Another New Project

[A Random User]

Here is another new project I recently acquired at our annual Florida Convention.
I traded some of my art for it... as some of you might know I do Chinese Brush
Painting on scrolls and rice paper... One of the other vendors was very eager to
aquire some of it, and even more eager to trade , So I did...

He had this thing that no body wanted leaned up against the wall... It was about
6 ft tall, and had a inch and a half thick leader that shot straight up from the main
trunk about 3 ft, which I have removed and I'm making a cutting from. Sorry, I didn't get
any photo of it which it still on. I gotta say though, he had really good prices on his
Raintrees, especially since the price of a decent size trunk now has gone through the roof !!!

I have never own one of these, had alot of chances when prices were cheap, but passed...
So, I thought I would take a chance with this one, seeing that I saw something that I
think most did not... that being the unique character of it's shape...

Plans are, to do a flat top with it, treating the two trunks as individual trees... so in
essence there will be two flat tops, the smaller trunk lower down... One more thing, there
were alot of really bad chops to this tree, so I cleaned them all up and sealed them with cut
paste...

 

[Adair M]

I have a question...

When you say "flat top", are you meaning the kind of flat top that bald cypress get?

If so, then I'm not so sure a "flat top lower down" makes sense. Reason being, I'm thinking the flat top develops as that is as high as the tree can grow. It can't pull water from the roots any higher, so it flattens out, and builds the chacteristic flat broad crown. All the trees of the same species develop flat tops at about the same height off the ground.

So why would a shorter tree develop a "flat top" at a lower height?

 

[A Random User]

I have a question...

When you say "flat top", are you meaning the kind of flat top that bald cypress get?

If so, then I'm not so sure a "flat top lower down" makes sense. Reason being, I'm thinking the flat top develops as that is as high as the tree can grow. It can't pull water from the roots any higher, so it flattens out, and builds the chacteristic flat broad crown. All the trees of the same species develop flat tops at about the same height off the ground.

So why would a shorter tree develop a "flat top" at a lower height?

Thanks for the question...
With the raintrees they are often styled down here in a "flattop" fashion...
But not so much as a Cypress does, instead more in the fashion of the
Acacia trees in Africa.
Here are a couple of examples... if you do an internet search, you will find
plenty more, and they are quite awesome to look at. Also, do a search of
Erik Wigert's Flattop Raintree and you will see what I am talking about.
(sorry, don't want to post Erik's tree)

 

[Adair M]

So since this is a twin trunk, you're thinking along the lines of the second and/or fifth picture?

 

[A Random User]

So since this is a twin trunk, you're thinking along the lines of the second and/or fifth picture?

Yes, the Acacia trees will often times actually have multiple trunks coming out
of one base. The one's I posted were more to show the "flat-top"...

I did a quick virt of what it might end up looking like...

 

[Poink88]

Thanks for the virt. I honestly did not see where you will take the original pics. It makes better sense now and sure is a nice goal to shoot for.

I am also a sucker for the African savannah flat top acacia.

 

[Adair M]

That's what I thought you had in mind.

But why would a twin trunk tree form a flat top at a lower height than the full height it could grow to?

From what I'm given to understand, flat tops form because the tree cannot push sap any higher. But on a twin trunk tree, each trunk should be able to push sap up an equal height.

I just don't think the image you're envisioning is realistic. I'm not saying you can't do it, you can. But would it look realistic?

 

[Smoke]

That's what I thought you had in mind.

But why would a twin trunk tree form a flat top at a lower height than the full height it could grow to?

From what I'm given to understand, flat tops form because the tree cannot push sap any higher. But on a twin trunk tree, each trunk should be able to push sap up an equal height.

I just don't think the image you're envisioning is realistic. I'm not saying you can't do it, you can. But would it look realistic?

Where is it written that art must be realistic?

Can't a bonsai be stylistic, parodoxal or whimsical?

While I can fully appreciate a bonsai the looks like a tree, I can also appereciate a stylistic version of a tree from nature, placing more emphasis on the artistic merit rather than conforming to realistic ideals.......

They each carry weight.

A painting by Pollack and Remington. Which one is more "realistic".

The Pollack is realistic because it is paint on a canvas, thus a painting. True art in it's sense.

The Remington is realistic, because it depicts real life on the range with anatomically correct images of horsees and humans. Again true art in its own sense.

Just because someone constructs art in their own way and it does not conform to "your" sense of art because it is not realistic, does not diminish the work. Only for you.

Of course if he does crappy Pierneef bonsai then that is just crap no matter what the criteria.

 

[Dan W.]

I love where you're going with this tree! Please keep us updated as you develop it.

Thank you Smoke. I agree fully, both realistic and abstract are simply categories in the realm of art. Art would suck if we could only use creativity or logic exclusively.

 

[A Random User]

That's what I thought you had in mind.

But why would a twin trunk tree form a flat top at a lower height than the full height it could grow to?

From what I'm given to understand, flat tops form because the tree cannot push sap any higher. But on a twin trunk tree, each trunk should be able to push sap up an equal height.

I just don't think the image you're envisioning is realistic. I'm not saying you can't do it, you can. But would it look realistic?

I understand your point and agree with you that maybe the design of the tree I have
envisioned might not actually happen in nature... so therefore it might not necessarily be
realistic...

In Theory, I would agree with you... But let us not forget that we are not making an
"actual" tree, for if I was, it would be a little taller than 3 feet. We as Bonsai Artist
are making an "Artistic interpretation" of a tree... that just like with any art hopefully
portrays feelings-emotions, and stirs the imagination... Now how good of an artist would
I be, if I made a very realistic, yet boring tree ???

So, in the interest of making a good Bonsai, I feel that two tops would add much more
interest to the tree. Not only will it give a better feeling of depth and perspective...
But, most importantly, it gives a feeling of interaction between the two trees...
It portrays feelings... Making them 2 separate beings reacting to each other in a
single composition...

 

[A Random User]

Where is it written that art must be realistic?

Can't a bonsai be stylistic, parodoxal or whimsical?

While I can fully appreciate a bonsai the looks like a tree, I can also appereciate a stylistic version of a tree from nature, placing more emphasis on the artistic merit rather than conforming to realistic ideals.......

They each carry weight.

A painting by Pollack and Remington. Which one is more "realistic".

The Pollack is realistic because it is paint on a canvas, thus a painting. True art in it's sense.

The Remington is realistic, because it depicts real life on the range with anatomically correct images of horsees and humans. Again true art in its own sense.

Just because someone constructs art in their own way and it does not conform to "your" sense of art because it is not realistic, does not diminish the work. Only for you.

Of course if he does crappy Pierneef bonsai then that is just crap no matter what the criteria.

Thanks for the post...
I appreciate it !!!
I will do my best to not do crap !!!

 

[A Random User]

Just thought I would post an update of this tree 2 months later...
It's been enjoying our Florida Sunshine !!!

 

[Poink88]

Nice. Have you considered lowering a bit the top left branch of the smaller trunk?

 

[A Random User]

Nice. Have you considered lowering a bit the top left branch of the smaller trunk?

Not, exactly sure which branch you are referring too ?
If you go back and look at the first pics posted in the initial
thread post, you will see better the branch placement and what
I have done... Perhaps this might answer your question ?

 

[KennedyMarx]

Looks good. From the thumbnail, I thought you had made another virt.

 

[A Random User]

Looks good. From the thumbnail, I thought you had made another virt.

It is not going to take me very long to get the flat top pads that I want
for the design of this tree... But what nobody is going to see is the years of
developing the branch structure within that flat top... for it will always look
pretty much the same.