Conceptual Styling: Reverse Taper Trunk

[Woodland Spirit]

One thing I'll add, I was at the hospital today and every tree I could see from the window except one had either reverse taper or straight trunk. No full size tree in sight looked anything like the bonsai here.

Just a thought to stir things up a bit.

Hehe

 

[A Random User]

I want to propose a concept. If say one should come across a very nice yamadori, showing great promise; however, has a reverse tapered trunk. You collect it grow it in a box but now you have to figure out a way to fix the taper. How would one go about fixing that? I did some research and there have been several who would suggest performing an invasive procedure to widen the trunk through brute force. I've seen a video where an owner would first use a chain saw to get the initial cut and then from there, he used wooden wedges to drive the trunk apart until the base is wider than the widest part of the trunk. I assume later on he will be inserting some sort of rock to create a root/trunk over rock thing going on. It looks pretty ugly to me, using that method. The other option was to air layer it. My understanding would be to air layer half of this and you'll get two trees basically. Any thoughts?

View attachment 91236

Do you have a tree with such a problem? or are we talking hypotheticals?
If you have one, post it up.

The tree in this thread had some similar issues...
http://www.bonsainut.com/threads/elephant-foot-maple.21058/

However one also has to understand that if you are talking about possible reverse taper at the top of the trunk where all your branches originate from, then as the trunk turns into the branches, making up the continuation of the trunk, it is going to get bigger... this is a perfectly acceptable scenario of what a tree does. Now if your tree looks like a snake that just swallowed a bowling ball, you are in trouble, and would suggest air layer, or just a chop.

I have had instances in which a student has brought in a tree, where at one time they had an area where there was multiple branches originating from a point, and they have decided they want to eliminate all down to two, but if they do they will be left with a bulge. In this case, I showed them if they are careful when deciding which two they want to keep... They can actual resolve the taper issue, by carving out the center between the two of the bulge. Thus turning one large mass into two smaller one's with space between, and making the split between the two start lower down.

 

[Woodland Spirit]

Just turn it upsidedown.


Sorry I couldn't resist.

It's one of those days where you have to make jokes or you'll be board to death.

 

[lieuz]

@sawgrass this is purely hypothetical. I don't own a tree with a reverse taper.

 

[MattE]

Ugly/ pretty are relative and subjective. People posting pics of trees on a public forum or putting them in a show are opening their trees up for comment and some people will like them, some won't generally... Doesn't mean you can't do it or shouldn't do it, but if you are doing something non-traditional/ UGLY... There is a difference between people who do it after mastering bonsai and then taking the basics one step further, breaking "rules" and creating art... Ad someone who just has no idea what they are doing, sticks an ugly tree Ina pot and calls it a bonsai... It can take a while to differentiate between the two. Doesn't mean the guy who has no clue what he is doing shouldn't do it... But if he is going to do it, knowing he has no clue what he is doin, and open it for comment, then he should not get offended if people do not have nice things to say or recommend changes they think would make the tree better.

I think what is commonly mistaken for snobs and condescending comments by people new to bonsai/ Bonsainut, is USUALLY a well meaning more experienced person trying to get someone with no clue to understand what they can do to make a tree better and why people might be reacting negatively to it.

I see what you did there ! Lol I am new yes but like I said after reading a lot on this site it just seems like people argue ...a lot . I can see if you are entering it into a show to be traditional as your gonna get judged on it ..all I meant is a lot of people seem to think they are bonsai experts . Which Im sure many of you are I just read some where that you should let the tree tell you what and how to make it and if the tree was born a reverse tapper well then make the nicest reverse tapper broom or cascade ect you can !

 

[sorce]

well then make the nicest reverse tapper broom or cascade ect you can !

No.

Sorce

 

[MattE]

Fine throw it out lol

 

[M. Frary]

We don't argue.
We have spirited discussions.

 

[sorce]

I spy.....

The Ya, the Ma, or the Ha.

Of a Logo.....

Do you?

Sorce

 

[armetisius]

The level of perfection in the practice is only defined by the practitioner themselves.

I can learn to winter a shitty base.
I can learn to wire on any branch of that particular species that has twigs the size of the practice I seek.
I can learn closer to exactly when to dig any prize specimen, by first digging shitty ones every week of the year. Albeit, size age, location, weather, moon, etc.,must be similar, or discounted when noted different.
I can learn if a trunk chop is successful on a species, and better the understanding, of how, when, why, and where, in increasing increments with the more shitty material I practice on.
I would rather learn how to
"Bend it till right before it cracks"
On shitty material.
I can practice wiring into a bonsai pot with shitty material.

I don't mind killing trees....
But I'm only gonna kill shitty ones...

Though, as I've said before, this games challenges are infinite.

I can highly increase my chances of success by doing everything I will ever need to do to shitty material....

Before I do it to good material...

That's why as well, I feel like Gary Woods idea of this, "keep potential problems at bay"....or PPB, as I call it, is so important.

This, PPB, should be the first thing learned, in this LONG game. Years of PPB is 90% of the time, beneficial. As in, we are letting the tree grow!

While newbs are doing this(PPB)with "good material", because they don't know how to do one of any task they come ask about, be it wiring, repotting, chopping.....

They should practice on shitty material.

All we can ever do it question.....
What is your microclimate like....
Forever.....

When they can take shitty versions of their good, in PPB, material, and get CORRECT answers under their Sun, with their rain, their soil, there clean or unclean, sharp or dull tools.

Otherwise people are like....

Why did my tree die?
You said I could cut it.....

But chyo sheers was dirty boy!

Sorce

Glad you made this post on Sunday;
AMEN!

 

[Woodland Spirit]

We don't argue.
We have spirited discussions.

Fight nice everyone. Fight nice.
Only one person screaming at a time.

@armetisius

Amen!
I don't know what I'm saying amen to.
I just feel compelled to shout amen when I hear someone else say it.