Cascade Nishiki Matsu - Where to go

[Clicio]

This is a young cork bark JBP that is healthily hanging from its terracota training pot.
Doesn't look like a really beautiful cascade right now, any suggestions?

 

[JosephCooper]

I think you need more branching in the top, and in general.

The cascade needs more movement as well.

How big are you planning it to be?

 

[Clicio]

How big are you planning it to be?

Not much bigger than that, as corkbarks need time to thicken (this trunk is still very thin) and the needles will have to be reduced. So a komono size probably.

 

[Clicio]

I think you need more branching in the top, and in general.
The cascade needs more movement as well.

Ramification, you mean? I'm working on that.
Takes time...
As for the movement, I guess I could wire it. I have been avoiding wires at the moment because it has some very ugly bite marks at the trunk, and I'm hoping they will heal with some free growth. I could be wrong of course.

 

[Dorky_gearhead]

With a cascade in training, would there be any benifit in keeping the tree at an angle, so the plant thinks it's growing upwards?

 

[Clicio]

With a cascade in training, would there be any benifit in keeping the tree at an angle, so the plant thinks it's growing upwards?

Well, the answer is "I don't know ".
I've been keeping the pot level, and the tree is not changing position by itself . It's been almost one year since i got it, so if it works (masters please advise!) I am willing to try.

 

[garywood]

C, your tree is young. Plan now for the future tree. The curve is monotonous so I would address that first. The hanging branch and the vertical branch opposite is the future tree. The extension from that point can be used for sacrifice to thicken and improve bark. This fall do regular needle work on keeper parts of the future tree and let the sacrifice grow. Leave all the needles on the extension bud on the cascade branch. A couple of years of good growing and it will be a nice little tree.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Very base has reverse taper. Suggesstion is to wrap tightly down into soil(just reverse section)with wire and leave in tree. Will expand and make more interesting. Make coils slightly farther apart as present wrap too close together. Ideas for adding movement NOW good advise.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Some including Masters keep tree at funny angle during non display season. Two problems: How to water and Roots grow toward earth gravity instead of pot bottom. Up to grower. Generally energy management used instead of angle change.

 

[sorce]

It's been said that wiring the tips up keeps them stronger.
Haven't seen it true myself but it sounds good.

Either way, if safe to do so, I would get that keeper cascade part a little more exposed to sun, it looks weaker but should be stronger.

Nice....

I like this...

Very base has reverse taper. Suggesstion is to wrap tightly down into soil(just reverse section)with wire and leave in tree.

But I have to ponder if that wouldn't actually delay corking there, making the RT worse.

All corkers are RT anyway...

Sorce

 

[Clicio]

The hanging branch and the vertical branch opposite is the future tree. The extension from that point can be used for sacrifice to thicken and improve bark. A couple of years of good growing and it will be a nice little tree.

@garywood Thanks for the tips! Good point about the sacrifice branch to improve taper, I hope it works with this trunk.

 

[Clicio]

Very base has reverse taper. Suggesstion is to wrap tightly down into soil(just reverse section)with wire and leave in tree.

@Potawatomi13 Let me see if I understood it right. Are you suggesting a torniquet around the lower trunk and then bury it? Have you tried it?

 

[Clicio]

It's been said that wiring the tips up keeps them stronger.

Will do it soon!

All corkers are RT anyway...
Sorce

Hummmpf... IF we can do anything to disguise it would be better, isn't it?
Thanks, @sorce !

 

[sorce]

Hummmpf... IF we can do anything to disguise it would be better, isn't it?
Thanks, @sorce !

Amen! "First ever" is always goal!
Even if this "first ever" may just be my first ever seeing one!

I was hollering at @Fish Tank about his embedded wire....

I do think it can work....

But it has to be well thought out and well observed.

Sorce

 

[Clicio]

I was hollering at @Fish Tank about his embedded wire....
I do think it can work....

There's ONE thing I don't want to happen:
A thick corkbark trunk on a dead tree.

Fearless and sorry or fearful and alive?
YOU tell me!

 

[sorce]

YOU tell me

Perfectly balanced!

Sorce

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Very base has reverse taper. Suggesstion is to wrap tightly down into soil(just reverse section)with wire and leave in tree. Will expand and make more interesting. Make coils slightly farther apart as present wrap too close together. Ideas for adding movement NOW good advise.

I would not recommend using this technique. The change where the reverse taper occurs is the graft union. This is a young tree, likely no more than 2 or 3 years from bring grafted. The union is brittle. Attempting to apply wire at that point runs the risk of cracking, breaking or separating the graft union. Graft unions will superficially heal the first year, but they often will not be completely fused for upwards of 10 years. Do not try this wire technique, as you will have a high probability of killing your tree.

If it were mine, after the graft was more than 5 years old, I would simply use a deep enough pot that I could bury the graft union about 1 to cm below the surface of the potting media. Since you are going for a cascade, the deeper pot will not be an issue.

Cork bark Japanese black pines are much less vigorous than the normal form of JBP. Do not be too aggressive with applying techniques. I only de-candle my cork barks once every 3 years on the average. Keep more needles than you would on a normal JBP.

 

[Clicio]

I would not recommend using this technique. Do not try this wire technique, as you will have a high probability of killing your tree. Do not be too aggressive with applying techniques.

@Leo in N E Illinois - Thanks for the very useful info. That was my feeling also, so I'll go slowly with this one.

 

[Potawatomi13]

@Potawatomi13 Let me see if I understood it right. Are you suggesting a torniquet around the lower trunk and then bury it? Have you tried it?

NO! Spiral wire as normally but anchor end to grow into tree permanently.

 

[Paulpash]

Didn't anyone else notice the pot? How the heck is this tree going to be removed when it needs root pruning? You'll have a smashing time!

Why not use a pond basket or colander for additional drainage and getting a compact root system?

Pines are tough trees to bonsai if you are just starting this hobby. Try and get hands on advice if you can by a person who is proficient in jbp in your area.