and tigers (works) but you cannot breed lion with dogs.

 

[Yaoshi]

Read my response again.

You can graft different species (JBP to JWP) BUT NOT different family (elm to ficus)...you do not believe me, go ahead and try.

It is like breeding lion and tigers (works) but you cannot breed lion with dogs.

Thank you for teaching me.
I apologize if you felt like I did not believe you or say you were wrong. I just did not know better and asked for clarification. Thank you